RE: Top Teams leave Tuscans
Tuesday 23rd September 2003
Top Teams leave Tuscans
CDL and Hawthorns call it a day
Next year's Tuscan Challenge series will take place without the dominant force of CDL Racing. The team which took Steve Guglielmi to the championship in 2001 and 2002 and has given David Mason a shout at the title this year is to call it a day after the Brands Hatch race this weekend. This year they've run three cars and they will be missed both for their quantity and their quality.
Like other Tuscan teams, CDL have moved into the GT world and it's expected that they will concentrate their efforts on those ambitions next year.
On the back of that announcement Hawthorns Motorsport boss Rod Barrett also announced that he was calling it a day. After enjoying some top places last year with driver Jay Shepherd, this year's team has been limited to Rod Barrett and co driver Jan Persson. So, does Rod really mean it this year? :) Is it the last we've seen of him or will he be persuaded back to do battle with Wayne Phelan for another year?
With CDL out and Hawthorns missing, the series will need some fresh blood. Wildcard Chris Stockton is said to be preparing for a full season so we only hope that Lee Caroline will stick around to fend off the challenger.
Despite small grids this year, we've had one of the most entertaining series for many years. Next year promises some new excitement though with the suspected introduction of the T350C race car in a separate class. Rumoured to be quite a looker, this should attract some new teams to the series and boost grid sizes.
Discussion
We hear predictions on the death of the Tuscan series every year. While offering no criticism to the teams involved, I hope this news, coupled with the MSA's drive to kill off those series it considers to be under subscribed doesn't mean the Tuscans will die off.
T350 racing? Why not, 2 classes as in the GTs would keep the racing interesting and boost grid numbers, it would offer good publicity for TVRs new car (how many times have I heard someone in the crowd ask where they can get a Tuscan like the ones racing) and if facory backed entries by Peter Wheeler and Ben Samuelson could be put forward for next season, it might encourage others to follow.
T350 racing? Why not, 2 classes as in the GTs would keep the racing interesting and boost grid numbers, it would offer good publicity for TVRs new car (how many times have I heard someone in the crowd ask where they can get a Tuscan like the ones racing) and if facory backed entries by Peter Wheeler and Ben Samuelson could be put forward for next season, it might encourage others to follow.
29 Tuscans dead !!! no chance, just because some of us are leaving, that won't put new drivers off, I bet there will be at least as many next year as there has been this season, maybe more!!
Some of us have been in It for a while now, and it's time to move on,
TVR will certainly be glad to see the back of me, as I've been a pain in their whatsit 
for a number of years, however no:5 
and 6 
have nearly finished their course in 
" Tvr and how to really annoy them", so I'll leave my mark 
. Tuscans will be around for years yet or for at least as long as Tvr want to continue to support them, they are still the mutts nuts, and have no equal
It's been great fun, nice people, fantastic racing and good value, so to all the teams and drivers involved, It's been a pleasure, and may you continue to grace our race tracks forever, cheers.
I wouldn't be suprised if I popped up somewhere in GT cup in 2004 but, we will have to see
I have been on a factory tour today, to look at my T350 going through the Trim shop.
Whilst in the racing dept, looking at the prep of the Racing Tuscans, I was told that Peter Wheeler might be driving "something very special at Brands this weekend" but it was touch and go whether it would be ready. When I ask was it the T350R, it wasn't denied
Whilst in the racing dept, looking at the prep of the Racing Tuscans, I was told that Peter Wheeler might be driving "something very special at Brands this weekend" but it was touch and go whether it would be ready. When I ask was it the T350R, it wasn't denied
I was told by TVR some time ago that there was a T350 race car in build and I suppose it is possible that it might be ready for this weekend. The race regs already allow for a second class (class B) in the Tuscan Challenge.
And what better introduction for the new car than in front of a capacity crowd. Ah yes. I forgot. There won't be a crowd on the Saturday, will there?
It will be interesting to see if TVR have been able to make it competitive against the Tuscans.
Bring it on I say
And what better introduction for the new car than in front of a capacity crowd. Ah yes. I forgot. There won't be a crowd on the Saturday, will there?
It will be interesting to see if TVR have been able to make it competitive against the Tuscans.
Bring it on I say
Hi,
It is sad to see the numbers going down.
If you look at David Mason this season he really struggled to raise the money. Therefore the budget required is too high.
We need to think of ways to make it a cheaper category to compete into. (Cheap is meant in the best possible way!)
What I see as the main stumbling blocks are:
The cost of the engine lease and the fact that if you do not have new tyres every race forget about being competitive. On that point I am sure Griff2be will not contradict me.
Why not allow us to own our engines and therefore absorb the cost of buying over a few years (assuming no blow ups), why not reduce the cost of engine lease, or allow us to run a Rover engine. (Even if ultimately less powerful than the AJP). Why not change the tyre compound for something a bit harder.
Whadoyouthink!
Any ideas of your own?
Cheerio
Arnaud
It is sad to see the numbers going down.
If you look at David Mason this season he really struggled to raise the money. Therefore the budget required is too high.
We need to think of ways to make it a cheaper category to compete into. (Cheap is meant in the best possible way!)
What I see as the main stumbling blocks are:
The cost of the engine lease and the fact that if you do not have new tyres every race forget about being competitive. On that point I am sure Griff2be will not contradict me.
Why not allow us to own our engines and therefore absorb the cost of buying over a few years (assuming no blow ups), why not reduce the cost of engine lease, or allow us to run a Rover engine. (Even if ultimately less powerful than the AJP). Why not change the tyre compound for something a bit harder.
Whadoyouthink!
Any ideas of your own?
Cheerio
Arnaud
Well, as a newbie here's my answer.
1) The engine lease. Yes, its a lot of money. But there again, I have competed in 3 rounds and I'm on my third engine. The first had a con rod go, the second a head gasket. Had it been my own engine I would have faced a couple of very large bills. Compared to the amount of money the Mini guys spend on engines, our engine lease is not bad.
2) Tyres. I started off being told that I would probably be able to make a set of tyres last 2 or 3 race weekends. I turned up at the first race meet with a set of secondhand slicks to find one tyre had a flatspot - luckily I had another. I tested on those no problem, then fitted a new set to see me through the next few races. Rockingham was a disaster engine wise - so the slicks were great for Thruxton. However, in getting 9th and 11th at Thruxton, the tyres were completely shagged for Combe. So I had to buy another set. And I'll need another set for Brands.
You do need decent tyres to do well. That's not to say that a good driver can't do well on old tyres -Darren did well last year on a shoestring budget and secondhand tyres. This year I find it difficult to find ANY decent secondhand tyres that I could race on. The 'problem' is that you are only allowed 4 new tyes a race weekend, plus two used. So naturally every driver saves his best two used tyres for the next race. Perhaps harder tyres would help - they would last longer, we would have less grip, be slower, but even more sideways
Overall I think the problem lies with the general state of British Motorsport. It is really difficult to raise sponsorship at any level - and I am still struggling with the whole concept of entry fees at £360-500 a race when there are crowds of 30,000-40,000 paying spectators!!
I fundamentally believe that a day out watching the Tuscans, being involved with a team and having a 'stake' in a particular car, is hugely entertaining and rewarding. I will be spending my winter trying to find people in business, with some money, who would enjoy this involvement. What we need are sponsors who want to be trackside and getting involved, and unfortunately they don't grow on trees.
1) The engine lease. Yes, its a lot of money. But there again, I have competed in 3 rounds and I'm on my third engine. The first had a con rod go, the second a head gasket. Had it been my own engine I would have faced a couple of very large bills. Compared to the amount of money the Mini guys spend on engines, our engine lease is not bad.
2) Tyres. I started off being told that I would probably be able to make a set of tyres last 2 or 3 race weekends. I turned up at the first race meet with a set of secondhand slicks to find one tyre had a flatspot - luckily I had another. I tested on those no problem, then fitted a new set to see me through the next few races. Rockingham was a disaster engine wise - so the slicks were great for Thruxton. However, in getting 9th and 11th at Thruxton, the tyres were completely shagged for Combe. So I had to buy another set. And I'll need another set for Brands.
You do need decent tyres to do well. That's not to say that a good driver can't do well on old tyres -Darren did well last year on a shoestring budget and secondhand tyres. This year I find it difficult to find ANY decent secondhand tyres that I could race on. The 'problem' is that you are only allowed 4 new tyes a race weekend, plus two used. So naturally every driver saves his best two used tyres for the next race. Perhaps harder tyres would help - they would last longer, we would have less grip, be slower, but even more sideways
Overall I think the problem lies with the general state of British Motorsport. It is really difficult to raise sponsorship at any level - and I am still struggling with the whole concept of entry fees at £360-500 a race when there are crowds of 30,000-40,000 paying spectators!!
I fundamentally believe that a day out watching the Tuscans, being involved with a team and having a 'stake' in a particular car, is hugely entertaining and rewarding. I will be spending my winter trying to find people in business, with some money, who would enjoy this involvement. What we need are sponsors who want to be trackside and getting involved, and unfortunately they don't grow on trees.
PetrolTed said:
Wide bodied T350 race car is the order of the day. Hope they can bring it to Brands rather than launch it off the track over the winter...
29 If they do manage to get one to Brands, which will show the removal of a previously lacking ability to react at the right place at the right time, lets hope they don't " launch it off the track" as it would be quite nice to see it in one piece
>> Edited by TUSCAN 29 on Thursday 25th September 10:50
...//P//29 First of all, thanks a bunch to my wonderful crew at Hawthorns, I'll be in later and we will discuss who posted the "prince" thing, good grief, what a stupid name, sounds like a diesel tag.
James, thanks for your suggestion, but it's over the top, and 100% untrue, I can think of many great Tuscan drivers, but I'm not one of them. I'll take it that you had your tongue firmly in your cheek when you thought of it.
Following on from the last suggestion,maybe something along the lines of "GTc-geemmm". Clue:" A little vexing,and there are only two out of a possible twenty" Think about it.
My wife came up with a good one, "slowman", I like that. !!!
PetrolTed said:
Ahh... 
Interesting that you should be considering that route. I've been talking to the coordinator of that plan too.
Glad you got that Ted, I was never any good at crosswords, except the current bun one that is
. I can sort of make something of the 'two out of twenty' bit but thats a long stab and I didn't think there were enough of them left, probably way off track
(pun intended btw) Harry
, although the Turbos were very quick in their day, but didn't stop or turn very well, apparently PetrolTed said:
Well, there's no secret about it as far as I know - there are a number of teams evaluating VX220s for GT Cup next year.
220 No fooling our Ted,
so if you have spoken to CB you'll know that there's a lot more to it, but lets keep that to ourselves just for the moment. Fun isn't it. Gassing Station | General Motorsport | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff