Discussion
I spoke to a chap at the Chatsworth gathering after noticing he had a LPG conversion on his chimaera,the tank was on the parcel shelf in which he was going to cover.There is the obvious advantages but what are your thoughts on this as to me it seems very tempting with no real downsides apart from the space on the shelf.Weight isn't really an issue because you wouldn't need as much petrol,just reserves and the tanks are now days quite robust and quite honest in a safer position in a crash being in the middle of the car.
Anyone know of any more converted or consirdering it?
P
Anyone know of any more converted or consirdering it?
P
captain slow 82 said:
If he can't afford to put unleaded or super unleaded in he should sell it and buy a smart car!
+1Ran 2 X Disco 4.0 LPG's as daily drivers.
LPG might be ok for these but not for a tiv.
If you are doing a lot of miles then choose another car or a shed as a 2nd one.
The cost of a decent conversion, from memory is at least 2K +, you can buy a lot of Optimax for that.
I actually think IMHO, LPG would lower the value of the car, I certainly wouldn't look at one
.In my opinion LPG should not be dismissed.
Delivery systems are way better than they were, years ago LPG would get a bad press on efficiency grounds.
Most systems had a very simple vaporiser that made a carburettor look high tech.
Compared with fuel injection a vaporiser is like the difference between an abacus and a laptop.
Gas was once the preserve of forklift trucks and the like, these days accurately metered fuel injection has closed the gap.
Forget the financial saving for a moment and consider the undisputed engine life benefits.
Gas burns so much cleaner, fact!
Liquid fuels do a highly efficient job of washing oil from your bores and diluting the oil in your sump.
I have rebuilt a number of high mileage engines that have been run exclusively on gas.
The amazing thing is how little wear you find compared with a liquid fuel engine.
With efficiency losses becoming less of an issue, the availability improving & engine life extended significantly why not make a saving too?
Delivery systems are way better than they were, years ago LPG would get a bad press on efficiency grounds.
Most systems had a very simple vaporiser that made a carburettor look high tech.
Compared with fuel injection a vaporiser is like the difference between an abacus and a laptop.
Gas was once the preserve of forklift trucks and the like, these days accurately metered fuel injection has closed the gap.
Forget the financial saving for a moment and consider the undisputed engine life benefits.
Gas burns so much cleaner, fact!
Liquid fuels do a highly efficient job of washing oil from your bores and diluting the oil in your sump.
I have rebuilt a number of high mileage engines that have been run exclusively on gas.
The amazing thing is how little wear you find compared with a liquid fuel engine.
With efficiency losses becoming less of an issue, the availability improving & engine life extended significantly why not make a saving too?
My 4.0 Disco used to average 10-11 mpg.
Gas was approx 1/2 price so average was the same as 20-22 MPG as a petrol burner.
Add to that that my 3 X tanks fitted, (2 where the petrol tank was and a long torpedo one running the length of the car), gave me a range of 240 miles and the lack of fuel stations generally, (I had to fill up from a factory unit outside of Cork where the ran LPG forklift trucks!) and the cost of the conversion, it isn't an attractive option imho.
Because of this I eventually changed to a TD5!
Keep it standard and enjoy it for what it is, comparatively, petrol isn't that expensive if compared with the costs over the years.
HCM..
Gas was approx 1/2 price so average was the same as 20-22 MPG as a petrol burner.
Add to that that my 3 X tanks fitted, (2 where the petrol tank was and a long torpedo one running the length of the car), gave me a range of 240 miles and the lack of fuel stations generally, (I had to fill up from a factory unit outside of Cork where the ran LPG forklift trucks!) and the cost of the conversion, it isn't an attractive option imho.
Because of this I eventually changed to a TD5!
Keep it standard and enjoy it for what it is, comparatively, petrol isn't that expensive if compared with the costs over the years.
HCM..
Lubrication from petrol?
Maybe a few years ago.
Modern valve seats & guides are designed to run without fuel born lubrication.
I don't think there would be a lubrication problem running an RV8 on gas.
The problems I can see are:
1) Availability of LPG (getting better)
2) Range (a little less on gas)
3) Choosing where you mount the tank
Ultimately we need to hear from someone who actually runs their Tiv on gas.
Maybe a few years ago.
Modern valve seats & guides are designed to run without fuel born lubrication.
I don't think there would be a lubrication problem running an RV8 on gas.
The problems I can see are:
1) Availability of LPG (getting better)
2) Range (a little less on gas)
3) Choosing where you mount the tank
Ultimately we need to hear from someone who actually runs their Tiv on gas.
Are you sure it wasn't really nitrous oxide 
....I've seen a few cars & bikes that have put LPG or fire extinguiser labels on nitrous bottles....that would be more like it 
Not sure I would like the idea of driving around with a pressurised bottle of flammable gas/fluid just over your left shoulder
....apart from any fire implications in an accident imagine what the result would be if the bottle broke free from its mounts 
Bodders
....I've seen a few cars & bikes that have put LPG or fire extinguiser labels on nitrous bottles....that would be more like it Not sure I would like the idea of driving around with a pressurised bottle of flammable gas/fluid just over your left shoulder
....apart from any fire implications in an accident imagine what the result would be if the bottle broke free from its mounts Bodders
Our famil love LPG my dad has a volvo 850 on LPG for the last 10 years and i ran a jag xj6 for year on it too.Dont see any issue with puting it in a TIV like said not every one has deep pockets and it is much cleaner on your engine i changed my oil in my jag every 8k and it came out looking amber. I would only fit the kit if you are doing big miles in the car so the install cost pays for itself quickly if less than 15k a year and not a long term keeper no point. But it up to you run your chim for 52p a litre or 1.26p for v-power???
The tank is right by your shoulder,however if it went bang which is very unlikely what difference if its next to you or 1ft 6in behind.Another thing is the fuel tank is in the boot,if you got rear ended the LPG is in the middle of the car so in some sense a safer position.If you could swallow the initial cost of about £1500 then its happy days.Selling a LPG tiv would put some people off but also would appeal to others what with fuel costs.
P
P
jvr said:
The tank is right by your shoulder,however if it went bang which is very unlikely what difference if its next to you or 1ft 6in behind.Another thing is the fuel tank is in the boot,if you got rear ended the LPG is in the middle of the car so in some sense a safer position.If you could swallow the initial cost of about £1500 then its happy days.Selling a LPG tiv would put some people off but also would appeal to others what with fuel costs.
P
Lpg is safer than petrol in a fire too the tank is much better it wont explode like your petrol one (as proved by the epic fail glasgow airport attack thank god)P
The maths may not be entirely accurate.
To have a range of 200 miles you would need about an 80 litre tank, (my disco was 120 litre).
You wouldn't want that on the shelf behind you for aesthetic reasons at least!
I met a guy who had one of those LPG tanks that fit in the spare wheel well, a vectra I think.
He had something like a range of 60-80 miles, whats the point?
It's only feasable with a big car with big tanks
.
HCM.
To have a range of 200 miles you would need about an 80 litre tank, (my disco was 120 litre).
You wouldn't want that on the shelf behind you for aesthetic reasons at least!
I met a guy who had one of those LPG tanks that fit in the spare wheel well, a vectra I think.
He had something like a range of 60-80 miles, whats the point?
It's only feasable with a big car with big tanks
.HCM.
haircutmike said:
The maths may not be entirely accurate.
To have a range of 200 miles you would need about an 80 litre tank, (my disco was 120 litre).
You wouldn't want that on the shelf behind you for aesthetic reasons at least!
I met a guy who had one of those LPG tanks that fit in the spare wheel well, a vectra I think.
He had something like a range of 60-80 miles, whats the point?
It's only feasable with a big car with big tanks.
HCM.
My dad has a 50L spare wheel well tank in the 850 gets 220 miles out his, the factory vectra's do not seem to get the miles like after market units (we had a short ownership of a vectra and sold it for this reason A case of they all do that sir)My jag was a dounut tank 90L 3.2L car and range was 260-290 per tanks worth cost equivilent of 45ish MPG at the time ( price of gas was about 38-40p at that time IIRC.To have a range of 200 miles you would need about an 80 litre tank, (my disco was 120 litre).
You wouldn't want that on the shelf behind you for aesthetic reasons at least!
I met a guy who had one of those LPG tanks that fit in the spare wheel well, a vectra I think.
He had something like a range of 60-80 miles, whats the point?
It's only feasable with a big car with big tanks
.HCM.
Too add the volvo is a 2L auto so not a thirsty as a rv8 i guess
Edited by scotty_d on Saturday 1st May 11:41
scotty_d said:
haircutmike said:
The maths may not be entirely accurate.
To have a range of 200 miles you would need about an 80 litre tank, (my disco was 120 litre).
You wouldn't want that on the shelf behind you for aesthetic reasons at least!
I met a guy who had one of those LPG tanks that fit in the spare wheel well, a vectra I think.
He had something like a range of 60-80 miles, whats the point?
It's only feasable with a big car with big tanks.
HCM.
My dad has a 50L spare wheel well tank in the 850 gets 220 miles out his, the factory vectra's do not seem to get the miles like after market units (we had a short ownership of a vectra and sold it for this reason A case of they all do that sir)My jag was a dounut tank 90L 3.2L car and range was 260-290 per tanks worth cost equivilent of 45ish MPG at the time ( price of gas was about 38-40p at that time IIRC.To have a range of 200 miles you would need about an 80 litre tank, (my disco was 120 litre).
You wouldn't want that on the shelf behind you for aesthetic reasons at least!
I met a guy who had one of those LPG tanks that fit in the spare wheel well, a vectra I think.
He had something like a range of 60-80 miles, whats the point?
It's only feasable with a big car with big tanks
.HCM.
Too add the volvo is a 2L auto so not a thirsty as a rv8 i guess
Edited by scotty_d on Saturday 1st May 11:41
The only time I made an effort of 60-70 mph of motorway cruising it returned 15 mpg, at that rate, I prefer to floor it and pay the price!
HCM.
jvr said:
The tank is right by your shoulder,however if it went bang which is very unlikely what difference if its next to you or 1ft 6in behind.Another thing is the fuel tank is in the boot,if you got rear ended the LPG is in the middle of the car so in some sense a safer position.If you could swallow the initial cost of about £1500 then its happy days.Selling a LPG tiv would put some people off but also would appeal to others what with fuel costs.
P
Not quite, the fuel tank is separated from the passenger compartment by a bulkhead so the fuel does not get deposited on the occupants.....which would not be the case if the LPG tank split or the supply pipe detached in an impact when it is fitted on the parcel shelf. I agree there is unlikely to be an explosion as all these conversions have anti-flash back valves fitted as standard. P
If you look at most of the pictures of Chims or Griffs that have had a rear end impact the rear boot section i.e. wings/floor rips off & the tank either ends up on the ground or gets thrown clear.
I see your point about the LPG bottle being inside the safety cell of the chassis & would protect it more from direct impact but surely you can conversly see that if the bottle securing mounts failed the last thing you would want is a large heavy metal projectile loose in the cabin!
For the safety of the occupants the LPG bottle should be located in the boot.
Bodders
Edited by Bodmin on Saturday 1st May 16:02
captain slow 82 said:
If he can't afford to put unleaded or super unleaded in he should sell it and buy a smart car!
hmm, great point , I have a smart roadster for running about to and from work and my Tamora for fun, i would never dream of converting it to LPG,
But my Mrs has an SLK that is converted to LPG and it is brilliant and cheap as chips to run it has a 50 litre tank which is good for 180ish miles ,but it ain't a TVR.
I personally think it would ruin the car and probably the resale value , but if you aint selling it and want to use it every day then go for it ,
Ant
I'm not in the school of thought that 'real' TVRs have to have a V8 engine: look at the very early cars. They're all still TVRs. Similarly, I don't subscribe to TVRs having to do 15MPG on petrol. What's wrong with similar performance, sound and the same experience by using LPG? It works and it's relatively cheap. Incidentally, I don't run my TVR on LPG but I wouldn't be averse to doing so.
I know of an AJP V8-engined Cerbera in Preston that was converted about four years ago which runs without (as far as I know) any problems.
I know of an AJP V8-engined Cerbera in Preston that was converted about four years ago which runs without (as far as I know) any problems.
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