What FILM SLR?
Discussion
One of the girls next door is starting a photography A-Level in September. I'd said she could borrow some of my lenses and stuff to help keep the cost down if she got herself a Canon body, but she's just had the induction day today, and they've told them they have to use film cameras!
Anyway, unless the school can be persuaded to abandon the physical darkroom in favour of a digital one she's stuck with film, so what would people recommend?
Firstly, are there any Canon film bodies that can use EF lenses?
If not, I'm assuming the best approach would probably be to get onto Ebay, but what to buy? Are there any systems which had good lenses that can't be used on any digital bodies? I'm assuming this would give the best quality for the least cash, which is going to be paramount for something of no use after her course.
Anyway, unless the school can be persuaded to abandon the physical darkroom in favour of a digital one she's stuck with film, so what would people recommend?
Firstly, are there any Canon film bodies that can use EF lenses?
If not, I'm assuming the best approach would probably be to get onto Ebay, but what to buy? Are there any systems which had good lenses that can't be used on any digital bodies? I'm assuming this would give the best quality for the least cash, which is going to be paramount for something of no use after her course.
There are about 20 years worth of Canon EOS based 35mm film bodies but bear in mind they will only be compatible with EF and not EF-S lenses.
Go back before that and you get about 20 years worth of non Af film bodies using the FD bayonet mount system. Alternatively any other manufacturer will likely be just as suitable since bodies are cheapo and lenses too. Just be aware that some components will be showing their age and light seals may be a bit marginal in many cases. Some of the oldest stuff is getting to the point where there are few people around to fix it if it goes wrong. But then since it costs little why fix?
Afaik Canon still do a 35mm body but you rarely see one in the stores. The Top of the Range bodies from the EOS 35mm era sell for not too much money - but then I would guess that a photography course is not going to be looking at how to make the most of 1990's electronics. Much more likely they would like something basic with which to learn the basics. I would guess.
I suspect that a non-Canon purchase might give greater flexibility in the lens availability (and later usefulness) stakes. I still from time to time use my old FD lenses with digital bodies, via an adapter.
Go back before that and you get about 20 years worth of non Af film bodies using the FD bayonet mount system. Alternatively any other manufacturer will likely be just as suitable since bodies are cheapo and lenses too. Just be aware that some components will be showing their age and light seals may be a bit marginal in many cases. Some of the oldest stuff is getting to the point where there are few people around to fix it if it goes wrong. But then since it costs little why fix?
Afaik Canon still do a 35mm body but you rarely see one in the stores. The Top of the Range bodies from the EOS 35mm era sell for not too much money - but then I would guess that a photography course is not going to be looking at how to make the most of 1990's electronics. Much more likely they would like something basic with which to learn the basics. I would guess.
I suspect that a non-Canon purchase might give greater flexibility in the lens availability (and later usefulness) stakes. I still from time to time use my old FD lenses with digital bodies, via an adapter.
So something like this Canon EOS 1 would work perfectly well with Canon EF lenses?
There is a whole load of information here ...
http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/entry.htm
and more if you follow its links.
Not sure you can assume backwards compatibility but the chances are that things will work but obviously not all modern functions are available on the older kit.
However you are talking sophsticated hardware and, as Simpo alluded to, the study courses may not warrant such kit. Indeed they may not want it. The Zenit, a light meter (what that then?) and perhaps an ancient flash gun along with one or two manual lenses may be what the course creators have in mind.
http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/entry.htm
and more if you follow its links.
Not sure you can assume backwards compatibility but the chances are that things will work but obviously not all modern functions are available on the older kit.
However you are talking sophsticated hardware and, as Simpo alluded to, the study courses may not warrant such kit. Indeed they may not want it. The Zenit, a light meter (what that then?) and perhaps an ancient flash gun along with one or two manual lenses may be what the course creators have in mind.
LongQ said:
However you are talking sophsticated hardware and, as Simpo alluded to, the study courses may not warrant such kit. Indeed they may not want it. The Zenit, a light meter (what that then?) and perhaps an ancient flash gun along with one or two manual lenses may be what the course creators have in mind.
Good advice, but I would recommend choosing a Praktica LTL or MTL series camera instead of the Zenit - they're much nicer things to use, still built like a tank and have TTL metering. M42 screw lenses and accessories have always been a lot cheaper than bayonet fittings (although I daresay the difference in price is pretty marginal now), which will make it a lot easier to experiment with things like bellows and extension tubes. Pentax screw fit lenses are good quality and cheap.
Something like this kit on Ebay looks like a cheap way of getting lots of bits and pieces in one hit - just need to add a 28mm lens to that and she's in business.
Eggman said:
LongQ said:
However you are talking sophsticated hardware and, as Simpo alluded to, the study courses may not warrant such kit. Indeed they may not want it. The Zenit, a light meter (what that then?) and perhaps an ancient flash gun along with one or two manual lenses may be what the course creators have in mind.
Good advice, but I would recommend choosing a Praktica LTL or MTL series camera instead of the Zenit - they're much nicer things to use, still built like a tank and have TTL metering. M42 screw lenses and accessories have always been a lot cheaper than bayonet fittings (although I daresay the difference in price is pretty marginal now), which will make it a lot easier to experiment with things like bellows and extension tubes. Pentax screw fit lenses are good quality and cheap.
Something like this kit on Ebay looks like a cheap way of getting lots of bits and pieces in one hit - just need to add a 28mm lens to that and she's in business.
Then all you need is a little device to allow you to use a cheapo digital point and shoot as a Polaroid substitute and you're away!
Kermit power said:
So something like this Canon EOS 1 would work perfectly well with Canon EF lenses?
Yes, anything with EOS in the name is an EF mount camera. They came out in the mid 80s, a long time before digital cameras become popular.Kermit power said:
In addition to lenses, would a 580 EXII and/or MR-14EX ring flash also work with the EOS film bodies?
Yes.Edited by SamHH on Friday 26th June 21:42
Famous Graham said:
Not an EF, but I love my A1 - tis an FD mount, but it's a great wee camera. 25 quid or so for the body. Managed to snag that, a 50 1.4 and 80 1.2 for 175 quid a couple of years ago.
Must get some film for it, actually...
Hmm, 80 1.2. Hmm.Must get some film for it, actually...
My A1 has the cough, but still seems to work well though I have not used it for some time. Have an AE1 too. And a 'New F1' which is just great to hold and use. It has real presence in the hand.
Must get around to using some of my film stock - but digital is just so much more instantly available ...
fixedwheelnut said:
I still use a Canon AE-1 35mm SLR that I have and have seen some in Camera shops going for around £80 so have a look around.
Most people are upgrading or using digital so there are plenty of film cameras about at good prices.
I've seen AE-1s complete with multiple lenses and otehr useful bits of kit go for less than that on eBay.Most people are upgrading or using digital so there are plenty of film cameras about at good prices.
Sad really.
Be carefull when using reverse tech on EF lenses as the sensor on digital bodies is mounted much deeper inside the body & the film plane on 35mm a lot closer to the lense.
I'm sure that digital EF lenses also protrude deeper into the body (to compensate) than their 35mm counterparts, hence the 1.6x rule that applies when fitting non digital EF to Digital bodies (200mm x 1.6 = 320mm)
I'm sure there's a problem here, I doubt the lense manufactured specifically for digital will foul the mirror, more than likely the image will not fill the entire film plane.
I'm sure that digital EF lenses also protrude deeper into the body (to compensate) than their 35mm counterparts, hence the 1.6x rule that applies when fitting non digital EF to Digital bodies (200mm x 1.6 = 320mm)
I'm sure there's a problem here, I doubt the lense manufactured specifically for digital will foul the mirror, more than likely the image will not fill the entire film plane.
Stickers said:
Be carefull when using reverse tech on EF lenses as the sensor on digital bodies is mounted much deeper inside the body & the film plane on 35mm a lot closer to the lense.
I'm sure that digital EF lenses also protrude deeper into the body (to compensate) than their 35mm counterparts, hence the 1.6x rule that applies when fitting non digital EF to Digital bodies (200mm x 1.6 = 320mm)
I'm sure there's a problem here, I doubt the lense manufactured specifically for digital will foul the mirror, more than likely the image will not fill the entire film plane.
Uh what? The sensor/film is in exactly the same plane all the time.I'm sure that digital EF lenses also protrude deeper into the body (to compensate) than their 35mm counterparts, hence the 1.6x rule that applies when fitting non digital EF to Digital bodies (200mm x 1.6 = 320mm)
I'm sure there's a problem here, I doubt the lense manufactured specifically for digital will foul the mirror, more than likely the image will not fill the entire film plane.
The difference/trouble is with canons EF-S lens's back protuding further into the body thus fouling the mirror ( and also produce a smalle rimage circle).
Note only Canon lens's do this, my 'crop' sigma 10-20 works fine on a full frame 5D.
LongQ said:
I would guess that a photography course is not going to be looking at how to make the most of 1990's electronics. Much more likely they would like something basic with which to learn the basics. I would guess.
You're probably spot on there, although I learned on a MF Roliflex twin lense reflex & light meter......it certainly taught me everything I needed to know about shutter speed/aperture values along with associated DOF.RobDickinson said:
Uh what? The sensor/film is in exactly the same plane all the time.
The difference/trouble is with canons EF-S lens's back protuding further into the body thus fouling the mirror ( and also produce a smalle rimage circle).
Note only Canon lens's do this, my 'crop' sigma 10-20 works fine on a full frame 5D.
Where did I suggest that the sensor/film plane moved?.....I merely stated that they were different depths inside their respective bodies, if this is incorrect I oppologise......other than that you have repeated my post word for word.The difference/trouble is with canons EF-S lens's back protuding further into the body thus fouling the mirror ( and also produce a smalle rimage circle).
Note only Canon lens's do this, my 'crop' sigma 10-20 works fine on a full frame 5D.
The deeper digital lenses could be due to smaller (than film) sensors.
Stickers said:
I merely stated that they were different depths inside their respective bodies, if this is incorrect I apologise
Both film and digital bodies are all the same depth from lens flange to film plane. (If they weren't it would make focusing more complicated.) However you are right that some EF-S lenses protrude into the body. They can do this due to the smaller mirror used on some DSLRs, which is a side effect of the smaller APS-C sized image sensor. As a consequence, EF lenses will fit all EOS bodies, EF-S will only fit some digital bodies and no film bodies. 
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