Further cooling issues...
Discussion
Yes, me again 
Pulled up at parents today only to hear a watery noise from the engine bay. Looks like the hose that goes from the radiator to the pipe leading to the water pump has let go. The jubilee clip (water pump end) is rusted as hell and totally loose and water was firing out under pressure.
I guess that when the water pump died it put lots of strain on the rest of the system which, is now failing.
I'm thinking of getting a new pipe (doesn't look particularly non-standard) and new clips. I probably could get away with just a new clip, but the pipe looks old and hardened.
Does this sound sensible? Anything else I should be checking (except of course more anti-freeze etc).
Pulled up at parents today only to hear a watery noise from the engine bay. Looks like the hose that goes from the radiator to the pipe leading to the water pump has let go. The jubilee clip (water pump end) is rusted as hell and totally loose and water was firing out under pressure.
I guess that when the water pump died it put lots of strain on the rest of the system which, is now failing.
I'm thinking of getting a new pipe (doesn't look particularly non-standard) and new clips. I probably could get away with just a new clip, but the pipe looks old and hardened.
Does this sound sensible? Anything else I should be checking (except of course more anti-freeze etc).
Edited by page3 on Saturday 21st March 13:13
Can anybody else join in now? 
The radiator will only empty down to the level of the leak - so if it's the top hose it will still be pretty full. A new clip should do the trick.
When you refill the system, remember to bleed the rad (bleed valve on top nearside) till water with no air comes out.
The radiator will only empty down to the level of the leak - so if it's the top hose it will still be pretty full. A new clip should do the trick.
When you refill the system, remember to bleed the rad (bleed valve on top nearside) till water with no air comes out.
tvrgit said:
Can anybody else join in now?
The radiator will only empty down to the level of the leak - so if it's the top hose it will still be pretty full. A new clip should do the trick.
When you refill the system, remember to bleed the rad (bleed valve on top nearside) till water with no air comes out.
Feel free The radiator will only empty down to the level of the leak - so if it's the top hose it will still be pretty full. A new clip should do the trick.
When you refill the system, remember to bleed the rad (bleed valve on top nearside) till water with no air comes out.
I did feel a bit lonely here 
The clip that snapped was the one of the ones holding the bottom hose on, so I expected more water to drain. So far put about 1 litre back in. The temperature had only reached about 70deg when the clip snapped, so perhaps this would explain lack of water - although I don't understand why more didn't come out when I removed the hose!
Heater matrix getting hot. Radiator getting hot. Fan switching on at around 90 deg. In/out pipe to radiator getting hot. Water level at top of swirl tank. No overheating if I leave it standing. Water pump being driven round - making swoshy noise.
I *think* this might simply be one of those things. All that tightening of an old clip finally meant it snapped.
Perhaps the time has come for an expert to take a look. I think I'll call Top Cats Monday
I AM learning more about the car though and advice from all of you here (especially tvrgit and Roy who called me) is hugely appreciated.
Don't forget if you only split the system at one point you can end up with a "water lock" stopping the system draining - basically the reverse of an airlock stopping the system filling properly. That could explain the small amount of coolant you lost.
Think about a drinking straw that you dip into water and put your thimb over the end - when you lift it out the water stays in the straw. Break the seal where your thumb is and hey presto water drains out.
Think about a drinking straw that you dip into water and put your thimb over the end - when you lift it out the water stays in the straw. Break the seal where your thumb is and hey presto water drains out.
page3 said:
Looks like the hose is 'ok' but one of the jubilee clips had literally snapped.
Got some new clips and cleaned up the hose. Unfortunately, they didn't have a suitable hose in stock.
We'll see...
I posted a thread couple of months ago about some silicon hoses on ebay which will do the job, http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a... ,Got some new clips and cleaned up the hose. Unfortunately, they didn't have a suitable hose in stock.
We'll see...
The guy is selling them again now if they might be any use to you or anybody else - link for ebay below
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Silicon-water-radiator-hose-...
Edited by MnS on Saturday 21st March 19:53
Morning all
A couple of questions re. removing air blocks if I may...
1) now that the engine had cooled overnight, I opened the swirl-cap. About 2" air so topped up. Immediately, I could hear air escaping, which I tracked to the lower of my new jubilee clips. I also opened up the bleed valve on the radiator and got a bit of air from that too. I then waited at least two minutes until the sound of air escaping from the hose stopped. No water was escaping (from the hose) but I tightened it further and also re-topped up at the swift-tank. I assume this means there was a big air block in the radiator, which hopefully is now removed?
2) The new jubilee clip (the one attaching to the radiator) is tight but keeps on tightening without getting tighter (like a tooth has broken). No air/water seems to be escaping so is this OK or a faulty clip?
LEFT CLIP - the one that keeps spinning
RIGHT CLIP - This is the one that snapped. Air escaped from here (see question 1)
A couple of questions re. removing air blocks if I may...
1) now that the engine had cooled overnight, I opened the swirl-cap. About 2" air so topped up. Immediately, I could hear air escaping, which I tracked to the lower of my new jubilee clips. I also opened up the bleed valve on the radiator and got a bit of air from that too. I then waited at least two minutes until the sound of air escaping from the hose stopped. No water was escaping (from the hose) but I tightened it further and also re-topped up at the swift-tank. I assume this means there was a big air block in the radiator, which hopefully is now removed?
2) The new jubilee clip (the one attaching to the radiator) is tight but keeps on tightening without getting tighter (like a tooth has broken). No air/water seems to be escaping so is this OK or a faulty clip?
LEFT CLIP - the one that keeps spinning
RIGHT CLIP - This is the one that snapped. Air escaped from here (see question 1)
you shouldn't be hearing air escape from the lower hose, unless that RH clip is at a local "high spot" but it doesn't look like it is.
You should be able to see if the LH clip is tightening, or just slipping (as if it's stripped). If it's stripped, change it.
If it's tightening but not getting tighter (if you see what I mean) be careful - the stubs are soft and it's easy, if they get a little bit out of round, to kink them so the a slight V-groove is formed along its length and then you'll NEVER get it to seal no matter how much you tighten the clip. I had this on the top hose and ended up getting a new stub brazed into the radiator.
Are these clips leaking when the engine gets hot? If not, they are probably ok, and getting rid of the air lock in the rad should have sorted your problem.
You should be able to see if the LH clip is tightening, or just slipping (as if it's stripped). If it's stripped, change it.
If it's tightening but not getting tighter (if you see what I mean) be careful - the stubs are soft and it's easy, if they get a little bit out of round, to kink them so the a slight V-groove is formed along its length and then you'll NEVER get it to seal no matter how much you tighten the clip. I had this on the top hose and ended up getting a new stub brazed into the radiator.
Are these clips leaking when the engine gets hot? If not, they are probably ok, and getting rid of the air lock in the rad should have sorted your problem.
Edited by tvrgit on Sunday 22 March 09:57
tvrgit said:
you shouldn't be hearing air escape from the lower hose, unless that RH clip is at a local "high spot" but it doesn't look like it is.
You should be able to see if the LH clip is tightening, or just slipping (as if it's stripped). If it's stripped, change it.
If it's tightening but not getting tighter (if you see what I mean) be careful - the stubs are soft and it's easy, if they get a little bit out of round, to kink them so the a slight V-groove is formed along its length and then you'll NEVER get it to seal no matter how much you tighten the clip. I had this on the top hose and ended up getting a new stub brazed into the radiator.
Are these clips leaking when the engine gets hot? If not, they are probably ok, and getting rid of the air lock in the rad should have sorted your problem.
Morning You should be able to see if the LH clip is tightening, or just slipping (as if it's stripped). If it's stripped, change it.
If it's tightening but not getting tighter (if you see what I mean) be careful - the stubs are soft and it's easy, if they get a little bit out of round, to kink them so the a slight V-groove is formed along its length and then you'll NEVER get it to seal no matter how much you tighten the clip. I had this on the top hose and ended up getting a new stub brazed into the radiator.
Are these clips leaking when the engine gets hot? If not, they are probably ok, and getting rid of the air lock in the rad should have sorted your problem.
Edited by tvrgit on Sunday 22 March 09:57
I assume the air escaping from the hose was due to a) clip not tight enough and b) air in the radiator, which probably explains why more water didn't escape while the hose was off.
Just done a 20 minute drive to do a hot/cold cycle.
The clip attaching on to the radiator (left on photo) is definitely dripping (slightly) so I'll replace it - and buy a few spare! I'm hoping the clips 'come apart' so I don't need to remove the hose again, but we'll see.
Lovely day for a drive though
Edited by page3 on Sunday 22 March 10:43
With jubilee clips there's clips and clips - the cheap ones are rubbish, make sure you get decent quality ones (look at the thickness of the band).
You will probably find that you need to open the bleed screw on the radiator a few times until all the air has gone, and on my V8S the swirlpot was never full to the brim.
You will probably find that you need to open the bleed screw on the radiator a few times until all the air has gone, and on my V8S the swirlpot was never full to the brim.
Barkychoc said:
With jubilee clips there's clips and clips - the cheap ones are rubbish, make sure you get decent quality ones (look at the thickness of the band).
Agree. The new clips I bought in a hurry were fairly weedy and one wouldn't tighten properly. I've now bought different ones which are far more substantial and seem to work better.I'm more annoyed that my instructions to the mechanic were to replace anything that looks like it is wearing out - that policy has given me 5 years of trouble free motoring. The hose must have come off for the water pump to be replaced and the same knackered old rusty clips must have been put back on.
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