Huge growth at largest wind farm - can we run out of wind?
Discussion
A massive expansion is to take place at Europe's largest onshore wind farm, which is situated in East Renfrewshire.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west...
With the increase in the number of ‘wind farms’, and more specifically the expansion of existing wind farms, presumably leading to an increase in the amount of local wind actually absorbed and dissipated, resulting in less wind continuing it’s natural flow, got me thinking about wind supply and what affect this may have on the natural dynamics of nature, and whether it could have a detrimental effect on for example, seed dispersal, or change in local climates. Is it also possible that we could run out of sufficient wind, on say a local level?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west...
With the increase in the number of ‘wind farms’, and more specifically the expansion of existing wind farms, presumably leading to an increase in the amount of local wind actually absorbed and dissipated, resulting in less wind continuing it’s natural flow, got me thinking about wind supply and what affect this may have on the natural dynamics of nature, and whether it could have a detrimental effect on for example, seed dispersal, or change in local climates. Is it also possible that we could run out of sufficient wind, on say a local level?
Edited by Police State on Tuesday 7th September 23:56
Frederick said:
I'm setting myself up for a whooooosh here, but wind doesn't just stop when it hits a propeller...
that in essence is what I am getting at; it's all in degrees. Wind Speed, Sheer factor, friction, resisting force, etc. But if it loses some (or all) of it's energy it must stop, or at least slow down because its energy is its means of propulsion.I don't know the conclusive answer, but it was just a notion that occured to me, and would really like to know if the resident PH boffins could shed some light on it.
Disco_Dale said:
I think you need to study physics more.
grumbledoak said:
I won't bother with 'the parrot', but you might want to study Physics a bit.
Wooooooo!!!!! Physics party!
I'll get my equations.
Okay, on a more boring note, a wind turbine does take some of the kinetic energy from the wind (theoretical maximum is 59%) but it only affects a small area and is why they put a spacing between turbines (mostly turbulence actuality). This will not affect things like seed dispersion much though because it is so limited by the vast amount of energy in the system overall and the fact that it (the wind) is constantly being generated as air goes from high pressure zones to lower ones. (Or in the case of mybrainhurts - curry)
Consider what would happen if you were open a tap at a continuous rate - forever, and allow water to flow down the bonnet of wonderfully clean F1 GTR (the nice orange one in the Mclaren showroom
) - the water would run off and reach the floor, now imagine a dirty bonnet, the water has more resistance to flow, but the same amount (except for an incredibly tiny insignificant amount stored on the bonnet) will still reach the floor since even though the water (wind) is there for longer, it is being pulled by gravity (pressure difference/isobars) for longer.I know - i'm rubbish at explaining things, but in my opinion the biggest threat posed by wind turbines is to birds and Bae's secret black stealth plane's.
Edited by Colin 1985 on Wednesday 8th September 02:34
As above but maybe a bit simpler?
Wind isnt really being blown etc it gets sucked from areas of high pressure to low as heat makes the air expand (high pressure) and contract (low pressure). As such, to fill the low pressure "hole" left from contracting air you still need the same amount (if we assume it stays the same tempature as it passes through the turbine) so if the wind is slowed down by the turbines it just means it gets sucked to the area of low pressure for a bit longer.
As long as we keep heating and cooling air then we will never run out of wind.
Wind isnt really being blown etc it gets sucked from areas of high pressure to low as heat makes the air expand (high pressure) and contract (low pressure). As such, to fill the low pressure "hole" left from contracting air you still need the same amount (if we assume it stays the same tempature as it passes through the turbine) so if the wind is slowed down by the turbines it just means it gets sucked to the area of low pressure for a bit longer.
As long as we keep heating and cooling air then we will never run out of wind.
Colonial said:
I'm confused as to why more renewable energy is a bad thing.
It's not, but many people who live next to windfarms and the like say they are an eye-sore which is where most of the complaining comes from I imagine. As with anything (such as climate change) if you selectively put your data together you can proove anything your paid to proove.ymwoods said:
Colonial said:
I'm confused as to why more renewable energy is a bad thing.
It's not, but many people who live next to windfarms and the like say they are an eye-sore which is where most of the complaining comes from I imagine. As with anything (such as climate change) if you selectively put your data together you can proove anything your paid to proove.It's funny. When people get told they are going to have anything next door to them, they go on the offensive. But really, the noise produced by wind turbines are quite minor, and visually there is a lot worse out there.
Colonial said:
ymwoods said:
Colonial said:
I'm confused as to why more renewable energy is a bad thing.
It's not, but many people who live next to windfarms and the like say they are an eye-sore which is where most of the complaining comes from I imagine. As with anything (such as climate change) if you selectively put your data together you can proove anything your paid to proove.It's funny. When people get told they are going to have anything next door to them, they go on the offensive. But really, the noise produced by wind turbines are quite minor, and visually there is a lot worse out there.
ymwoods said:
Colonial said:
ymwoods said:
Colonial said:
I'm confused as to why more renewable energy is a bad thing.
It's not, but many people who live next to windfarms and the like say they are an eye-sore which is where most of the complaining comes from I imagine. As with anything (such as climate change) if you selectively put your data together you can proove anything your paid to proove.It's funny. When people get told they are going to have anything next door to them, they go on the offensive. But really, the noise produced by wind turbines are quite minor, and visually there is a lot worse out there.
“We are going to provide a new coal fired power station”
“lots of noise about how evil they are and how we should provide renewable energy”
“fine. We’ll build a wind turbine instead”
“lots of noise about how bad wind turbines are for birds and bats and fairies and how it will disturb sleep”
Bloody NIMBY’s
I have nothing against sustainability - makes perfect sense.
However, aren't wind turbines pretty in efficient? Can only be run during specific parameters and have to use power to be kept turning in certain conditions.
Isn't efficiency of power (or rather the likelihood that it becomes worth it as a profitable concern) rated by $ spent per calorie produced and wind turbines is about as bad as it gets and has only been embraced thanks to EU and country based grants?
Questions not critisism.
However, aren't wind turbines pretty in efficient? Can only be run during specific parameters and have to use power to be kept turning in certain conditions.
Isn't efficiency of power (or rather the likelihood that it becomes worth it as a profitable concern) rated by $ spent per calorie produced and wind turbines is about as bad as it gets and has only been embraced thanks to EU and country based grants?
Questions not critisism.
Colin 1985 said:
the water has more resistance to flow, but the same amount (except for an incredibly tiny insignificant amount stored on the bonnet) will still reach the floor since even though the water (wind) is there for longer, it is being pulled by gravity (pressure difference/isobars) for longer.
Only if you ignore evaporation......To those that thing the noise is insignificant - it is not. I have tried to sleep near one of the damn things and it was impossible. There has been too little research into the effects of the constant drone and vibration and I suspect, with these things being the calendar girl of Eco-nuts, funding for said reseach will be as easy to come buy as funding for research into the health benefits of smoking and drinking.
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