RE: TVR production goes up for sale
Thursday 4th January 2007
TVRs at homeThe manufacturing arm of TVR is up for sale, according to a story in the Financial Times.
TVR production goes up for sale
Administrators ready to sell manufacturing arm
TVRs at home
Administrators have said that they plan to sell Blackpool Automotive Ltd, TVR's car production company, as a going concern, although the question of whether it'll be called TVR remains up in the air. The administrators said they were "optimistic" that the sale could be concluded early in this new year.
The follows TVR owner Nikolai Smolenski's decision, announced in October, to move the Blackpool company's manufacturing facility to Italy. Bertone will make cars for TVR, the announcement said.
The production company, previously called TVR Engineering and Production, was created last year as part of a restructuring out of what was TVR Engineering, which was renamed in June last year, according to Companies House.
And more light's been shed on the financial hole in which TVR finds itself with the revelation that TVR made a loss of £11.8 million in 2005 on a turnover of £16.7 million.
Despite that, the firm's bosses continue to put on a brave face. TVR is here to stay, according to managing director David Oxley and Smolenski. They said the firm's future is assured, and that it's heading for good times with a new 600bhp model due late this year.
It's hard to say but is this the last knockings for TVR?
Discussion
From Car connections website
There's not been much in the way of festive cheer for workers at independent British sportscar maker TVR. In October they were told the historic factory in the seaside resort town ofBlackpool on the north-west coast was to close and be sold. A month later they learned the new assembly base wouldn't be local but in mainland Europe, so they wouldn't have jobs any more. In early December the spares division TVR Power was sold off. Now, the manufacturing arm - officially called Blackpool Automotive - has been put into receivership.
It's fair to say the company is in chaos and trying to find out what's happening is tricky. A voicemail message at the factory says everyone is on their Christmas holidays and due back on January 2. They weren't, and the only person you can speak to is the security guard on the gate. He told us TVR staff aren't allowed on the premises anymore and gave out the phone number of the official receiver.
We phoned him, but he won't make any comment other than to say he's been appointed by the director of Blackpool Automotive - but won't say who that is. "We're investigating the financial position of the company at the moment," he told us. His first task will be to establish who owns what; he took possession of a factory full of car making equipment on December 29, but some, none, or all of it might or might not be the property of Blackpool Automotive.
So what of the actual car company? According to a statement on the website: "Normal business continues for the prestige sports car company and its network of authorized dealers and service centers throughout the U.K. and abroad. Current warranties and the supply of parts also remain unaffected."
And of the future? The Web site states: "Our plans include appointing expert partners and outsourcing to more advanced facilities, which will ultimately mean a better product for everyone, both here in the domestic market and internationally." Quite when fans can expect any new product is anyone's guess.
There's not been much in the way of festive cheer for workers at independent British sportscar maker TVR. In October they were told the historic factory in the seaside resort town ofBlackpool on the north-west coast was to close and be sold. A month later they learned the new assembly base wouldn't be local but in mainland Europe, so they wouldn't have jobs any more. In early December the spares division TVR Power was sold off. Now, the manufacturing arm - officially called Blackpool Automotive - has been put into receivership.
It's fair to say the company is in chaos and trying to find out what's happening is tricky. A voicemail message at the factory says everyone is on their Christmas holidays and due back on January 2. They weren't, and the only person you can speak to is the security guard on the gate. He told us TVR staff aren't allowed on the premises anymore and gave out the phone number of the official receiver.
We phoned him, but he won't make any comment other than to say he's been appointed by the director of Blackpool Automotive - but won't say who that is. "We're investigating the financial position of the company at the moment," he told us. His first task will be to establish who owns what; he took possession of a factory full of car making equipment on December 29, but some, none, or all of it might or might not be the property of Blackpool Automotive.
So what of the actual car company? According to a statement on the website: "Normal business continues for the prestige sports car company and its network of authorized dealers and service centers throughout the U.K. and abroad. Current warranties and the supply of parts also remain unaffected."
And of the future? The Web site states: "Our plans include appointing expert partners and outsourcing to more advanced facilities, which will ultimately mean a better product for everyone, both here in the domestic market and internationally." Quite when fans can expect any new product is anyone's guess.
ASBO said:
This is atrocious. What the hell is hapenning to our beloved TVR?
Cant help feeling that this smacks of the 'will it wont it' Rover/MG saga
Cant help feeling that this smacks of the 'will it wont it' Rover/MG saga
I completely agree. I think this is disgraceful.
Two British owned and run car companies gone to the dogs due to shoddy management and incompetance.
Edited by bob1179 on Thursday 4th January 10:36
I did hint at this yesturday see this thread
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=340894&f=13&h=0
I would have thought that PKF were looking to to move the workers on too, but it looks like the redundancy letter have gone out, so buyers were not interested on first sniff with the workers as a package, which is stupid, as these are the guys that know how to build the cars.
Glad to here the workers can now 'sign on', and get our government to start coughing up some money to help support them.
Mr F
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=340894&f=13&h=0
I would have thought that PKF were looking to to move the workers on too, but it looks like the redundancy letter have gone out, so buyers were not interested on first sniff with the workers as a package, which is stupid, as these are the guys that know how to build the cars.
Glad to here the workers can now 'sign on', and get our government to start coughing up some money to help support them.
Mr F
Can anyone else see 2 companies called TVR on the horizon, both claiming to be the real TVR and both failing to deliver on their promises? Would you really want to buy a car from a company that has treated both its workforce and its owners with such distain of late? Be nice to see a small TVR company out of Blackpool with perhaps 1 car and a focus on getting that 100% right followed by a steady and sensible growth, but I doubt it will ever happen. The smiling Russian saviour is showing his true colours I suggest....
Mr Freefall said:
I did hint at this yesturday see this thread
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=340894&f=13&h=0
I would have thought that PKF were looking to to move the workers on too, but it looks like the redundancy letter have gone out, so buyers were not interested on first sniff with the workers as a package, which is stupid, as these are the guys that know how to build the cars.
Glad to here the workers can now 'sign on', and get our government to start coughing up some money to help support them.
Mr F
i think they needed to make us redundant because for any new owner it would take them months and months to source parts etc ang get somthing ready to build. thats if the administrators have any rights to any of the production models old or new. we will have to wait and see on that one. www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=340894&f=13&h=0
I would have thought that PKF were looking to to move the workers on too, but it looks like the redundancy letter have gone out, so buyers were not interested on first sniff with the workers as a package, which is stupid, as these are the guys that know how to build the cars.
Glad to here the workers can now 'sign on', and get our government to start coughing up some money to help support them.
Mr F
"Normal business continues for the prestige sports car company and its network of authorized dealers and service centers throughout the U.K. and abroad. Current warranties and the supply of parts also remain unaffected."
How can any of these dealings & this amount of "spin" be considered 'normal' ???
How can any of these dealings & this amount of "spin" be considered 'normal' ???
housemaster said:
Can anyone else see 2 companies called TVR on the horizon, both claiming to be the real TVR and both failing to deliver on their promises? Would you really want to buy a car from a company that has treated both its workforce and its owners with such distain of late? Be nice to see a small TVR company out of Blackpool with perhaps 1 car and a focus on getting that 100% right followed by a steady and sensible growth, but I doubt it will ever happen. The smiling Russian saviour is showing his true colours I suggest....
I suspect the TVR name is safely tied up with Moleskins, if Blackpool Automotive CAN be sold as a going concern then would be very surprised to see them being allowed to use the TVR name in anyway. Surely that is why it was named what is was where the other companies that were set up have all retained TVR in their name.
What I can't understand is what constitutes the going concern of BA. The building is still owned we think by Peter Wheeler, the workforce HAVE now received redundancy notices (and too be honest would have hindered and not enhanced a sale anyway). Parts business already gone, rights to old models gone I think, rights to current models presumably held by by Moleskins for the rumoured Italian production. What are they actually selling as a going concern, presumably PW still wants his £10k a week or whatever it was if it stays put so pretty hefty for a new owner to take on. I can't understand what there is.
I know of a Tool Makers in Southport that just retired, and has a cluster of antiquated industrial 'sheds' which would be ideal to put what remains of TVR in and produce about 1 car a month. At the end of the day, did TVR make enough cars and sell them at enough price to make a profit ? They used to, so what happened ? New Engines ? New managers with BIG salaries ?
by the way what happened to Jensen on Merseyside ?
by the way what happened to Jensen on Merseyside ?
Sorry to say this but I can't see what there is left worth buying...
"TVR" the brand is not up for sale the parts supply has been sold, so why buy Blackpool automotive with all it's baggage, it doesn't currently have a product and from what I undestand the site isn't modern enough for producing cars. So the only thing to buy is the site and I guess someone like Tesco's or B&Q would be interested in turning it into another superstore.
"TVR" the brand is not up for sale the parts supply has been sold, so why buy Blackpool automotive with all it's baggage, it doesn't currently have a product and from what I undestand the site isn't modern enough for producing cars. So the only thing to buy is the site and I guess someone like Tesco's or B&Q would be interested in turning it into another superstore.
If Blackpool Automotive Ltd is the manufacturing arm, and the marketing/admin/design/sales are tied up in another limited company (TVR Eng Ltd?) which is not in administration, then this ties in with the proposed outsourcing.
i.e. the manufacturing part in the UK is no longer required and so being sold off and probably relates to any machinery and tools.
The rest of the company, probably including the TVR name and designs, is still a going concern and ready for the outsourcing of manufacturing to continue abroad.
It's a harsh way to go about things, especially for the staff and probably other creditors of Blackpool Automotive Ltd, but it does seem to fit the whole outsourcing proposal.
i.e. the manufacturing part in the UK is no longer required and so being sold off and probably relates to any machinery and tools.
The rest of the company, probably including the TVR name and designs, is still a going concern and ready for the outsourcing of manufacturing to continue abroad.
It's a harsh way to go about things, especially for the staff and probably other creditors of Blackpool Automotive Ltd, but it does seem to fit the whole outsourcing proposal.
Apart from the tooling and equipment, which would probably go for a pittance in a closedown firesale there's 2 things worth having from what had formerly been known as TVR Engineering Ltd:
* The skills and insight of the people who built the cars
* The brand name TVR
As it stands, neither is included in a sale of Blackpool Automotive's assets and thus I can't see anyone put their money down from them - unless they demand ownership of the TVR brand (and it's designs) as part of the deal. I'd say sooner or later Smolenski is likely to give in, and pull out. Whether that'll be before or after an ill-fated 'TVR' adventure using outside contractors (Bertone, Ricardo Engineering) IMO depends on the actual proportions of his ego in relation to his true capabilities, and the depth of his pockets...
* The skills and insight of the people who built the cars
* The brand name TVR
As it stands, neither is included in a sale of Blackpool Automotive's assets and thus I can't see anyone put their money down from them - unless they demand ownership of the TVR brand (and it's designs) as part of the deal. I'd say sooner or later Smolenski is likely to give in, and pull out. Whether that'll be before or after an ill-fated 'TVR' adventure using outside contractors (Bertone, Ricardo Engineering) IMO depends on the actual proportions of his ego in relation to his true capabilities, and the depth of his pockets...
Edited by 900T-R on Thursday 4th January 12:00
Does anyone think, if Peter Wheeler owns the building/land would he buy Plackpool Automotive back, to produce cars again? He seems in the best position as he was supposedly the one who set it all off wanting big rental increases, it may have been engineered by him to get the company back! Just a thought!
Disgraceful, another fine piece of British industrial heritage gone to the wall.
Sadly I think it's clear that the writing has been on the wall for a long time. The first mistakes were made a few years ago and the new owner has failed to address these whilst making significant strides towards upsetting whatever customers were left.
I feel sorry for the workers, innocent after all but I'm actually glad about this. Hopefully this is the start of a new beginning, the re-emergence of a new TVR run by somebody who has a clue. Hopefully they will all be re-employed ASAP.
Sadly I think it's clear that the writing has been on the wall for a long time. The first mistakes were made a few years ago and the new owner has failed to address these whilst making significant strides towards upsetting whatever customers were left.
I feel sorry for the workers, innocent after all but I'm actually glad about this. Hopefully this is the start of a new beginning, the re-emergence of a new TVR run by somebody who has a clue. Hopefully they will all be re-employed ASAP.
I don't know whether its because I no longer own a TVR or it really is the case, but you just dont seem to see many of the newer TVRs on the road. I reckon I see one a month at most. In their day Chimaeras and Griffiths were almost common place. Do the new cars just not have the same appeal? (I had a Tuscan which was the first model to introduce more radical styling but have they gone too far?) or is it just the fact that there is more competition. Certainly in the mid 90's TVR was an aspirational brand, and as the result of many factors I just don't think it is anymore, and that is a big problem.
touching cloth said:
I suspect the TVR name is safely tied up with Moleskins, if Blackpool Automotive CAN be sold as a going concern then would be very surprised to see them being allowed to use the TVR name in anyway. Surely that is why it was named what is was where the other companies that were set up have all retained TVR in their name.
IMHO BA could only be viewed as a going concern if it holds the rights to build the stuff that's locked up in its premises. Ergo, the rights must still be in BA.
Just because TVR.E became BA does not automatically mean that the TVR name got moved out. Further, to move it out would require a specific transaction from one company (say TVR Motors Co or TVR Cars) to BA. Furthermore, that transaction would have to be at *market value* to bear scrutiny. You can't move assets from one company to another for a quid just because you own both sides of the deal. Companies are discrete entities.
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