Double sided fence - who owns the gap in between?

[JuniorD]

We are separated from our neighbours by a fence which I understand is jointly owned, the fence being a two-sided affair with 3" thick fence posts separating the respective sides. Essentially therefore there is a 3" strip of no man's land in the gap between the sides of the fence.

Any ideas who would own this strip in between? Would it be half ours and half our neighbours'?

The reason for my question is that they have removed their side of the fence and have dug away the intermediate gap in order to put down foundations for an extension. The fence posts remain and our side is intact. However I am slightly bothered that they have not consulted us about this as the plans made it appear that they would leave a reasonable spacing from the fence. Now I fear they may be undercutting our ground.

Thanks
JD

[carreauchompeur]

Is it a six inch or foot long gap?

[Number 7]

Depending on whether you have a building close to where this digging is taking place, the party wall act may apply. A web search should give the relevant distances / angles.

7.

[Simpo Two]

You could ask them, in a neighbourly 'Hi how's it going?' in a cheerful smile sort of way...? Then you could look innocently confused and say 'that's funny, the plans show it like *this*...'

[s3fella]

Simpo Two said:

You could ask them, in a neighbourly 'Hi how's it going?' in a cheerful smile sort of way...? Then you could look innocently confused and say 'that's funny, the plans show it like *this*...'

Alternatively, you could bh like mad about your neighbour, call him every name under the sun, and we could all wait a few months til he joins up here himself....! You could then both bh about each other on the net, from either side of the fence.


Seriously though, if the plans show a gap to the building, I presume they are having the footings wider as they need the footings wider than the wall. I'd have thought the planners would nto allow a wall so claose that the fotings need to undercut you land. So maybe they are sneakily trying to move the wall an inch or two.

In answer to your question, I'd think that the boundary line runs down the middle of the fence, if the fence had been errected corectly of course.... and if it is jointly owned. Although you usually will see on the deeds one neighbour will own the boundary on one side of their garden.

Edited by s3fella on Tuesday 4th May 11:13

[Penny-lope]

I don't know, but that's the area I tend to throw any stones I find

[Planet Claire]

Penny-lope said:

I don't know, but that's the area I tend to throw any stones I find

haha, me too!

[Mazda Baiter]

Planet Claire said:

Penny-lope said:

I don't know, but that's the area I tend to throw any stones I find

haha, me too!

It's where any cat eggs go from my veggie patch.

[Chrisgr31]

It's likely that the boundary runs down the middle of "no mans land" however proving it is another thing! The line on the plan is going to equate to a thickness of over 3 inches.

I would suggest that what they are doing is wrong, however a dispute is going to be expensive!

[dugt]

Mazda Baiter said:

Planet Claire said:

Penny-lope said:

I don't know, but that's the area I tend to throw any stones I find

haha, me too!

It's where any cat eggs go from my veggie patch.

your cat lays eggs

[edfoxuk]

i know a bit about this.

refer to the party wall act . they are legally bound to give you notice of the works, and if you gail to respond or respond negatively you are deemed to be in dispute and they must appoint separate boundary surveyors to act for each party. The surveyor will ensure that work proceeds and no damage is done or damage is reinstated. You cant stop works happening but you can make him incur costs.

check the link below.

http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/planningan...

the area of no mans land is a bit ambiguous. does you deed plan fix the boundary, is it off the corner of a building, which fence is the oldest? as a general rule the side of a fence that has post indicates ownership. to make matters even more vague there is no such thing as land theft, if you can prove that land is partitioned within your boundary for 12 years its yours. Also land registry plans are small scale but if the line shown is equal distance between properties then its a good guide.

You can get a copy of your deed plan via the land registry online you dont have to go to your solicitor.

pm me if you want more info

ed brookhouseconsulting.com

your neighbour may have difficulties selling his house if there are any boundary issues.

[edfoxuk]

i know a bit about this.

refer to the party wall act . they are legally bound to give you notice of the works, and if you gail to respond or respond negatively you are deemed to be in dispute and they must appoint separate boundary surveyors to act for each party. The surveyor will ensure that work proceeds and no damage is done or damage is reinstated. You cant stop works happening but you can make him incur costs.

check the link below.

http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/planningan...

the area of no mans land is a bit ambiguous. does you deed plan fix the boundary, is it off the corner of a building, which fence is the oldest? as a general rule the side of a fence that has post indicates ownership. to make matters even more vague there is no such thing as land theft, if you can prove that land is partitioned within your boundary for 12 years its yours. Also land registry plans are small scale but if the line shown is equal distance between properties then its a good guide.

You can get a copy of your deed plan via the land registry online you dont have to go to your solicitor.

pm me if you want more info

ed brookhouseconsulting.com

your neighbour may have difficulties selling his house if there are any boundary issues.

[edfoxuk]

i know a bit about this.

refer to the party wall act . they are legally bound to give you notice of the works, and if you gail to respond or respond negatively you are deemed to be in dispute and they must appoint separate boundary surveyors to act for each party. The surveyor will ensure that work proceeds and no damage is done or damage is reinstated. You cant stop works happening but you can make him incur costs.

check the link below.

http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/planningan...

the area of no mans land is a bit ambiguous. does you deed plan fix the boundary, is it off the corner of a building, which fence is the oldest? as a general rule the side of a fence that has post indicates ownership. to make matters even more vague there is no such thing as land theft, if you can prove that land is partitioned within your boundary for 12 years its yours. Also land registry plans are small scale but if the line shown is equal distance between properties then its a good guide.

You can get a copy of your deed plan via the land registry online you dont have to go to your solicitor.

pm me if you want more info

ed brookhouseconsulting.com

your neighbour may have difficulties selling his house if there are any boundary issues.

[JuniorD]

Thanks to all the replies. Some very interesting and insightful comments there. I'll have to get a look at our deeds and keep a watchful eye over proceedings over the next while. On inspection it would seem that the encroachment isn't too extensive and is unavoidable on their part (it is at the edge of the trench they have dug for foundations). From what I can see the foundations which they have laid don't extend into this 'no man's land' and so I would reckon the wall they construct will be well within their side. They did assure me originally that there would be no overhanging gutters or anything like that which is good but I think they will shortly be asking us if they can take down our side of the fence temporarily so they can complete the work. I'll have to get the missus to decline their request!

[Busamav]

JuniorD said:

I think they will shortly be asking us if they can take down our side of the fence temporarily so they can complete the work. I'll have to get the missus to decline their request!

I struggle to see that train of thought.

You will have a better wall to look at if you kindly grant them the access, it will be done quicker and cleaner too , so less disruption and hassle.

It really will make no difference to you , one day you may be doing a similar project and need a bit of neighbourly help.


ps , I love the way you say the Mrs will be the one to do the declining .

[JuniorD]

Busamav said:

JuniorD said:

I think they will shortly be asking us if they can take down our side of the fence temporarily so they can complete the work. I'll have to get the missus to decline their request!

I struggle to see that train of thought.

You will have a better wall to look at if you kindly grant them the access, it will be done quicker and cleaner too , so less disruption and hassle.

It really will make no difference to you , one day you may be doing a similar project and need a bit of neighbourly help.


ps , I love the way you say the Mrs will be the one to do the declining .

I'm pretty agreeable and helpful when it comes to these things and wouldn't arbitrarily make life difficult for the neigbours but experience shows that they will not be able to take down the fence and put it back up to the satisfaction of my OH and to be honest I'd rather have the neighbours inconvenienced than have to listen to her! And the OH has her own reasons not to warm to the neigbours, who are bordeline ignorant, dumb people with more money than sense. She would therefore not be disposed towards assisting them in their folly!

[Busamav]

Then suggest if they took the fence down , that it is stopped off at the end of the new extension ,

giving you a foot or so more in the garden and not creating a trap for all of the crud that will build up between the fence and the wall that you will have to look at .