Rockingham classic TVR pics
Discussion
Hi All,
Had a bit of time on my hands yesterday so I have uploaded some pictures of classic TVR's from the Rockingham 60th anniversary weekend.
http://community.webshots.com/album/562068230YUpgb...
Enjoy, especially if your car is in any of the pics.
Ron McCubbin
Had a bit of time on my hands yesterday so I have uploaded some pictures of classic TVR's from the Rockingham 60th anniversary weekend.
http://community.webshots.com/album/562068230YUpgb...
Enjoy, especially if your car is in any of the pics.
Ron McCubbin
Hi Ron
My car is there,
thanks for posting pic's. It must have been a Saturday shot, I went on the Saturday from Manchester area, decided to go back on Sunday(after getting home)but broke down just after Bimingham,fuel pump died,try getting a fuel pump for an Essex on a Sunday,no chance,trailered home.
OH mines the blue one with Taimar SE on the side
My car is there,
thanks for posting pic's. It must have been a Saturday shot, I went on the Saturday from Manchester area, decided to go back on Sunday(after getting home)but broke down just after Bimingham,fuel pump died,try getting a fuel pump for an Essex on a Sunday,no chance,trailered home.OH mines the blue one with Taimar SE on the side
Edited by TaimarSE on Friday 11th January 09:07
Hi Garry,
I think we both had a chat on the Saturday of the meeting, were you there with your son?? Appologies if I'm wrong. Sorry to hear about the fuel pump problem, the Sunday was a really good day as well but rather hot and there were a few TVR's doing the record bid that didn't like the heat, I think the 1st car to dive for cover was the sister car to yours, the red/yellow one with the thin black band. (pic number 10)
After the journey down where I saw the temp gauge head for the top end of the scale I didn't risk taking it out onto the track for the record just in case something decided to go pop. I left for North Scotland at 11:45 pm on the Sunday night, it was nice and cool and the car didn't miss a beat, really enjoyed the A1 M1 at daft o'clock in the morning. Totally empty, so very good progress was made and not a police car in sight.
Enjoy the pics and no doubt both our SE's will be at another big bash.
Ron
I think we both had a chat on the Saturday of the meeting, were you there with your son?? Appologies if I'm wrong. Sorry to hear about the fuel pump problem, the Sunday was a really good day as well but rather hot and there were a few TVR's doing the record bid that didn't like the heat, I think the 1st car to dive for cover was the sister car to yours, the red/yellow one with the thin black band. (pic number 10)
After the journey down where I saw the temp gauge head for the top end of the scale I didn't risk taking it out onto the track for the record just in case something decided to go pop. I left for North Scotland at 11:45 pm on the Sunday night, it was nice and cool and the car didn't miss a beat, really enjoyed the A1 M1 at daft o'clock in the morning. Totally empty, so very good progress was made and not a police car in sight.
Enjoy the pics and no doubt both our SE's will be at another big bash.
Ron
Hi Ron
You are right, I was with my son, and yes the red and yellow Taimar SE is a sister to my car but in name only. My SE is not a Turbo and is not one of the original 3 SE Taimar Turbo's Built(but can be seen here http://www.tvr-m.com/TVRhome.htm in the SE section. My car was built to as a special order in 1981, it used a show chassis and had chrome plated wishbones(check your rear wishbones they maybe chrome like the fronts) anti roll bar etc. Std 3000 Essex engine. This car lived in Aberdeen until 2002 and then moved further north to Golspie (north east) Scotland. I had the pleasure of driving her home in 2006,432 miles to be exact.Fuel pump sorted now i Bought a new mechanical pump but it did not look as well made as the original and it did'nt have the nylon foot on the actuating arm, anyway I now use a Facet red top electric pump and a Filter King fiter/regulator and keep the mechanicl as a backup just in case, Not being a Turbo means luckily I have no temperature issues.
I will look forward to seeing you at the next major meet. I can see why you only do the majors being in Scotland.Even centrally organised majors are one hell of a way away.
Garry
You are right, I was with my son, and yes the red and yellow Taimar SE is a sister to my car but in name only. My SE is not a Turbo and is not one of the original 3 SE Taimar Turbo's Built(but can be seen here http://www.tvr-m.com/TVRhome.htm in the SE section. My car was built to as a special order in 1981, it used a show chassis and had chrome plated wishbones(check your rear wishbones they maybe chrome like the fronts) anti roll bar etc. Std 3000 Essex engine. This car lived in Aberdeen until 2002 and then moved further north to Golspie (north east) Scotland. I had the pleasure of driving her home in 2006,432 miles to be exact.Fuel pump sorted now i Bought a new mechanical pump but it did not look as well made as the original and it did'nt have the nylon foot on the actuating arm, anyway I now use a Facet red top electric pump and a Filter King fiter/regulator and keep the mechanicl as a backup just in case, Not being a Turbo means luckily I have no temperature issues.
I will look forward to seeing you at the next major meet. I can see why you only do the majors being in Scotland.Even centrally organised majors are one hell of a way away.
Garry
Edited by TaimarSE on Friday 11th January 16:20
Nice to see some honesty among the "SE" owners.
I'm anti-replica and things classic that pretend and are less than honest. Apologies to those I offend, but there are a few cars pretending to be SEs that aren't. If they left the factory as SEs they are, convereted or otherwise they aint..
I'm anti-replica and things classic that pretend and are less than honest. Apologies to those I offend, but there are a few cars pretending to be SEs that aren't. If they left the factory as SEs they are, convereted or otherwise they aint..
Edited by Daftlad on Friday 11th January 20:59
Thats funny
and good timing Dave following Johns post given your profile are you two a double act
Out of interest and no insinuation that anybody is questioning authenticity.
I have a letter from TVR in the file that came with the car,the second owner wrote to TVR in 1986 and judging by the response received it looks like he asked about the car authenticity. The letter confirms the cars birth year and that the chassis was their 'show' chassis with many chromed suspension part and the fact that it was a one off order costing over £12,000 in 1981 it mentions that no more than half a dozen SE body shells made and all but one were sold in this country and the exception sold to a customer in Belgium.
It goes on to say that no handbooks were ever printed for the SE models or indeed the Taimars and the only handbook relating to the car is the 3000M which you already have. it goes on to mention the names of the spares manager and service manager etc.
The letter is on TVR headed paper(it could be fake)how would I know. I have been a fan of TVR's since I was 15 (you hear an M topping what I imagine was second gear and slipping into third for the first time and your hooked)but never bought one until 1986 (I mean dream cars are dream cars, you don't own them)but being a fan and 18months of ownership does not make me an expert.
Yawn,my wife has just left on a little shopping trip to Barcelona,bed at 1 up at 3:15 to late/early to go to bed now.coffee me thinks.
Garry
and good timing Dave following Johns post given your profile are you two a double actOut of interest and no insinuation that anybody is questioning authenticity.
I have a letter from TVR in the file that came with the car,the second owner wrote to TVR in 1986 and judging by the response received it looks like he asked about the car authenticity. The letter confirms the cars birth year and that the chassis was their 'show' chassis with many chromed suspension part and the fact that it was a one off order costing over £12,000 in 1981 it mentions that no more than half a dozen SE body shells made and all but one were sold in this country and the exception sold to a customer in Belgium.
It goes on to say that no handbooks were ever printed for the SE models or indeed the Taimars and the only handbook relating to the car is the 3000M which you already have. it goes on to mention the names of the spares manager and service manager etc.
The letter is on TVR headed paper(it could be fake)how would I know. I have been a fan of TVR's since I was 15 (you hear an M topping what I imagine was second gear and slipping into third for the first time and your hooked)but never bought one until 1986 (I mean dream cars are dream cars, you don't own them)but being a fan and 18months of ownership does not make me an expert.
Yawn,my wife has just left on a little shopping trip to Barcelona,bed at 1 up at 3:15 to late/early to go to bed now.coffee me thinks.
Garry
Daftlad said:
Nice to see some honesty among the "SE" owners.
Come on John, give us the answer,
MY thoughts are 4 OE....WEEELLL one silver Turbo, was first converted to SE and 3 customer order cars .....it does not help when the 4 SE's were not original SE's to start with. Then 3 Turbos taken back to the factory TO BE converted to SE (2 as retro fit to perfectly good cars and 1 accident damaged and converted).
Non Turbo's 4 OE and 2 retro fit at factory.
I know there are the other car then converted, but are you happy with the list so far.
Adrian@
PS Surely a car take back to the factory and converted there can claim the SE title. AS LONG as we know that they are what they are?
Adrian@
Adrian@ said:
Daftlad said:
Nice to see some honesty among the "SE" owners.
Come on John, give us the answer,
MY thoughts are 4 OE....WEEELLL one silver Turbo, was first converted to SE and 3 customer order cars .....it does not help when the 4 SE's were not original SE's to start with. Then 3 Turbos taken back to the factory TO BE converted to SE (2 as retro fit to perfectly good cars and 1 accident damaged and converted).
Non Turbo's 4 OE and 2 retro fit at factory.
I know there are the other car then converted, but are you happy with the list so far.
Adrian@
PS Surely a car take back to the factory and converted there can claim the SE title. AS LONG as we know that they are what they are?
Adrian@
My opinion, and I think it will be supported by historians and model registras (certainly it was by Mervyn Larner). If it was first sold in SE form it's an SE, it it wasn't, it's simply a replica.
Just because the factory did the work, it still does not make it any more authentic, just a better replica ......maybe.
You know as well as I do how many genuine cars there - it's well enough documented
. There are at least 2 well known Turbo M SE "replicas" and a well known Taimar Turbo SE replica. Th term M Turbo SE replica is an odd one though.... as there were no orignals.
Quite a few non Turbo SE replicas, including a quite well known S.
Edited by Daftlad on Saturday 12th January 15:14
Edited by Daftlad on Saturday 12th January 15:30
Colin
Thanks for that, much appreciated you are the first person to recognise the car, can I take it you remember it as Non Turbo SE ?
From what I have been told and found through documentation John Mclean sold the car to a friend of his called David Polson in 1986 who at the time had a blue 2500M reg NCN 17*R, he also lived in Aberdeen,I have a picture of both cars together that was in the SE file, judging by the MOT's and verbal information from the third owner Bruce Shelley,the man I bought the car off. Bruce told me he knew David and that the car was garaged at Davids mums house in 1994 I have all the MOT's from the 1st in 1985 to the last expiring in 1994 that appear to verify this. Bruce bought the car in 2004 took the body of,stripped and powder coated the chassis and painted over it in the green Hammerite finish that it had as a show chassis.Bruce left the body and interior as it was and concentrated on the running gear buying parts from Adrian, sTeVeR and DG according to receipts I have.
So in my opinion what I have is an orignal condition body sporting its original paint and original Taimar SE decals and interior plus a nice chassis and running gear.
So John and Adrian is my car an original SE or not ? I am now very interested as I did not know there was any controversy about SE models.
Can you point me in the right direction to these well documented facts so I can further investigate?
Garry
Thanks for that, much appreciated you are the first person to recognise the car, can I take it you remember it as Non Turbo SE ?
From what I have been told and found through documentation John Mclean sold the car to a friend of his called David Polson in 1986 who at the time had a blue 2500M reg NCN 17*R, he also lived in Aberdeen,I have a picture of both cars together that was in the SE file, judging by the MOT's and verbal information from the third owner Bruce Shelley,the man I bought the car off. Bruce told me he knew David and that the car was garaged at Davids mums house in 1994 I have all the MOT's from the 1st in 1985 to the last expiring in 1994 that appear to verify this. Bruce bought the car in 2004 took the body of,stripped and powder coated the chassis and painted over it in the green Hammerite finish that it had as a show chassis.Bruce left the body and interior as it was and concentrated on the running gear buying parts from Adrian, sTeVeR and DG according to receipts I have.
So in my opinion what I have is an orignal condition body sporting its original paint and original Taimar SE decals and interior plus a nice chassis and running gear.
So John and Adrian is my car an original SE or not ? I am now very interested as I did not know there was any controversy about SE models.
Can you point me in the right direction to these well documented facts so I can further investigate?
Garry
John, no pops intended or received... Turbo variants are well listed for what they are, Perhaps the A/C denotes the 3 Taimars as SE, as I do not know of any of the SE ..conversions/replica/copies that added that into the equation. (I might be wrong on the A/C thing and I cannot remember if Stewarts, the 3000SE has A/C). I also like to put these thing correctly in their place, and I,m sort of glad people hold strong views on the subject.
Whats your thoughts on the 64th Turbo? Missed by Robson? Left as a non-turbo converted later?
Adrian@
Whats your thoughts on the 64th Turbo? Missed by Robson? Left as a non-turbo converted later?
Adrian@
TaimarSE said:
.... is my car an original SE or not ? I am now very interested as I did not know there was any controversy about SE models.
Garry,There will always be 'controversy' over anything TVR, even the number of Sagaris's built (126)
TVR built 3 Taimar Turbo SEs,one 3000S SE and one Taimar SE (yours). That's the official version. Unoffically, others have converted cars to 'SE spec', some by just modifying the bodywork.
I saw your car at Rockingham and Papplewick, but, as everyone knows, I'm too shy to speak to people
It's a TVR, enjoy it.
Adrian,
Are you refering to PRW's White Turbo M? If so, not sure what to think.
Garry,
Without doing some reasearch I could not comment, as Adrian states, the Turbos are well documented, the N/A cars posibly less so. Jim Mclean should be able to verify it's authenticity - he's a nice enough guy and would not mislead anyone.
I revert however to my original thoughts. If it originally left the factory as an SE, it is one, if not...
Are you refering to PRW's White Turbo M? If so, not sure what to think.
Garry,
Without doing some reasearch I could not comment, as Adrian states, the Turbos are well documented, the N/A cars posibly less so. Jim Mclean should be able to verify it's authenticity - he's a nice enough guy and would not mislead anyone.
I revert however to my original thoughts. If it originally left the factory as an SE, it is one, if not...
Edited by Daftlad on Saturday 12th January 18:42
Garry, I have never known your car to be anything other than a SE.
WE, John, Colin and I have just been around TVR's a little too long!
John, PRW would perhaps know the answer.
Adrian@
I have his original Turbo Taimar in at the moment...I am sure that he would love to see the how it has evolved.
WE, John, Colin and I have just been around TVR's a little too long!
John, PRW would perhaps know the answer.
Adrian@
I have his original Turbo Taimar in at the moment...I am sure that he would love to see the how it has evolved.
Daftlad said:
Adrian,
Heres food for thought. If the insurance world documented repairs to cars as well then as they are now, how many "SEs" would be be registered Cat C or Cat D...not a nice thought, but I would guess more than 75% of them.
This is true, but it works both ways, I've fought the corner that you can replace the chassis completely and have the car assessed prior to being put back on the road.....and would advise any damaged Turbo owner that it is 'possible' argue and win the car back. I hasten to add that it is ALMOST too late to argue that point if the car has been allowed to go to a salvage company after an accident, Here is where the Robson book helps, in respect of the facts in black and white. Heres food for thought. If the insurance world documented repairs to cars as well then as they are now, how many "SEs" would be be registered Cat C or Cat D...not a nice thought, but I would guess more than 75% of them.
Adrian@
It really does sound bad when you quote it as a percentage, when we are taking of how many cars! I suppose that's what keeps me rebuilding my own cars as soon a I get them, corrective maintenance from previous owners and check the chassis for accident damage.
Adrian@ said:
Daftlad said:
Adrian,
Heres food for thought. If the insurance world documented repairs to cars as well then as they are now, how many "SEs" would be be registered Cat C or Cat D...not a nice thought, but I would guess more than 75% of them.
This is true, but it works both ways, I've fought the corner that you can replace the chassis completely and have the car assessed prior to being put back on the road.....and would advise any damaged Turbo owner that it is 'possible' argue and win the car back. I hasten to add that it is ALMOST too late to argue that point if the car has been allowed to go to a salvage company after an accident, Here is where the Robson book helps, in respect of the facts in black and white. Heres food for thought. If the insurance world documented repairs to cars as well then as they are now, how many "SEs" would be be registered Cat C or Cat D...not a nice thought, but I would guess more than 75% of them.
Adrian@
It really does sound bad when you quote it as a percentage, when we are taking of how many cars! I suppose that's what keeps me rebuilding my own cars as soon a I get them, corrective maintenance from previous owners and check the chassis for accident damage.
Case rested, I've said my peice.
Edited by Daftlad on Saturday 12th January 21:30
Hands up!
When was the last one created?
I know I would like to find the sister car to Olivers, that was stolen and never recovered (a blue 3000s with Turbo conversion with SE arches and walnut dash, that the owner got paid out as a 3000S, rightly so, insurance company's ask the questions, before they pay out)
Hey ho..
That's me for the day.....
Adrian@
When was the last one created?
I know I would like to find the sister car to Olivers, that was stolen and never recovered (a blue 3000s with Turbo conversion with SE arches and walnut dash, that the owner got paid out as a 3000S, rightly so, insurance company's ask the questions, before they pay out)
Hey ho..
That's me for the day.....
Adrian@
Terminator said:
I saw your car at Rockingham and Papplewick, but, as everyone knows, I'm too shy to speak to people
Colin Thanks once again for your input, may I ask if it was you who asked my son Matt at Papplewick if had I bought the car from a man in Scotland called Bruce? On answering yes, the man said that'll be the unblown SE then. If so you made his day.
Colin on the subject of Papplewick, and specials there was a gorgeous red S with a very different back end. Is this the same car as the one on page 91 in Robsons book? It looks like it but has had a boot lid added with concealed hinges . I ask because you were there and I doubt you would have missed it. While I am on about Robsons book is this an SE Turbo on page 120,I notice that the wheels look to have a deep flat dish on the outer rim not like mine or any others I saw at Rockingham ?
Adrian. Thanks for your thoughts on my SE
John I don't think I could contact Jim Mclean for authenticity,if I did and it is proved authentic then the doubters will still doubt. After all I am the owner I could be seen as fabricating for my own interest.
I notice that in Robsons book the details on the Turbo cars, it's a pity other specials don't have this, how should I say protection like The 10 Martin specials and others.
Garry
Edited by TaimarSE on Sunday 13th January 11:44
Edited by TaimarSE on Sunday 13th January 11:45
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