Discussion
I recently scanned some VW info in a brochure and noticed a horrific thing.....VW have finally lost the plot
A VW Golf 2.0Gti now has just 115 Hp.....in other words a 1.8 Focus can kick its butt !
Am I the only one who is hurt by the continued dilution of what was an honoured symbol 'GTI'.... Oh how I shout at old knackered Montego estates that display Gti on their tail, but now even VW have lost the plot, the company that invented GTI's in the first place.
The final nail in the coffin of any respect for the GTI symbol has been made, as I read further down the brochure that they have badged a diesel as GTI.....
NO No NO No Nooooooo
I loved the Mk1 Golf Gti & the Mk2 GTI 16Valve as performance derivatives which at the time could humble many a porsche (ok.... a 924)
I also reckon that the Golf GTI diesel could out power the 2.0Gti now, what is going on???
Disclaimer: I do admit that the Golf Diesel in 130 & 150 forms are good cars, just not for me.
A VW Golf 2.0Gti now has just 115 Hp.....in other words a 1.8 Focus can kick its butt !
Am I the only one who is hurt by the continued dilution of what was an honoured symbol 'GTI'.... Oh how I shout at old knackered Montego estates that display Gti on their tail, but now even VW have lost the plot, the company that invented GTI's in the first place.
The final nail in the coffin of any respect for the GTI symbol has been made, as I read further down the brochure that they have badged a diesel as GTI.....
NO No NO No Nooooooo
I loved the Mk1 Golf Gti & the Mk2 GTI 16Valve as performance derivatives which at the time could humble many a porsche (ok.... a 924)
I also reckon that the Golf GTI diesel could out power the 2.0Gti now, what is going on???
Disclaimer: I do admit that the Golf Diesel in 130 & 150 forms are good cars, just not for me.
You may like to know that the mk4 golf 2.0 is only badged 'GTi' in the UK, it's called 'SE' or something in the rest of europe. Talk about comtempt for the F*ckwit punters who'll pay solely for a name with no thought as to what's behind it....
Just to add, the Golf turbodiesel 130 and 150s have more power then the 2.0 GTi, and twice the torque
>> Edited by Fatboy on Friday 22 March 14:35
Just to add, the Golf turbodiesel 130 and 150s have more power then the 2.0 GTi, and twice the torque
>> Edited by Fatboy on Friday 22 March 14:35
Before the TVR I had an 8 valve mk2. It was a fantastic car, not the quickest thing on the road but humbled many far quicker beasts and was great fun through the twisties as many friends remind of hanging the outside rear wheel in the air and it felt alright in the front.
My dad then had a mk3, he enjoyed the car a lot but when I drove it it had lost the plot from my beloved mk2. I now regularly drive mk4's. The 1.8turbo. It isn't a gti any longer, the feel of a drivers car has gone and testament to that is the number being used as company cars these days (as the ones I drive are)
The mk1 was legendary and I still want one now as an everyday run around. The mk4 is crud, boring and uninvolving.
A real shame.
Cheers
Mark
My dad then had a mk3, he enjoyed the car a lot but when I drove it it had lost the plot from my beloved mk2. I now regularly drive mk4's. The 1.8turbo. It isn't a gti any longer, the feel of a drivers car has gone and testament to that is the number being used as company cars these days (as the ones I drive are)
The mk1 was legendary and I still want one now as an everyday run around. The mk4 is crud, boring and uninvolving.
A real shame.
Cheers
Mark
Well I've still got both - TVR Chimaera and a Mk1 Golf GTi.
The Mk1 is indeed a classic - wheels in all four corners, crisp handling, light, quick, simple. Each version since then has got heavier, less involving, more complicated and boring.
My Golf (albeit in Group One race spec) laps most circuits quicker than the Chimaera could.
The Mk1 is indeed a classic - wheels in all four corners, crisp handling, light, quick, simple. Each version since then has got heavier, less involving, more complicated and boring.
My Golf (albeit in Group One race spec) laps most circuits quicker than the Chimaera could.
The Mk4 2.0 litre GTI has 115 BHP while the 1.8 litre has 125bhp.
I bought a new 1.8 GTI in 1999 (Mk 4) and it is a really well built car. I have done three round trips to Spain and it has been comfy and reliable. I think the price of it was a bit steep for a Golf and if I had paid for all the extra's it would have knocked it up to nearly 20K. As you can see from my profile I have had a few of these GTIs in the past and IMHO the Mk1 was the best! I had this car when I was 17 and it really taught me a lot about driving. I still have fun in the MK4 and if you try hard enough you can get a (little) hint of that feeling where it all started with the MK1.
I bought a new 1.8 GTI in 1999 (Mk 4) and it is a really well built car. I have done three round trips to Spain and it has been comfy and reliable. I think the price of it was a bit steep for a Golf and if I had paid for all the extra's it would have knocked it up to nearly 20K. As you can see from my profile I have had a few of these GTIs in the past and IMHO the Mk1 was the best! I had this car when I was 17 and it really taught me a lot about driving. I still have fun in the MK4 and if you try hard enough you can get a (little) hint of that feeling where it all started with the MK1.
Had Mk1 1600/1800 & Mk2 8v. Still got the Mk1 1800 (10 years now) - great car, but drove it 60 miles the other day (hadn't used it for >1 year) & bloody hell it makes the Griff seem quiet & refined.
Thinking
of turning it into a track day toy now.
Spnracing: any advice on where's best to get a rollcage for it?
Thinking
of turning it into a track day toy now. Spnracing: any advice on where's best to get a rollcage for it?
Used to have a pug 106gti. 120 ponies in 800kgs was fun. The new vw gti's are no more than marketing tosh, just a rebadged lard arse for those that like the name. Anyway, now were in the 21st century things have moved on. You can now pick up an early elise for 12k. More fun than any new vw gti, if you can live without sat nav, cupholders and an electrically heated botty massager.
quote:
A VW Golf 2.0Gti now has just 115 Hp.....in other words a 1.8 Focus can kick its butt !
Ahhhhhh, that'll explain it
My every day runner at present is a 1971 MGB GT with a 2 litre stage 3 engine. A new Golf GTi was giving me stick the other day, so when we cam to a duel carridgeway I attempred to out drag him, I did this just to see how my MG's engine compared to a GTi, I was quite shocked at the time when I was clearly pulling away from him right up to about 90MPH when we (I.M.O.) were running out of a safe bit of road to do this, the Golf carried on.
115BHP - that's pants for a Golf GTi, my MG has 130 and proberly a lot more torque.
If thats the spec that VW are selling the GTi with now, I think it's time to stop selling it.
quote:
Spnracing: any advice on where's best to get a rollcage for it?
I think Safety Devices and Rollcentre should do one 'off the shelf', though if I was buying one now I'd have one made up that strengthened the front and rear turrets - the standard ones don't.
If you want to talk more about converting a Mk1 Golf to a serious track day, email me offline.
Most of the above is quite true. I have a Mk3 Gofl GTI with the ancient 2 litre 115bhp motor. 122lbft of torque delivered very low down which makes it good around town but lacking in grunt badly on the M-Way. I can still hack it with Mk4 130 diesels on acceleration and can hang on and just crawl past up to about 75 but after that they are long gone. Get to a hill and they walk away.
My car doesn't deserve a GTI badge and as mentioned earlier, the lowly GTIs here now are badges solely for the UK market, elsewhere they are just badged 2.0.
It is odd however that VW dropped the all new 20v 1.8 with 125bhp after 12 months or so and replaced it with the old 2.0 8v which is ancient (same as my car). My mum has a 125bhp 1.8 20v Mk4 GTI and there is no way it's as quick as mine, mot by a long way. You have to gun the crap out of it to make it go which makes for hard work when trying to progress swiftly. Me, I just slot it into 5th at 30 and let it pull away.
They get heavier and slower with every generation, yes VW has lost the plot with the GTI. I recently test drove a Lupo GTI. A 1.6 with variable valve timing and 125bhp. That didn't feel as quick as my Golf either. There's something about armfuls of grunt at the bottom end of the rev range that rev-happy cars just don't provide. They don't feel as quick. Ah well, my next Golf will be a PD150. All but 0-60 I expect it'd trounce the V6 4wd. Well, it does.
Roop
My car doesn't deserve a GTI badge and as mentioned earlier, the lowly GTIs here now are badges solely for the UK market, elsewhere they are just badged 2.0.
It is odd however that VW dropped the all new 20v 1.8 with 125bhp after 12 months or so and replaced it with the old 2.0 8v which is ancient (same as my car). My mum has a 125bhp 1.8 20v Mk4 GTI and there is no way it's as quick as mine, mot by a long way. You have to gun the crap out of it to make it go which makes for hard work when trying to progress swiftly. Me, I just slot it into 5th at 30 and let it pull away.
They get heavier and slower with every generation, yes VW has lost the plot with the GTI. I recently test drove a Lupo GTI. A 1.6 with variable valve timing and 125bhp. That didn't feel as quick as my Golf either. There's something about armfuls of grunt at the bottom end of the rev range that rev-happy cars just don't provide. They don't feel as quick. Ah well, my next Golf will be a PD150. All but 0-60 I expect it'd trounce the V6 4wd. Well, it does.
Roop
My Dads got a 2.0 "GTI" Mk IV golf. Its a very nice car, comfortable, and looks good. However, a GTI its not, he even said himself he wouldnt like to race my 1.4 Micra in it, although I think its faster than my car, but not by much. The car seems quite torquey, but not too quick flat out. He's decided to trade it in for a new Polo 100BHP TD SPort. He said that car is a lot quicker than the GTI.
There are some diesels out there now that thoroughly embarass their petrol equivalents. For example, the MG ZR TDI has quicker acceleration in higher gears than the 160HP Petrol model. As someone has already mentioned, the 150BHP GT TDI golf will probably trounce a V6 from all but 0-60. Seat are also about to bring out an Ibiza with a 130BHP TDI PD engine, which they say makes that car a real hot hatch.
There are some diesels out there now that thoroughly embarass their petrol equivalents. For example, the MG ZR TDI has quicker acceleration in higher gears than the 160HP Petrol model. As someone has already mentioned, the 150BHP GT TDI golf will probably trounce a V6 from all but 0-60. Seat are also about to bring out an Ibiza with a 130BHP TDI PD engine, which they say makes that car a real hot hatch.
Golf TDi drivers really do seem to have taken VW's marketing hype to heart. If you ever need to find one, check out the outside lane of a motorway near you - there it'll be, tailgating all and sundry in an attempt to prove that deisel is fast, and frugal, too. They always, always refuse to be overtaken, and crank up the speed to, oooh, 100mph in an effort to prove they have a hot hatch. I know it's a better car than the petrol version, but please!!
Oh, yes, and here's one for the silly bitch in the green Punto, who pulled out in front of me yesterday, on the M18, doing 65mph, as I approached at over 100, and then patiently waited for her to slowly drag past a lorry, and then proceeded to mouth off at me for daring to overtake - err, get a life, and some more driving lessons girl, and a rear view mirror that you use for something other than make-up....
Oh, yes, and here's one for the silly bitch in the green Punto, who pulled out in front of me yesterday, on the M18, doing 65mph, as I approached at over 100, and then patiently waited for her to slowly drag past a lorry, and then proceeded to mouth off at me for daring to overtake - err, get a life, and some more driving lessons girl, and a rear view mirror that you use for something other than make-up....
quote:
quote:
The Mk4 1.8 litre has 125bhp.
It actually has 150bhp, with the next generation 1.8t golf gti having 180bhp, but the car is still a bit wobbly. Not as involving to drive like my Mk2!
BUT what about the V6 4MOTION?
No, it has 125bhp. Mk4 1.8 (not turbo) 20V
V5 has 150bhp.
1.8T has 150bhp.
quote:
quote:
quote:
The Mk4 1.8 litre has 125bhp.
It actually has 150bhp, with the next generation 1.8t golf gti having 180bhp, but the car is still a bit wobbly. Not as involving to drive like my Mk2!
BUT what about the V6 4MOTION?
No, it has 125bhp. Mk4 1.8 (not turbo) 20V
V5 has 150bhp.
1.8T has 150bhp.
Sorry! thought you were talking about the 1.8t
Good to see i'm not alone with my thoughts....
But come on guys....stop praising the diesels just because you've been saddled with one for work !!!
I know they are good cars in 130 & 150 form (but thats just a turbo bolt on) but they will never have any evo'ness, street cred or really live the Pistonheads theme.
I now drive a Type-R which has no bulkhead soundproofing and revs to 8000 !! lightweight & excellent FWD chasis. Like a GTi used to be
Have fun folks
But come on guys....stop praising the diesels just because you've been saddled with one for work !!!
I know they are good cars in 130 & 150 form (but thats just a turbo bolt on) but they will never have any evo'ness, street cred or really live the Pistonheads theme.
I now drive a Type-R which has no bulkhead soundproofing and revs to 8000 !! lightweight & excellent FWD chasis. Like a GTi used to be
Have fun folks
Better not let my wife see this thread - we're just about to buy a Mk3 GTi for her. Still, I've got 280bhp to play with in my car, so I don't care that her's will only have 115bhp ;-)
Anyone know at what miles the cambelt should be changed in one of these?
Cheers (and sorry for the hi-jack!)
Anyone know at what miles the cambelt should be changed in one of these?
Cheers (and sorry for the hi-jack!)
quote:
If you want to talk more about converting a Mk1 Golf to a serious track day, email me offline.
or join Club GTI www.clubgti.com
I have a Mk1 GTI 1800 - owned for 12 years, 160k miles & it is superb. I ocassionally think about chopping it in, but for what? It is the original hot-hatch & it is still the best.
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