2.4 JTD engine.

[Beemer-5]

Several magazines have said that the 5-pot derv engine is gutless and way down on shove under 2,000 rpm and all done by 4,200 rpm, an incredibly narrow powerband.
Anyone with a car with this engine---do you agree?

[Wombat Rick]

The older versions 10 valve 150bhp and 20valve 175bhp were superb. No lag, and revved to 5,000 happily. The 200bhp version launched in the Brera and 159 is not quite as sprightly and does suffer some noticeable lag unfortunately. However it does need a lot of miles to loosen up. Mine's got 15,000 on it now and it's better. It will rev to 5,000 - quickly too. The latest version has got 210bhp but more significantly it has a lower torque curve so is less laggy. Both the new versions - 200 & 210 - have diesel particulate filters as standard which means no black clouds at the back, but they have had a detrimental impact on the economy, so by helping the environment we are using more fuel...

[sjg]

I'd hardly call it gutless. It is much more linear than most which can make it feel less quick. Mine pulls well from 1500rpm to 4000+.

It is a very different delivery from engines like the VAG ones - which have a noticable "shove in the back" at torque peak but then drop right off.

[Wombat Rick]

sjg said:

It is a very different delivery from engines like the VAG ones

Thankfully!!

Both the 4 and 5 pot JTDs have a pretty linear delivery which as you say is in stark contract to the VAG units. I do think the 5 pot is perhaps being pushed a bit too far now and isn't quite as "nice" as the earlier versions but it's still a very desirable and characterful engine.

[Beemer-5]

They basically say that the new 200/210 engines are peaky.

[Wombat Rick]

Beemer-5 said:

They basically say that the new 200/210 engines are peaky.

Peakier than before would be my conclusion. 210 is an improvement though. Both need lots of miles on them - any test on a brand new 2.4 will show it at it's worse.

[Beemer-5]

I'd like to try the new 210 version.

[Beemer-5]

The problem for many derv makers, is the 335d/535d/635d/123d engines.
They have moved the game on dramatically.

[SCOOTERMAN]

On the subject of the 5-cylinder engine and age, what ever became of it's supposed successor? A 3.0 twin-turbo V6 being developed by VM exclusively for Alfa Romeo and the 159/166 replacement? Lots of fanfare for both engine and car, and yet so far...nothing

[Beemer-5]

Hondas very low emission 3-litre V6 TD is due out next year.
The 250 bhp/380 lbs-ft engine is going to give other makers a headache or three.

[Welshbeef]

Beemer-5 said:

The problem for many derv makers, is the 335d/535d/635d/123d engines.
They have moved the game on dramatically.

Been a while Beemer!

Full agree - BMW have moved the game on and when the other makers i.e. VW with their TT 2ltr 200bhp TDI comes out late late this year Im sure a few tweekings of the 123d will see them well ahead yet again.

Well done BMW great units - only drawback is the very high list prices.... but thats pretty much it IMHO.

Honda do have the 3ltr TDI coming out early next year and knowing what great units they make this should push the game back to BMW with their 330d - which has been sat at 231bhp for far too long now 05 reg.... nearly 3 years and no increase in power or Torque.

[pbarlow0032]

Welshbeef, i think the 2.0 TDI TT coming out later in the year is just 170bhp, presumably the same engine currently in use in the A3, Golf etc

[Welshbeef]

pbarlow0032 said:

Welshbeef, i think the 2.0 TDI TT coming out later in the year is just 170bhp, presumably the same engine currently in use in the A3, Golf etc

I dont mean the TT I mean Twin turbo 2.0Ltr TDI. The higher output 2.0 ltr TDI VAG already pushes out a conservative 170bhp.

[Beemer-5]

I just love the thought of that 493 bhp/738 lbs-ft Audi V12!

But, on a smaller scale, the 123d has made it tough for many derv makers.
Alpina already get 220 bhp and 330 lbs-ft from the little 1998cc oil-burning 4-pot.
That's well decent, coupled with 35 mpg average.

[Wombat Rick]

Welshbeef said:

Well done BMW great units - only drawback is the very high list prices.... but thats pretty much it IMHO.

They are fantastic engines. They just need to bolt them into a car which looks good and has an interior which makes me want to spend some time in it.

[kylemrushall]

Beemer-5 said:

Several magazines have said that the 5-pot derv engine is gutless and way down on shove under 2,000 rpm and all done by 4,200 rpm, an incredibly narrow powerband.
Anyone with a car with this engine---do you agree?

to get back on topic, i have had several Audis and Golfs and my 156 2.4 jtd is quicker and much more characterful than any boring old vag machine. Gutless.... i dont think so!!! it sounds great and revs to 5k no probs.

The 2.4 JTD 159 TI, wow now thats an awesome bit of kit.

[pbarlow0032]

Sorry Welshbeef, my misinterpretation. I didn't realise VAG/Audi had any twin turbo 2 litre diesels in the pipeline. Any idea when these are expected to appear, and what cars it'll be available in?

Thanks,
Paul

[Welshbeef]

pbarlow0032 said:

Sorry Welshbeef, my misinterpretation. I didn't realise VAG/Audi had any twin turbo 2 litre diesels in the pipeline. Any idea when these are expected to appear, and what cars it'll be available in?

Thanks,
Paul

I read about it a little while ago in Autocar/Autoexpress late 2008/early 2009. I think it will appear in the Forthcoming Mk6 Golf (which is due very soon).

[cirvy]

kylemrushall said:

Beemer-5 said:

Several magazines have said that the 5-pot derv engine is gutless and way down on shove under 2,000 rpm and all done by 4,200 rpm, an incredibly narrow powerband.
Anyone with a car with this engine---do you agree?

The 2.4 JTD 159 TI, wow now thats an awesome bit of kit.

I must admit, my current dream Alfa would be a chipped 159 2.4 ti

[Hoover.]

as said above.... the current diesels by Alpha are so linear there is no umph.... they may be quick on paper but as driving experience not so much fun....

I guess thats what I get for trying to save £3k cash on company car tax over 4yrs..... I've got to live with ot now, or leave the company I've been working for fdor 20yrs.....

at least I've got the TVR