RE: History Repeating?
Thursday 6th December 2001
History Repeating?
Can we learn from history or is Ted a pie short of a picnic?
Discussion
"It is the common fate of the indolent to see their rights become a prey to the active. The condition upon which God hath given liberty to man is eternal vigilance; which condition if he break, servitude is at once the consequence of his crime and the punishment of his guilt."
John Philpot Curran: Speech upon the Right of Election (1790)
Britain is now a police state. Read Goerge Orwell's 1984. Frighteningly familiar stuff. FIGHT THE POWER !!!
John Philpot Curran: Speech upon the Right of Election (1790)
Britain is now a police state. Read Goerge Orwell's 1984. Frighteningly familiar stuff. FIGHT THE POWER !!!
Well Said PetrolTed (he's a poet and doesn't know it!)
This is NOT a rant!!! It's the plain truth! What with the report in todays papers about "errant" MP's being physically assaulted by Führer Blairs thugs (SD + Gestapo comes to mind) I'd be very careful who I vote for next time around.......
Politically Correct, never; I speak my mind and if others don't like it they'll have to lump it. I'll accept anothers opinion (may not agree) but I've fought for my peoples rights to speak their mind! It's time to speak out chaps and do something about it!!!!
This is NOT a rant!!! It's the plain truth! What with the report in todays papers about "errant" MP's being physically assaulted by Führer Blairs thugs (SD + Gestapo comes to mind) I'd be very careful who I vote for next time around.......
Politically Correct, never; I speak my mind and if others don't like it they'll have to lump it. I'll accept anothers opinion (may not agree) but I've fought for my peoples rights to speak their mind! It's time to speak out chaps and do something about it!!!!
ok, we all agree.. but *what* do we do about it?
This next bit may not be relevant to most readers of PH, but what applies here, will one day apply to sports cars too. Read on..
"I heard the TRUTH that all bikers feared yesterday, from a friendly traffic cop - they ARE out to get bikers."
I wish I had taped the conversation.
Won't be long, first you're gonna see a reduction in hi-po bikes, then NO bikes. Then the attack on big engined sports cars begins, if it hasn't already happened. Then we'll have been Eurocized. It's happening via insurance costs for bikes, and combined with the new speed obsession, we don't have a lot going for us.
This next bit may not be relevant to most readers of PH, but what applies here, will one day apply to sports cars too. Read on..
"I heard the TRUTH that all bikers feared yesterday, from a friendly traffic cop - they ARE out to get bikers."
I wish I had taped the conversation.
Won't be long, first you're gonna see a reduction in hi-po bikes, then NO bikes. Then the attack on big engined sports cars begins, if it hasn't already happened. Then we'll have been Eurocized. It's happening via insurance costs for bikes, and combined with the new speed obsession, we don't have a lot going for us.
love is Ted, i totaly agrea with you on every thnig you have said but I don't give a sh1t about the masses and what they think, I will speak my own mind just like JMGS4 and hertbiker and if people don't like it they can lump it 
All I can say is Keep it real Keep it hear at PistonHeads because we all know that Speed Maters
Edited by campbell on Thursday 6th December 17:37
All I can say is Keep it real Keep it hear at PistonHeads because we all know that Speed Maters
Edited by campbell on Thursday 6th December 17:37
What, when and where ??
As an aside, I was taught that laws were effectively based on morality, and as such change (i.e obscene publications act) when society changes. I read somewhere that about 60-70% of people regularly speed which would indicate that in todays modern society more speed is needed to get where you want to go quicker, and that speed limits are not morally binding. So, as we are in the Majority, lets get that damn laws changed and get these IMHO whingin Labour Hypoctrites out.
Edited by Jason F on Thursday 6th December 11:10
As an aside, I was taught that laws were effectively based on morality, and as such change (i.e obscene publications act) when society changes. I read somewhere that about 60-70% of people regularly speed which would indicate that in todays modern society more speed is needed to get where you want to go quicker, and that speed limits are not morally binding. So, as we are in the Majority, lets get that damn laws changed and get these IMHO whingin Labour Hypoctrites out.
Edited by Jason F on Thursday 6th December 11:10
I was very interested buy the SUV discussion the other day.
It seems even our own ranks have been brainwashed by the last few years of Government (Conservative AND Labour) 'mind control'.
Why are we banging on about the damage bull bars do to pedestrians? What are the pedestrians doing on the road, in front of the vehicle, in the first place? Why do they now choose to show cars ploughing people down on their 'public safety' TV ads, but the old Green Cross Code "stop, look & listen" stuff is no longer mentioned?
I'm all for people driving carefully and considerately in built up areas, but for f*ck sake, lets remind people, particularly kids, to be mindful of traffic.
Marcus
& Ocean Haze Griff 500
It seems even our own ranks have been brainwashed by the last few years of Government (Conservative AND Labour) 'mind control'.
Why are we banging on about the damage bull bars do to pedestrians? What are the pedestrians doing on the road, in front of the vehicle, in the first place? Why do they now choose to show cars ploughing people down on their 'public safety' TV ads, but the old Green Cross Code "stop, look & listen" stuff is no longer mentioned?
I'm all for people driving carefully and considerately in built up areas, but for f*ck sake, lets remind people, particularly kids, to be mindful of traffic.
Marcus
& Ocean Haze Griff 500
That is just what I said in the NIP thread: Quote below.
"I have always been a subscriber to the notion that driver training is the key - not more and more rules and regulations.
I am but 21 but I have had more training in the past four years than 99% of all other road users (Test, Theory Test, Pass Plus, IAM, Skid Pan, Track Training). I know that I have only been on the road for four years but over that time I have covered over 100,000 miles and never had any incidents that were unavoidable (such as a cow jumping into the side of my car!) and certainly none that were my fault.
I feel this is because I have benefited from the extensive training I was given.
But I bloody well don't potter along at 30mph. I enjoy a spirited drive like the next PistonHead and have been paying through my teeth to enjoy a 200bhp car since the age of 19. Nothing is more exciting than pushing the thresholds of you and your cars performance but it has always been within the margins of my training.
Speed is fine when coupled with the right car, and especially with the right driver.
An old fart that only had to prove that he was of sound health to receive a licence AND THATS IT is bound to sneer at the safer but faster driver overtaking his Hillman Imp as it wheezes its way along. Unfortunately this is also the sort of person that has the sort of emptiness in life that needs to be filled with a whinging letter to the powers that be. The sheer numbers of complainers on our roads coupled with the easy money attitude of the Government and Police Forces means that their selfish demands are met. Thus the result is more speed bumps, limits, cameras, calming devices, lower DD limits and negative propaganda.
When will the government take a look at the driver AND THE PEDESTRIANS rather than the speeds their cars are doing and see that this is the problem.
A licence is compulsory for a driver but the wild variations of standards that drivers on our roads displayed to attain these is quite scary. But a pedestrian (reputed to be the cause of 73% of all road related fatalities) needs no licence to stagger in front of our cars - and don’t even get me started on bloody horses and cyclists.
Uncle Tony should train us all better rather than punishing the enthusiastic drivers for our moments of 'lunacy'.
But that would not make the police any money, so I think we are all buggered."
So; well said Ted. This country needs an uprising and I for one am prepared to chain myself to a TVR if that is what is needed (I hope).
The zombies of society need to be educated with the truth, not spoon fed meaningless bollocks such as that feckin add with the fool running down the kid (anyone noticed the locked tires?? - a sure way of increasing your stopping distance by a sh!tload). This is propoganda pure and simple and I despise it.
Do you think the PistonHeads could stand as a viable political party?
No?
Oh well.
"I have always been a subscriber to the notion that driver training is the key - not more and more rules and regulations.
I am but 21 but I have had more training in the past four years than 99% of all other road users (Test, Theory Test, Pass Plus, IAM, Skid Pan, Track Training). I know that I have only been on the road for four years but over that time I have covered over 100,000 miles and never had any incidents that were unavoidable (such as a cow jumping into the side of my car!) and certainly none that were my fault.
I feel this is because I have benefited from the extensive training I was given.
But I bloody well don't potter along at 30mph. I enjoy a spirited drive like the next PistonHead and have been paying through my teeth to enjoy a 200bhp car since the age of 19. Nothing is more exciting than pushing the thresholds of you and your cars performance but it has always been within the margins of my training.
Speed is fine when coupled with the right car, and especially with the right driver.
An old fart that only had to prove that he was of sound health to receive a licence AND THATS IT is bound to sneer at the safer but faster driver overtaking his Hillman Imp as it wheezes its way along. Unfortunately this is also the sort of person that has the sort of emptiness in life that needs to be filled with a whinging letter to the powers that be. The sheer numbers of complainers on our roads coupled with the easy money attitude of the Government and Police Forces means that their selfish demands are met. Thus the result is more speed bumps, limits, cameras, calming devices, lower DD limits and negative propaganda.
When will the government take a look at the driver AND THE PEDESTRIANS rather than the speeds their cars are doing and see that this is the problem.
A licence is compulsory for a driver but the wild variations of standards that drivers on our roads displayed to attain these is quite scary. But a pedestrian (reputed to be the cause of 73% of all road related fatalities) needs no licence to stagger in front of our cars - and don’t even get me started on bloody horses and cyclists.
Uncle Tony should train us all better rather than punishing the enthusiastic drivers for our moments of 'lunacy'.
But that would not make the police any money, so I think we are all buggered."
So; well said Ted. This country needs an uprising and I for one am prepared to chain myself to a TVR if that is what is needed (I hope).
The zombies of society need to be educated with the truth, not spoon fed meaningless bollocks such as that feckin add with the fool running down the kid (anyone noticed the locked tires?? - a sure way of increasing your stopping distance by a sh!tload). This is propoganda pure and simple and I despise it.
Do you think the PistonHeads could stand as a viable political party?
No?
Oh well.
It's all a question of Governmental priorities and whether or not they think it will cost them votes at the next General Election.
Face it, if you take drugs then Tony and his Team will love you to bits. In fact they will love you so much that they will
1, Change the law as far as they dare to make it legal for you to indulge your habit.
2, Appoint Senior Police officers who will be sympathetic to the druggy view and quietly not enforce the few remaining drugs laws.
Why? Cos they think that most people who vote Labour must be on recreational chemicals of some sort? No, it's cos they think it makes them look trendy and New Britain etc etc. It wins votes!
On the other hand, if you drive a sports car or a motor bike you can expect to be persecuted, even if you are not breaking the law!
This suits Tony and his chums just fine so they will bring in a series of ever more draconian traffic laws and then hire a bunch of sympathetic Senior Police officers to make sure those laws are enforced in the most offensive and over bearing way. If you whinge or complain then you are a Nazi loving pedestrian murdering speed nut who deserves no better treatment than a Greek plane spotter.
Why?
1, Because comparitavely few people indulge in this hobby so they couldn't give a stuff about losing your vote
2, Because lots of chip on shoulder tree hugging envious gits DO vote for them and it will therefore curry favour with their electorate.
3, Whilst you are busy arguing in public they are taking your freedom away somewhere else and you are too busy to be looking at a failing health service, disgraceful railways or an education system dominated by political correctness and dogma. That has to be a grade one gold plated result for Tony doesn't it?
Remember, at the last election Hague campaigned to get rid of the M4 bus lane and to have a more enlightend approach to speed laws (I think he even suggested an 80mph motorway limit) and he lost by a landslide!
As for protesting, well look what it did for the farmers/hauliers. They were demonised by the BBC as thugs and trouble makers holding the country to ransom even though the protests were 99% peaceful. The Govt also neatly managed to get the fuel companies to take alot of the flak! If we rise up and protest then I predict we too will be demonised and nobody will care about us cos we are a bunch of too rich speed freeks!
Still, that doesn't mean I wouldn't give my right arm for the chance of a pop at Prezza, or Tony or any of the other little Fuhrers that rule our lives today!
Andy
Face it, if you take drugs then Tony and his Team will love you to bits. In fact they will love you so much that they will
1, Change the law as far as they dare to make it legal for you to indulge your habit.
2, Appoint Senior Police officers who will be sympathetic to the druggy view and quietly not enforce the few remaining drugs laws.
Why? Cos they think that most people who vote Labour must be on recreational chemicals of some sort? No, it's cos they think it makes them look trendy and New Britain etc etc. It wins votes!
On the other hand, if you drive a sports car or a motor bike you can expect to be persecuted, even if you are not breaking the law!
This suits Tony and his chums just fine so they will bring in a series of ever more draconian traffic laws and then hire a bunch of sympathetic Senior Police officers to make sure those laws are enforced in the most offensive and over bearing way. If you whinge or complain then you are a Nazi loving pedestrian murdering speed nut who deserves no better treatment than a Greek plane spotter.
Why?
1, Because comparitavely few people indulge in this hobby so they couldn't give a stuff about losing your vote
2, Because lots of chip on shoulder tree hugging envious gits DO vote for them and it will therefore curry favour with their electorate.
3, Whilst you are busy arguing in public they are taking your freedom away somewhere else and you are too busy to be looking at a failing health service, disgraceful railways or an education system dominated by political correctness and dogma. That has to be a grade one gold plated result for Tony doesn't it?
Remember, at the last election Hague campaigned to get rid of the M4 bus lane and to have a more enlightend approach to speed laws (I think he even suggested an 80mph motorway limit) and he lost by a landslide!
As for protesting, well look what it did for the farmers/hauliers. They were demonised by the BBC as thugs and trouble makers holding the country to ransom even though the protests were 99% peaceful. The Govt also neatly managed to get the fuel companies to take alot of the flak! If we rise up and protest then I predict we too will be demonised and nobody will care about us cos we are a bunch of too rich speed freeks!
Still, that doesn't mean I wouldn't give my right arm for the chance of a pop at Prezza, or Tony or any of the other little Fuhrers that rule our lives today!
Andy
quote:
good point about the green cross code. When did you last see an advert teachin gkids to keep off the road?
I'm doing my own initiative on this, and when I drop my daughter at school in the Chimaera I make sure I exit the lay-by sideways at about 5500rpm with smoke pouring off the tyres.
This has the benefit of all and sundry within about 500 yards know I am there and they all stop dead in their tracks thus allowing me a clear way along the road. Those that remain in the road as I approach soon move and can be easily spooted the next school day hiding behind hedges/bus shelters etc.
.....only kidding.....but hey, I may have talked myself into something here!!!!
quote:
Do you think the PistonHeads could stand as a viable political party?
No?
PETROLTED FOR PRESIDENT!!!!!!!!!!
More seriously, some big scale complain like the lorry drivers do seems doable but that would mean the hell of a set-up...This may at least reveal we Petrolheads should no be ignored in social decisions because I am sure we are much more than what we expect...
Edited by thom on Thursday 6th December 12:46
'ang on a mo'.
80% (maybe more?) of people drive, and that is one hell of a majority.
Of that 80%, less than half actually agree with all these cameras.
SO how come we are constantly sh*t on by progessive governments?
Is it because unlike criminals, we carry our ID publically exhibited at all times?
Yep !! sure is. We need a protest day where EVERYONE removes their plates...
None of us want to have accidents, but we're treated worse than children. Atleast THEY are allowed to play on the road !!!
80% (maybe more?) of people drive, and that is one hell of a majority.
Of that 80%, less than half actually agree with all these cameras.
SO how come we are constantly sh*t on by progessive governments?
Is it because unlike criminals, we carry our ID publically exhibited at all times?
Yep !! sure is. We need a protest day where EVERYONE removes their plates...
None of us want to have accidents, but we're treated worse than children. Atleast THEY are allowed to play on the road !!!
I've posted this at greater length in the Top Site thread but:
'I'll check with my grandfather, but as far as I know the fascists didn't hand out penalty points and £60 fines before rounding up my family and pushing them into a quarry.
Awaiting flames...'
We're governed by the terminally clueless (though as to whether they're worse than the last lot, really ???) but the police ARE NOT the Gestapo...
'I'll check with my grandfather, but as far as I know the fascists didn't hand out penalty points and £60 fines before rounding up my family and pushing them into a quarry.
Awaiting flames...'
We're governed by the terminally clueless (though as to whether they're worse than the last lot, really ???) but the police ARE NOT the Gestapo...
The problem here might be something to do with money. The Association of British Drivers do campaign against the demonisation of motorists and for the improvement of driving standards as an aid to road safety. However, they rely on voluntary effort and very limited funding. To increase their membership to a level where they become a real political force will cost a lot of effort from their volunteers and money for advertising etc. I for one am too busy /lazy to help out - what little leisure time I get I would prefer to spend in my Tuscan rather than outside a supermarket. Therefore the only help I can offer is the cash. Something like the ABD needs permanent officers and specialists that can handle the media machine that promotes the anti-motorist viewpoint. By all means organise protests but little will come of these unless there is an organisation behind them that can fight the spin. Once you get credibility more funds will flow in from car manufacturers and other parts of industry that have vested interests. That is where real power will come from - look at the US gun lobby as an example for how a supposedly unPC idea like everyone owning a gun can be turned into a political force that shapes government policy. So everyone joins the ABD and makes a sizeable contribution to its war chest. If every member of a car club in the UK joined the ABD and contributed say £200 that would raise a couple of million quid to get the ball rolling - it might well be self financing after that. Wadjyerfink?
great idea, but who's going to risk 200 squids? I wish I was sure enough that it would work. Chicken & egg situation. On the other hand, 200 notes is about the same as a relatively serious (in the eyes of the law) misdemeanor..!!!!
Hey, how is it we are all fairly safe, and all do 100+ now and then, yet this is supposed to be dangerous? I've yet to have a scary moment at speed that was caused by the speed itself.
All my accidents have been low speed ones. So where do they get all the lies from?
Hey, how is it we are all fairly safe, and all do 100+ now and then, yet this is supposed to be dangerous? I've yet to have a scary moment at speed that was caused by the speed itself.
All my accidents have been low speed ones. So where do they get all the lies from?
Forgot to say, but Ted's right in yet another way.
Some "friends" of ours who drive very timidly, as visibly disgusted when I talk about 100+ on the M-way. Like it really matters to them !! think I need to choose some "fast friends".
People who I work(ed) with are so hypocritical, these guys do lots of miles, do 50mph round town, but slag me off for admitting to 170 on an empty motorway. These guys voted Labour.
Some "friends" of ours who drive very timidly, as visibly disgusted when I talk about 100+ on the M-way. Like it really matters to them !! think I need to choose some "fast friends".
People who I work(ed) with are so hypocritical, these guys do lots of miles, do 50mph round town, but slag me off for admitting to 170 on an empty motorway. These guys voted Labour.
£200 quid, are you serious? The ABD currently has a (suggested) subscription of £20 (more if you can afford it) and still there are people who won't join. For example - how many people contributing to this thread are actually members of the ABD? 2 - 3 perhaps not many more I'll bet you. Rich...
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