Building Contract

[JohnRS4]

Am about to go out for quotes to 3 builders for a two storey extension and am looking for a contract to use. Have been recommended to use the RIBA Small Works Contract but the 2007 version rather than the latest 2010 version. Anybody any comments or suggestions?

Am looking at agreeing 2 week in arrears payments based on work completed and materials delivered to site. Would appreciate any suggestions from those who have gone through this process before. Am intending to PM the build myself as I am currently retired and have the time with some help from my architect if I need any technical advice.

[rsv gone!]

I'm not familiar with that form of contract but standard forms are always best. People tend to know their rights and responsibilities. Presumably the value is low?

Any queries, let me know.

[Boshly]

Where in Surrey are you?

Cant really help recontracts as we normally use JCT D&B but we are in Weybridge if you need any advice etc...

May even be able to help recontractors etc....

Edited by Boshly on Thursday 24th June 20:53

[Simpo Two]

I like the idea of a bloke who builds houses called Boshly. Very Harry Enfield

[JohnRS4]

Boshly said:

Where in Surrey are you?

Cant really help recontracts as we normally use JCT D&B but we are in Weybridge if you need any advice etc...

May even be able to help recontractors etc....

Edited by Boshly on Thursday 24th June 20:53

Live between Woking and Ripley. Have already identified 3 builders but maybe in touch if I need any help. Have a full set of detailed plans so just looking for the builder.

Have also found a JCT05 Building contract for a home owner/occupier who has not appointed a consultant to oversee the work. This sounds what I need. Also all I can find are hardback versions. Is there any way to get electronic versions

[Beardy10]

When you say materials delivered to site I take it you mean delivered to site and fitted ? i.e. If it was windows only paid for once installed ?

[rsv gone!]

Beardy10 said:

When you say materials delivered to site I take it you mean delivered to site and fitted ? i.e. If it was windows only paid for once installed ?

It is normal practice on building contracts to pay for materials on site. (It is also prudent to ask for proof that the contractor has good title to the materials. Certainly ask for this for expensive items.)

[Beardy10]

rsv gone! said:

Beardy10 said:

When you say materials delivered to site I take it you mean delivered to site and fitted ? i.e. If it was windows only paid for once installed ?

It is normal practice on building contracts to pay for materials on site. (It is also prudent to ask for proof that the contractor has good title to the materials. Certainly ask for this for expensive items.)

What happens if they get damaged during installation or say something has been made to the wrong size and only noticed one it comes to installation ?

Not an expert by any means! Probably doing a major refurb next year so very interested.

[rsv gone!]

Beardy10 said:

rsv gone! said:

Beardy10 said:

When you say materials delivered to site I take it you mean delivered to site and fitted ? i.e. If it was windows only paid for once installed ?

It is normal practice on building contracts to pay for materials on site. (It is also prudent to ask for proof that the contractor has good title to the materials. Certainly ask for this for expensive items.)

What happens if they get damaged during installation or say something has been made to the wrong size and only noticed one it comes to installation ?

Not an expert by any means! Probably doing a major refurb next year so very interested.

That would be a risk. If that concerned you then you or your agent should check for such things - as much as you can.

These standard forms of contract were originally used on larger contracts and they've filtered down to include Minor Works versions. In standard contracts, valuations are at a pre-agreed interval and the value of the works to date (which includes materials on site unless the standard form has been altered) is agreed, with interim payments made.

Flipping the argument around, if you've ordered lots of expensive bespoke materials then you'd want your client to pay for them soonest, to protect your cashflow and reduce the financial risk you bear.

I'll staple my colours to the mast; I work for a Building Contractor.

[u13rr1]

You might want to look at this:

http://www.jctltd.co.uk/stylesheet.asp?file=220720...

Building contract for a home owner/occupier who has not appointed a consultant to oversee the work (HO/B)

[JohnRS4]

u13rr1 said:

You might want to look at this:

http://www.jctltd.co.uk/stylesheet.asp?file=220720...

Building contract for a home owner/occupier who has not appointed a consultant to oversee the work (HO/B)

Thanks have just ordered a set. In the meantime photocopying about 3 x 90 copies of drawings, specs etc....great fun!!

[Boshly]

Simpo Two said:

I like the idea of a bloke who builds houses called Boshly. Very Harry Enfield

Never really thought about it before

[Boshly]

Beardy10 said:

rsv gone! said:

Beardy10 said:

When you say materials delivered to site I take it you mean delivered to site and fitted ? i.e. If it was windows only paid for once installed ?

It is normal practice on building contracts to pay for materials on site. (It is also prudent to ask for proof that the contractor has good title to the materials. Certainly ask for this for expensive items.)

What happens if they get damaged during installation or say something has been made to the wrong size and only noticed one it comes to installation ?

Not an expert by any means! Probably doing a major refurb next year so very interested.

Hopefully you have a retention? More likely it's discovered early enough and you are running a few weeks in arrears. This can be adjusted in the next valuation.

I personally ensure that all valuations are cumulative on work done so that as things progress if you identify one item in valuation 3 as 100% and the realise after there is still something else to be done you can just adjust that element down on valuation 4. If the contractor is proceeding diligently he will still get a payment for other works and you won't get any/many complaints. We know when were ahead on our own work/applications and it's part of the game to cover your cashflow, so be diligent but not too over officious.

Most certificates issued by a competent CA (Clients Agent/Contract Administrator) on applications for payment will state that defective work or materials can be deducted. Not sure if OP is having a CA?

The reality is to avoid massive upfront payments, use a contractor with a good reputation and be diligent but fair on your contractor. Keep regular and consistent communication, put instructions in writing either with an agreed cost wherever possible. If you can't get an agreed cost for whatever reason explain that you will want very accurate records of expenditure and agree a mark-up (normally 15-25% )

I have recently 'rescued' a contract where the cheaper contractor went belly up after £450k worth of work where probably £150k was more accurate, they were appointed purely because they were cheaper £300k cheaper by co-incidence, and by the time we had finished they had paid approximately £500k more. Cheapest is not always best.

[JohnRS4]

Currently looking at payments 2 weeks in arrears with 5% retention. Will not be employing a CA but will try and do the most of it myself with help from Architect if I need technical help. Any comments?

[Johnniem]

JohnRS4 said:

Currently looking at payments 2 weeks in arrears with 5% retention. Will not be employing a CA but will try and do the most of it myself with help from Architect if I need technical help. Any comments?

John, please feel free to call me or pm me if you wish and I will call you. I am a chartered building surveyor and quite happy to chat about the way to go and inherent pitfalls. Most of the posters have given good advice but there is an awful lot to know about before you even go to tender.

[Boshly]

Johnniem said:

JohnRS4 said:

Currently looking at payments 2 weeks in arrears with 5% retention. Will not be employing a CA but will try and do the most of it myself with help from Architect if I need technical help. Any comments?

John, please feel free to call me or pm me if you wish and I will call you. I am a chartered building surveyor and quite happy to chat about the way to go and inherent pitfalls. Most of the posters have given good advice but there is an awful lot to know about before you even go to tender.

Sage advice, though your 90 pages of drawings and spec sounds pretty thorough for an extension.

Whilst liaising with the 'gamekeeper' don't hesitate on advice from a 'poacher'