Lotus - better built than a TVR

[Gazzab]

http://pistonheads.co.uk/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&amp...

Well they seem to conclude that Lotuses are better built than TVRs. That is a different opinion to that of a certain Indie I know how works on both marques.

[BLUETHUNDER]

Well i have these two side by side.....





I would say going over both of them,then the fit and finish on the Lotus is far better.Mind you i have a very early Cerb 13th to be precise.So build quality on later ones are proberbly better.

[Edmundo2]

Owned both Chim450 then Elise S1 111s now back into a Tiv, ( Griff 500 ). Both very different and both have a reputation but I've got to say that the Lotus just felt fragile. Ok TVR's are hardly Germanic re build quality but it feels less crashy due to flexibilty of chassis /suspension/tyre wall/seats/carpet etc and as a result they deal with fecked Yorkshire B roads without all the vibration and as a result feel less likely to fall apart. In the Elise I seemed to need something sorting all the time. The aluminium tub and resultant stiffness is fantastic on smooth tarmac but conducts every vibration/noise on anything other. Chapman ethos "Add lightness" comes at a price as many sixties racers found out with every component being built only just strong enough to do the job without falling apart. Great for one race not so as an ownership proposition for a road car!

[grahamw48]

Hmmm, if it drops off I'll fix it, and frankly don't really care...certainly not worth setting up a flaming match over it.

I've owned both marques, and really it's the bottom of my list of 'desirable attributes'. They're hand-built sports cars FFS. If someone wants well-built and reliable, either buy a Porsche for twice the price or maintain the car properly. Rant over.

[900T-R]

grahamw48 said:

They're hand-built sports cars FFS. If someone wants well-built and reliable, either buy a Porsche for twice the price or maintain the car properly. Rant over.

[Englishman]

In my experience the fit, finish, ride and handling of Lotuses (11 at the last count) is superior to TVR's (8 at the last count) but TVR's are faster in a straight line, are more fun around a track (Lotus brakes are the big issue) and more reliable generally. But I like both - a lot!

A couple of pics:

Edited by Englishman on Friday 27th March 20:30

[Derek Smith]

I discussed this topic with two mechanics both of whom had worked on Porches, Ferraries, Lotuses and TVRs. They said that the Lotus twin-cam was a dreadful engine in the early days and had far more problems than the Speed 6. They said it took 'umpteen' years to fix, although I took this to be an exageration. I can't remember exactly what the problms centred on but I think it was overheating and cams. The engine in the Elite was far more difficult to work on for routine servicing than the AJP8 and other minor matters, although when things got serious they both prefered the Lotus TC once it was out of the car. I didn't broach build quality, fit and finish. However, a friend of mine had a Eclat and I wasn't that impressed. That said, it had a few years under its belt. Another had an early Europa and that needed work to get it to the level of the average kit car. Mind you, it went round corners like no other and you could forgive it anything.

But isn't the motoring world a poorer place without Lotus and TVR. Which is better? Who cares. Both are enthusiasts cars. I'd have an Elite alongside my Chimaera any day of the week.

Edited by Derek Smith on Friday 27th March 20:59

[justin220]

I had an S2 Exige then moved onto a T350. Prefered the T350 in every way apart from the steering/handling. Though I would probably say the Exige was better put together.

[Edmundo2]

Graham. No rant just responding to original question. Love em both hence have owned both and bought neither with a view to build quality. Elise was absolutely the business on the right roads but to be honest it seemed circuits were about the only such tarmac suitable what with amount of pot holes and traffic in this neck of the woods! Bought Griff 500 a few weeks ago - goes like the clappers, looks great - rear view mirror shagged so buy replacement ( peugeot 205 ) for £2.50 off ebay. Oh and it's nice to pootle to the shops in to boot!

Edited - Sorry Graham. Re read and see what your saying - post is pointless agreed and your right to get angry when people question build quality of either. I'm they same when people ask me mpg? How the f would I know!

Edited again - £20 per blast!

Edited by Edmundo2 on Friday 27th March 22:22

Edited by Edmundo2 on Friday 27th March 22:29

[Rum Runner]

At least they managed to galvanise some of the chassis.

[grahamw48]

'£20 per blast'.

That's about right.

Have to get to bed....rolling road in the morning...let's see if I can get some more blast per £

[Chimjunkie]

I love LOTUS as much as TVR. The other half has a Lotus Europa S which has various mods and the car is the total dogs danglies!! I do as much social stuff/runs with the lotus bunch as with the TVR lot. Great people all round. The build quality is better with the Lotus, but still plenty of minor things go wrong, rattle squeek etc. But that just puts a smile on our face

Was talking with a fella in the pub the other weekend who just spent £18k modifying his elise!! 320bhp supercharged intercooled Honda engine, all the brake, suspension and relevant upgrades. Thats 420bhp/tonne Wow. May go out for a ride in it this weekend if the weather picks up.

[jammy_basturd]

900T-R said:

grahamw48 said:

They're hand-built sports cars FFS. If someone wants well-built and reliable, either buy a Porsche for twice the price or maintain the car properly. Rant over.

+1

Build quality certainly wasn't on my mind when I considered buying a TVR and I would happily own either marque.

[Rum Runner]

jammy_basturd said:

900T-R said:

grahamw48 said:

They're hand-built sports cars FFS. If someone wants well-built and reliable, either buy a Porsche for twice the price or maintain the car properly. Rant over.

+1

Build quality certainly wasn't on my mind when I considered buying a TVR and I would happily own either marque.

''Well built and reliable , either buy a Porsche'', yes a old one in good nick , not a later certainly not reliable. I have friends with them and they have more problem than any TVR i have had . Luckily they had major issues in the warranty period or they would have to pay somebody fortune to fix it these major issues like all the electronic adjustable socks failing at under 10,000. You would not mind but the guy is super careful and designs Rolls Royce aircraft engines for a living, Oh and 2k a corner at the dealers, Another friend Cayman with water leaks new interior needed , major alarm issues, come back to the car and windows down, boot,oh we have fixed it 4/5 time still the same,roof cables on boxsters having there mountings ripped out cos over tensioned, could write book . I still have friends in the trade and they know of a major Pork dealer ( last year)was averaging 4 major engine warranty issues a week, quite a lot of detonations.You want a good one then go back to the air cooled days .
Not what they are cracked up to be , just like VAG group cars . Know wonder they pay there spin doctors and marketing PR people so much dosh.
Have a look what is mostly on the back of AA relay if you don't believe me.
Also you pay through the nose for the privileged, you don't often here people talking about problems because they want to look like they clever, and bought a well made sensible car and don't want admit the issues they have had.
Never understood there kudos and there's has been plenty up this driveway in the past.......... ?.( expect for the performance elite jobs and early cars).
Sorry Rant over !!!, gone of subject, to much Rum .I think i was trying to TVR's have good reliability (Older style cars with main manufacture designed motors)but are not for people who like to abuse cars....

Edited by Rum Runner on Sunday 29th March 00:10

[Gav T]

The very nature of how the cars are produced just allows for huge variables in quality control, no two cars produced by either manufacture would ever be really comparable like for like. Not least the huge differences that can be found between a Monday morning built car and a Friday afternoon built car. I have owned a 1986 TVR 280i and currently own a 1977 Esprit S1 and I have to say that I think the Lotus is better built and more logically built. But it can't be denied that both cars are fragile and require constant attention to maintain road worthiness.

[JonRB]

I've owned both Lotus and TVR, and I prefer TVR. But both are handbuild British sportscars (ie. need constant fettling) so the difference is probably minor. Go with whatever makes you hard; life is too short to do otherwise.

[nightflight]

I've got a Griff 500 and an Exige S2. They are different animals altogether. The Exige is faster and handles far better, but if I'm going away for a weekend or taking the wife out for a day (she doesn't get out much), I take the TVR. As for build quality, I would put them on a par, but I would also say that the Griffith was better built than some of the later TVR models I have seen. Lotus and TVR are different beasts, but I love them both for different reasons. A bit like the difference between a wife and a mistress !

[Waynester]

nightflight said:

The Exige is faster and handles far better,

Really?? What.. overall on atypical pothole ridden roads or straight line stuff?

[Chimjunkie]

I would agree that the Exige S2 is nearly on par with a 500. I have an extra 30bhp over a std 500 and can see off an S2 comfortably enough (in a straight line!) However, the Exige S (supercharged) is bloody quick and would make mince meat out of a 500 unless up hill and over 100mph...

[Blown2CV]

I don't like the look of Lotii, with the exception of the Esprit, but I have kind of gone off it a bit as I am not 100% that the styling has aged well. Elise has never done it for me and never will.