Are replica CSL wheels...
Discussion
Dirty and wrong? :-D
I'm not sure I can stomach nearly £2k on a used set of wheels and tyre combo.
Looking at reps with decent tyres, you can pick them up for around £1k.
Providing they're not super heavy compared to stock rims and you're not tracking I can't see the advantage spending double on real ones. I will contradict myself saying...if money was no option I would buy geunine CSL's.
Thoughts people?
I'm not sure I can stomach nearly £2k on a used set of wheels and tyre combo.
Looking at reps with decent tyres, you can pick them up for around £1k.
Providing they're not super heavy compared to stock rims and you're not tracking I can't see the advantage spending double on real ones. I will contradict myself saying...if money was no option I would buy geunine CSL's.
Thoughts people?
asbo said:
As above 
Replica wheels (or cheap wheels in general) are notoriously difficult to balance. Generally speaking, they are also much heavier.
IMO despite the added cost, you're better off going for the real thing.
Maybe I should buy a GT3? ;-)Replica wheels (or cheap wheels in general) are notoriously difficult to balance. Generally speaking, they are also much heavier.
IMO despite the added cost, you're better off going for the real thing.
Edited by asbo on Wednesday 17th June 17:29
You're probably right guys...never done fakies before
I've just put replica CSL's on my M3.
Looks wise etc they are absolutely fine. You CAN tell that they are cheaper though, as really close up there are a couple of very minor casting imperfections.
They did indeed take more weights to balance. 90g instead of the 45g the OEM wheels had with the same tyre.
Compared to the overall weight of the wheel though, an extra 45g is still quite small.
Weight wise they were a pleasant surprise.
Mine are 2.6lb LIGHTER than the OEM Polished 19's, and only 2.4lb HEAVIER than genuine CSL's.
For what they cost, I'm pleased with them. A saving of over £1000 is significant to most people, myself included.
Some pics to help people decide one way or the other:
Looks wise etc they are absolutely fine. You CAN tell that they are cheaper though, as really close up there are a couple of very minor casting imperfections.
They did indeed take more weights to balance. 90g instead of the 45g the OEM wheels had with the same tyre.
Compared to the overall weight of the wheel though, an extra 45g is still quite small.
Weight wise they were a pleasant surprise.
Mine are 2.6lb LIGHTER than the OEM Polished 19's, and only 2.4lb HEAVIER than genuine CSL's.
For what they cost, I'm pleased with them. A saving of over £1000 is significant to most people, myself included.
Some pics to help people decide one way or the other:
Paul_M3 said:
I've just put replica CSL's on my M3.
Looks wise etc they are absolutely fine. You CAN tell that they are cheaper though, as really close up there are a couple of very minor casting imperfections.
They did indeed take more weights to balance. 90g instead of the 45g the OEM wheels had with the same tyre.
Compared to the overall weight of the wheel though, an extra 45g is still quite small.
Weight wise they were a pleasant surprise.
Mine are 2.6lb LIGHTER than the OEM Polished 19's, and only 2.4lb HEAVIER than genuine CSL's.
For what they cost, I'm pleased with them. A saving of over £1000 is significant to most people, myself included.
Some pics to help people decide one way or the other:
I was just about to post up that you can spot the fake wheels from about a mile away, but the ones on your car look like the real thing. I'd be pretty happy with these if it was saving me a grand over the cost of the genuine ones.Looks wise etc they are absolutely fine. You CAN tell that they are cheaper though, as really close up there are a couple of very minor casting imperfections.
They did indeed take more weights to balance. 90g instead of the 45g the OEM wheels had with the same tyre.
Compared to the overall weight of the wheel though, an extra 45g is still quite small.
Weight wise they were a pleasant surprise.
Mine are 2.6lb LIGHTER than the OEM Polished 19's, and only 2.4lb HEAVIER than genuine CSL's.
For what they cost, I'm pleased with them. A saving of over £1000 is significant to most people, myself included.
Some pics to help people decide one way or the other:
I think there is a lot of snobbery when it comes to wheels.
On almost every car ive had ive changed the wheels,sometimes it's cost £3k with tyres,other times £600.
There are some poor quality wheels out there but these are not always the cheap ones!!
You cant argue with weight,that may be a consideration(all tyres weigh different too).
Some original wheels are not that good.
I find the best course is to look after them whatever the price,if you hit a big enough hole,or a kerb then of course they will be damaged...so be careful and most wheels will be fine IMO.
On almost every car ive had ive changed the wheels,sometimes it's cost £3k with tyres,other times £600.
There are some poor quality wheels out there but these are not always the cheap ones!!
You cant argue with weight,that may be a consideration(all tyres weigh different too).
Some original wheels are not that good.
I find the best course is to look after them whatever the price,if you hit a big enough hole,or a kerb then of course they will be damaged...so be careful and most wheels will be fine IMO.
I was recently defrauded by a BMW dealer who passed off fake CSL's as real ones on an AUC car, so I've done a bit of researching.
They're definitely heavier, compared directly to a genuine set but I couldn't be accurate as each wheel had different tyres (Avon versus Cups).
Offset is the same, and dish appears the same but very hard to tell.
Here are some useful pictures: http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=28&a...
The price difference isn't that much IMO. My fake ones apparently cost £700, and you can pick up a genuine set for about £1300. For the weight saving benefit (which is the whole point of the CSL's) I think it's worth it.
ETA: I've recently discovered the manufacturer of my wheels:
Manufacturer : Outlaw
Model : Anarchist
They're definitely heavier, compared directly to a genuine set but I couldn't be accurate as each wheel had different tyres (Avon versus Cups).
Offset is the same, and dish appears the same but very hard to tell.
Here are some useful pictures: http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=28&a...
The price difference isn't that much IMO. My fake ones apparently cost £700, and you can pick up a genuine set for about £1300. For the weight saving benefit (which is the whole point of the CSL's) I think it's worth it.
ETA: I've recently discovered the manufacturer of my wheels:
Manufacturer : Outlaw
Model : Anarchist
Edited by Raify on Thursday 18th June 09:35
Raify,
Lovely car you have there. I was actually on the phone to DL Bristol when you bought it. Had I been 5 mins earlier a deal would have been concluded.
Shame you are having difficulties Ref the wheels. You may be interested to hear that the salesman (I forget his name - perhaps Ben) could not/would not confirm if the wheels were genuine.
Good luck with your case. It seems we are both having a nightmare with our new cars
Lovely car you have there. I was actually on the phone to DL Bristol when you bought it. Had I been 5 mins earlier a deal would have been concluded.
Shame you are having difficulties Ref the wheels. You may be interested to hear that the salesman (I forget his name - perhaps Ben) could not/would not confirm if the wheels were genuine.
Good luck with your case. It seems we are both having a nightmare with our new cars
asbo said:
Raify,
Lovely car you have there. I was actually on the phone to DL Bristol when you bought it. Had I been 5 mins earlier a deal would have been concluded.
Shame you are having difficulties Ref the wheels. You may be interested to hear that the salesman (I forget his name - perhaps Ben) could not/would not confirm if the wheels were genuine.
Good luck with your case. It seems we are both having a nightmare with our new cars
Cheers, it seems that the car was sought after. Someone else emailed me through my PH profile moaning that I'd spoilt their day by buying it. I'd arranged a test drive a week earlier, and had to pull off the m/way on the way to Bristol to give a depost over the phone. Must have been your call that prompted that.Lovely car you have there. I was actually on the phone to DL Bristol when you bought it. Had I been 5 mins earlier a deal would have been concluded.
Shame you are having difficulties Ref the wheels. You may be interested to hear that the salesman (I forget his name - perhaps Ben) could not/would not confirm if the wheels were genuine.
Good luck with your case. It seems we are both having a nightmare with our new cars
The Dealer have been shocking with regards to the wheels. They forged the AUC documents and circumvented their own checks in order to make them look like genuine wheels. Unfortunately I didn't even know that replicas existed when I test drove the car.
Back to topic, I'd definitely be happier with genuine wheels. They're being fitted to a very fast powerful car. How can you be sure the replicas are fit for purpose? I'll definitely be changing my wheels for a genuine set as soon as possible.
Tyres are s
t, Avon ZZ3's. But I knew that they were non approved (but didn't realise they were st) when I test drove it.
I can't do anything, because they offered to accept a full reject for the car. All I wanted was what I thought I was buying.
Hey ho, the car is good, and at least I know not to trust the AUC system on the paper it's written on, or that particular dealer.
Caveat emptor, even on Approved Used BMW's.
t, Avon ZZ3's. But I knew that they were non approved (but didn't realise they were st) when I test drove it.I can't do anything, because they offered to accept a full reject for the car. All I wanted was what I thought I was buying.
Hey ho, the car is good, and at least I know not to trust the AUC system on the paper it's written on, or that particular dealer.
Caveat emptor, even on Approved Used BMW's.
Raify, I know you're pissed off about the way BMW have handled this, and without knowing the law I couldn't say if it's fraud or just sales of goods. But surely you must have seen that the tyres were ditchfinders and not one of the standard BMW tyres (either Continental or Michelin) and should have asked questions then. I know when I went to see mine I was there from 10am to 3pm checking everything out, and that was after a successful HPI check and speaking to the previous owner regarding the CSLs that were on it to make sure they were genuine.
The 'whole point of CSLs' is not the small amount of unsprung weight, but LOOKS. They might provide a little more feedback on the track (due purely to less sidewall flex on the lower & wrong [for Z4M] profile tyres), but most people who say that they are better on the road are just repeating what some of the others are saying, as they don't want to be seen to be going against the crowd by sticking to standard wheels & tyres.
If the 'whole point of CSLs' was weight, then why do they weigh MORE than other 19" wheels and more than standard Z4M wheels. And if owners wanted this weight-loss, why not go out and buy ultra-light magnesium racing wheels.
For your information...
Standard 18" Z4M wheels are 25lbs front and 26lbs rear.
http://bmwfans.info/parts/catalog/E86/Coupe/Europe...
CSL wheels weigh 28lbs front and 30lbs rear.
http://bmwfans.info/parts/catalog/E46/Coupe/Europe...
The 'whole point of CSLs' is not the small amount of unsprung weight, but LOOKS. They might provide a little more feedback on the track (due purely to less sidewall flex on the lower & wrong [for Z4M] profile tyres), but most people who say that they are better on the road are just repeating what some of the others are saying, as they don't want to be seen to be going against the crowd by sticking to standard wheels & tyres.
If the 'whole point of CSLs' was weight, then why do they weigh MORE than other 19" wheels and more than standard Z4M wheels. And if owners wanted this weight-loss, why not go out and buy ultra-light magnesium racing wheels.
For your information...
Standard 18" Z4M wheels are 25lbs front and 26lbs rear.
http://bmwfans.info/parts/catalog/E86/Coupe/Europe...
CSL wheels weigh 28lbs front and 30lbs rear.
http://bmwfans.info/parts/catalog/E46/Coupe/Europe...
When I viewed the car, I didn't even know that replicas existed, and even if I had I would never have thought that this wheel:
Sat on a BMW forecourt on a car in the AUC system was fake.
BMW's own AUC system says that the garage must inform the customer of all non standard parts fitted to the car. Not only did they not do this for the tyres (only Continentals are approved) but they ticked the wheels as approved. Not even genuine CSL's are approved on the Z4, and fakes of a manufacturer they've only just identified definitely aren't.
Perhaps I was a little naive, thinking that I wouldn't have to pour over every inch and minutiae of the car because I had the "peace of mind" of the AUC system. I know better now, not to trust a BMW dealer as far as I could kick him.
Sorry for the thread hijack. Back to topic, if they're manufactured to the same standard and you get a good price then why not. I didn't realise that CSL's were heavier than comparable 19" wheels.
Sat on a BMW forecourt on a car in the AUC system was fake.
BMW's own AUC system says that the garage must inform the customer of all non standard parts fitted to the car. Not only did they not do this for the tyres (only Continentals are approved) but they ticked the wheels as approved. Not even genuine CSL's are approved on the Z4, and fakes of a manufacturer they've only just identified definitely aren't.
Perhaps I was a little naive, thinking that I wouldn't have to pour over every inch and minutiae of the car because I had the "peace of mind" of the AUC system. I know better now, not to trust a BMW dealer as far as I could kick him.
Sorry for the thread hijack. Back to topic, if they're manufactured to the same standard and you get a good price then why not. I didn't realise that CSL's were heavier than comparable 19" wheels.
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