Why no GT's at Croft this year (again!)
Discussion
Ahonen said:
True, but you have the same power as us and carry around 250kg less weight! I reckon that makes a bit of a difference...
That's true, plus we carry very little fuel. I had always assumed that the GTs were the fastest of the sports cars series. It came as something of a surprise to me to learn how quick the Tuscans are.
Ahonen said:
Mind you, it amazes me how fast Tuscan Challenge cars get around circuits - they always look truly evil to drive and a take my hat off to their drivers.
They really aren't that bad! In fact I'd go further and say they are quite nice to drive - its getting that last second or two a lap out of one that is difficult.
The car tells you when it is going to oversteer and provided you keep your foot in and get the lock on quick, it gathers itself up and grips.
I love mine, and have fond memories of applying full lock in 4th gear going round Church at Thruxton last year.
They are massive fun to drive
There's nothing that says the GT's must race at Croft on May 1st is there?
Why don't they make it a date more suitable as to not clash with other commitments?
It's bad enough that the British GT series doesn't have GT1's or GT2's anymore.... having all the races in the south of England is making this series very hard to keep my interest in.
Why don't they make it a date more suitable as to not clash with other commitments?
It's bad enough that the British GT series doesn't have GT1's or GT2's anymore.... having all the races in the south of England is making this series very hard to keep my interest in.
wolverine said:Understand the point, but as GT and F3 are linked (for commercial reasons), then it is unlikely that the organisers would justfiy two visits to the same circuit unless it is one of the major ones.
There's nothing that says the GT's must race at Croft on May 1st is there?
Why don't they make it a date more suitable as to not clash with other commitments?
It's bad enough that the British GT series doesn't have GT1's or GT2's anymore.... having all the races in the south of England is making this series very hard to keep my interest in.
The F3 boys go to Silverstone twice for instance, and are only joined by the GT drivers on the second visit. I can't see this happening at the smaller circuits.
I think that the main problem this year is that all of the 'northern' races are at the start of the season.
We are at most of the F3 meets and have Donnington, Silverstone and Croft at the start of the season, then Thruxton (x2), Brands and Castle Combe at the end. Would have been nice to mix it up a bit.
wolverine said:
There's nothing that says the GT's must race at Croft on May 1st is there?
Why don't they make it a date more suitable as to not clash with other commitments?...
True there isn't, but what the organisers have tried to do is avoid clashes of the big series at neighbouring tracks (within 100 miles), and with the FIA-GT/Spa 24hours/FFSA and LMES (same organiser)/Le Mans then you realise how tight the calendar is.
The SRO have mixed the GT series up so teams could cherrypick events if they want to.
Doesn't this make for the series being thin on the ground at some events then? ie. if there are other events near to a race weekend in the UK then would there not be many cars on the grid in the british series?
I used to be a massive fan of GT racing in the UK, I loved going to see the GT1 cars blast round circuits. Then I thought I'd miss the sound and BHP when they got rid of GT1 and left GT2's to race. The arrival of the Speed12 saw to it that the series still had the excitement level. But then when they got rid of GT2 and effectively left GT3 clas cars to race it seems like the series is constantly shooting itself in the feet.
It would be good to see the organisers bring back GT2 at least and then split the GT3 cars into their own race on the same day etc. I think some of the cars that are racing these days are more touring cars than GT cars.
Anyway thats my grip out of the road.
Hopefully the british series can sort itself out and bring back a good calender so that it reaches the WHOLE of the UK (makes sense f they call it the BRITISH GT cahmpionship).
I used to be a massive fan of GT racing in the UK, I loved going to see the GT1 cars blast round circuits. Then I thought I'd miss the sound and BHP when they got rid of GT1 and left GT2's to race. The arrival of the Speed12 saw to it that the series still had the excitement level. But then when they got rid of GT2 and effectively left GT3 clas cars to race it seems like the series is constantly shooting itself in the feet.
It would be good to see the organisers bring back GT2 at least and then split the GT3 cars into their own race on the same day etc. I think some of the cars that are racing these days are more touring cars than GT cars.
Anyway thats my grip out of the road.
Hopefully the british series can sort itself out and bring back a good calender so that it reaches the WHOLE of the UK (makes sense f they call it the BRITISH GT cahmpionship).
Wolverine
Whilst I agree with you that there are circuits that probably should be on the calendar I fundamentally disagree that the Brit GTs are any less entertaining in the current format -
We had two fantastic races at Donington over the weekend, the second in particular was one of the best GT races I have ever seen.
I too would like to see the GT2 (GTS) cars back, and in all likelihood we will see them back in the future, but the fact is that the N-GT teams for 2004 have raised the bar considerably and many of DSC Cup class teams too are extraordinarily professional.
With the driver line-ups we've got this year too 2004 should be an absolute classic.
Whilst I agree with you that there are circuits that probably should be on the calendar I fundamentally disagree that the Brit GTs are any less entertaining in the current format -
We had two fantastic races at Donington over the weekend, the second in particular was one of the best GT races I have ever seen.
I too would like to see the GT2 (GTS) cars back, and in all likelihood we will see them back in the future, but the fact is that the N-GT teams for 2004 have raised the bar considerably and many of DSC Cup class teams too are extraordinarily professional.
With the driver line-ups we've got this year too 2004 should be an absolute classic.
Absolutely right, Graham. Both the size and variety of the grid at Donington was exciting enough, let alone the races themselves. Trouble is, living in the Westcountry, anything further than Bristol is the frozen north to me! It's all a matter of perspective, everything is 'up-country' from here but despite that I managed to find Donington on Saturday, will be at Mondello next month and may venture as far as Oulton later in the year. Not bad for a bumpkin
wolverine said:
I used to be a massive fan of GT racing in the UK, I loved going to see the GT1 cars blast round circuits. Then I thought I'd miss the sound and BHP when they got rid of GT1 and left GT2's to race. The arrival of the Speed12 saw to it that the series still had the excitement level. But then when they got rid of GT2 and effectively left GT3 clas cars to race it seems like the series is constantly shooting itself in the feet.
It would be good to see the organisers bring back GT2 at least and then split the GT3 cars into their own race on the same day etc. I think some of the cars that are racing these days are more touring cars than GT cars.
Anyway thats my grip out of the road.
<sigh> Sounds like someone who has not attented a GT race over the last two seasons and actually seen wheel to wheel 'racing' in the British GT CHampionship.
Had you been to Donington at the weekend you would have seen possibly the best two GT races the CHampionship has had in the last 5-6 years! Just because the GT2 and GT1 cars are no longer there doesn't mean the racing gets worse, in actualy fact its got better! When there was just three front running GT cars a few years ago it was boring. Sorry, but three GT2 cars does not a GT race (or championship) make. A field of 30+ N-GT and Cup class cars did last weekend.
There isn't the interest or the money around to run GT2 (let alone GT1) machinery, at least this year anyway. The GT (GT2) class was in place this year and they didn't get above three entries, so it was put on the back burner.
Just enjoy what we've got and support it.That way, with more punters enjoying the racing, the liklihood of the GT2 cars coming bak again might be sooner rather than later.
<end sigh>
Racefan_uk said:
...Had you been to Donington at the weekend you would have seen possibly the best two GT races the CHampionship has had in the last 5-6 years!...
The original point of the thread is the non-appearance at Croft (or elsewhere). I would love to go to Donnington, but a 600 mile round trip is a little problematic. The two nearest circuits to me are Knockhill and Croft - and they're not appearing there. They were at Knockhill last year, and at both circuits the year before...
They could just run 10 rounds all at Donnington, and then none of the teams would need to worry about travelling at all! Yeah I take all your points about there being a deminishing grid when the GT1's & GT2's were racing, but each year the rules and car specs seemed to change leaving new prospective teams not knowing if they could enter their car for the next year's championship and therefore leaving the british scene to race in europe where the entry specs were much more consistent.
True enough the GT1's were very expensive but it drew in the crowds who were amazed by the looks, the power etc. TV voerage in those days is nowhere near as good as it is today, maybe a ggod time to propose a new GT1 entry in the British GT. This would be great as no other race series includes GT1 class with them being the top class in a race event. I know the ALMS has fast spec cars but these are open top prototypes which in my view should be their own separate race seires altogether. They aren't GT cars they are GT formula cars IMO.
But back to the original question... it may also be a good idea to break away from the F3 partnership if GT races can olny take place on similar dates and venues etc.
Oh yeah, final point (oh no I hear you say!) .... I am glad to hear that the racing action was good to watch at Donington! I will be watching it on TV when it is aired. Just imagine how good it could be with GT2 (or GT1) cars back in action!!
True enough the GT1's were very expensive but it drew in the crowds who were amazed by the looks, the power etc. TV voerage in those days is nowhere near as good as it is today, maybe a ggod time to propose a new GT1 entry in the British GT. This would be great as no other race series includes GT1 class with them being the top class in a race event. I know the ALMS has fast spec cars but these are open top prototypes which in my view should be their own separate race seires altogether. They aren't GT cars they are GT formula cars IMO.
But back to the original question... it may also be a good idea to break away from the F3 partnership if GT races can olny take place on similar dates and venues etc.
Oh yeah, final point (oh no I hear you say!) .... I am glad to hear that the racing action was good to watch at Donington! I will be watching it on TV when it is aired. Just imagine how good it could be with GT2 (or GT1) cars back in action!!
Aaaarrrggghhh! But that's the whole point - the racing was so much better on Sunday BECAUSE there are no GT2 cars these days, not in spite of!
GT1 will never return - the class doesn't exist any more and the cost of running the cars is truly incredible.
GT2/GTS is seriously expensive, too, and the racing wouldn't be that good with only a couple of cars. M. Ratel tried to relauch the class this year, but the take-up was minimal due to the prohibitive cost of running the cars.
What's important these days is the quality of the racing - and BGT had that in spades at the weekend. What would you prefer: a scrapping grid full of 31 Porshes/Ferraris et al, or the return to the GT2 days where the Saleen disappeared into the distance, chased vainly by the single Lister and the single TVR (which would then break down)? The current class structure is better for the public too, as they can easily recognise what's racing, rather than asking: "What are Listers and Saleens?"
You really must try to travel to the races at Oulton Park this year - it will change your mind. Honestly.
Steve @ Eclipse.
>> Edited by Ahonen on Thursday 8th April 12:40
GT1 will never return - the class doesn't exist any more and the cost of running the cars is truly incredible.
GT2/GTS is seriously expensive, too, and the racing wouldn't be that good with only a couple of cars. M. Ratel tried to relauch the class this year, but the take-up was minimal due to the prohibitive cost of running the cars.
What's important these days is the quality of the racing - and BGT had that in spades at the weekend. What would you prefer: a scrapping grid full of 31 Porshes/Ferraris et al, or the return to the GT2 days where the Saleen disappeared into the distance, chased vainly by the single Lister and the single TVR (which would then break down)? The current class structure is better for the public too, as they can easily recognise what's racing, rather than asking: "What are Listers and Saleens?"
You really must try to travel to the races at Oulton Park this year - it will change your mind. Honestly.
Steve @ Eclipse.
>> Edited by Ahonen on Thursday 8th April 12:40
wolverine said:
... it may also be a good idea to break away from the F3 partnership if GT races can olny take place on similar dates and venues etc.....
Not going to happen. The F3 and GT teams work well together, much better than with the British Taxi Cars. To start with the paddock and teams are much friendlier.
The package this year does allow for 'stand alone' events, however, the marketing for the two series dovetails nicely.
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