Tiptronic - phooey!
Discussion
Hello folks. I'm in the process of buying a 996 Turbo Cab (if I can find a decent child seat that fits - thanks to those who answered my other thread today on that subject) and am really not sure that I want tiptronic, despite the dealer guiding me in that direction. I've never owned a Porsche before and those that I have blagged a drive in along the years have all been manual. I test drove a bunch of 911s at my local Porsche dealer the other day and first went out in a 996 Turbo Coupe manual - WOW! Then I went out in a 996 Turbo Coupe tipronic - erm....!
I understand what the tiptronic is all about, but couldn't help feeling that it made the car slower to drive. Whilst I am very happy to accept that I would undoubtedly get used to the tiptronic and get more from it once familiar, but on first drive the car felt sluggish and slow (dare I say). In automatic mode it changed up really quickly and seemed to want to get to 5th as soon as it could, and always pulled off in 2nd which was a bit annoying. I understand the system is adaptive and therefore would alter its behaviour if I drove it hard, but I didn't enjoy the experience all the same. In tiptronic manual mode I felt it was slow to change gear (after pressing the button) and generally I felt my test drive was some way slower than with the manual box.
Whilst I can clearly see that tipronic is a popular option on 911s, and thus not having it could affect resale potential / value, I just can't help thinking that a 911 turbo is an awesome drivers car and therefore I should be the one who is doing all the driving and go for the manual box.
Am I alone in thinking this? How many of you 911 owners out there wouldn't dream of buying anything other than a tiptronic, or indeed perhaps hate it. I can't help thinking it's a bit of clever engineering that isn't perfect and actually takes a little away from the enjoyment and performance of the car.
Any thoughts welcome. I am about to spend a considerable amount of hard earned cash and am not sure which box to go for.
Many many thanks,
Gixxer.
I understand what the tiptronic is all about, but couldn't help feeling that it made the car slower to drive. Whilst I am very happy to accept that I would undoubtedly get used to the tiptronic and get more from it once familiar, but on first drive the car felt sluggish and slow (dare I say). In automatic mode it changed up really quickly and seemed to want to get to 5th as soon as it could, and always pulled off in 2nd which was a bit annoying. I understand the system is adaptive and therefore would alter its behaviour if I drove it hard, but I didn't enjoy the experience all the same. In tiptronic manual mode I felt it was slow to change gear (after pressing the button) and generally I felt my test drive was some way slower than with the manual box.
Whilst I can clearly see that tipronic is a popular option on 911s, and thus not having it could affect resale potential / value, I just can't help thinking that a 911 turbo is an awesome drivers car and therefore I should be the one who is doing all the driving and go for the manual box.
Am I alone in thinking this? How many of you 911 owners out there wouldn't dream of buying anything other than a tiptronic, or indeed perhaps hate it. I can't help thinking it's a bit of clever engineering that isn't perfect and actually takes a little away from the enjoyment and performance of the car.
Any thoughts welcome. I am about to spend a considerable amount of hard earned cash and am not sure which box to go for.
Many many thanks,
Gixxer.
DONT. BUY. A. TIP.
actually dont buy a cab neither, they are like an overgrown boxster.
advise to a fellow biker, buy a manual 911 with RWD, C2 GT3 GT2, dont matter which you will enjoy any of them as they offer the full fat pork experience, the 4x4's, well, you know, not wishing to offend anyone but they just dont give you what you want. that is unless you ride a harley, in which case, Good Luck!
actually dont buy a cab neither, they are like an overgrown boxster.
advise to a fellow biker, buy a manual 911 with RWD, C2 GT3 GT2, dont matter which you will enjoy any of them as they offer the full fat pork experience, the 4x4's, well, you know, not wishing to offend anyone but they just dont give you what you want. that is unless you ride a harley, in which case, Good Luck!
Edited by DucatiGary on Wednesday 27th September 20:06
DucatiGary said:
DONT. BUY. A. TIP.
actually dont buy a cab neither, they are like an overgrown boxster.
advise to a fellow biker, buy a manual 911 with RWD, C2 GT3 GT2, dont matter which you will enjoy any of them as they offer the full fat pork experience, the 4x4's, well, you know, not wishing to offend anyone but they just dont give you what you want. that is unless you ride a harley, in which case, Good Luck!
actually dont buy a cab neither, they are like an overgrown boxster.
advise to a fellow biker, buy a manual 911 with RWD, C2 GT3 GT2, dont matter which you will enjoy any of them as they offer the full fat pork experience, the 4x4's, well, you know, not wishing to offend anyone but they just dont give you what you want. that is unless you ride a harley, in which case, Good Luck!
Edited by DucatiGary on Wednesday 27th September 20:06
Coupe. Manual. RWD. Dont go for a tip it's a porsche (a supercar) i've drove a c4 and turbo with tip and could not wait to get back i hate the word hate but i hate porka tips. Get a manual turbo tune the life out of it and be a boy again want a auto by a bently, also not to keen on the cabs but i can c why others are. best of luck with it
The Tiptronic 'box ruins the 996TT in a particularly savage way, though. I couldn't credit how utterly crap the 996TT Tip drove when compared to the 996TT Manual. They felt like two completely different cars - one ferociously fast and involving, the other swift, remote and frustrating. I had a 996 TT Tip for a few days and wanted to bring it back after the first few hours. Pile o' shite.
it all depends on where you will be using the car, I am 75% city based so tip does it for me. you have to learn its ways, the big pedal does need more movment & the fule consuption is shocking, but for me it works, my next 911 will be a tip as well.
I don't pretend to be a driving god and need 101% feedback, its a cab you are after so you are not into the full handeling thing anyway. See if you can get a 24hour tase and get used to it.
As for pulling away in 2nd, when in normal driving do you need to srint away any faster than that! if you want just put it in to 1st.
for a first time porsche driver it has certain advantages.
you can not over rev it.
it will not let you go from 5th to 2nd by mistake and cook the engine.
it will not change gear mid corner
and dare I say it RMS happen a lot less on tips..
BUT hats off to you at least you have tried it before slating it, its all about choice
I don't pretend to be a driving god and need 101% feedback, its a cab you are after so you are not into the full handeling thing anyway. See if you can get a 24hour tase and get used to it.
As for pulling away in 2nd, when in normal driving do you need to srint away any faster than that! if you want just put it in to 1st.
for a first time porsche driver it has certain advantages.
you can not over rev it.
it will not let you go from 5th to 2nd by mistake and cook the engine.
it will not change gear mid corner
and dare I say it RMS happen a lot less on tips..
BUT hats off to you at least you have tried it before slating it, its all about choice
It sounds from your post like you've already made up your mind having tried both manual and tip, so go with your feelings and hang on until there's a manual turbo available. Buying a car that's compromised from the outset has to be a mistake.
I have a much-loved manual turbo of the previous generation, but tried a tip (only a boxster) when invited to an airfield day by my local dealer. The experience put me off the porker auto boxes completely and I suspect that most people end up just sticking them in drive and using only the right foot. Not a very sportscarlike approach to driving.
One day Porsche'll produce a proper DSG gearbox without a torque converter blunting the sensation of driving, then maybe the models with buttons on the steering wheel will be worth toying with. Until then I consider that the tips are for the bloated plutocrats, the lazy and the infirm.
Edited to add: and women of course!
I have a much-loved manual turbo of the previous generation, but tried a tip (only a boxster) when invited to an airfield day by my local dealer. The experience put me off the porker auto boxes completely and I suspect that most people end up just sticking them in drive and using only the right foot. Not a very sportscarlike approach to driving.
One day Porsche'll produce a proper DSG gearbox without a torque converter blunting the sensation of driving, then maybe the models with buttons on the steering wheel will be worth toying with. Until then I consider that the tips are for the bloated plutocrats, the lazy and the infirm.
Edited to add: and women of course!
Edited by nel on Thursday 28th September 08:43
DucatiGary said:
jonny996 said:
and dare I say it RMS happen a lot less on tips..
strange that, my local indy recons the opposite.
In general RMS is not a major problem on the turbos, GT2s and 3s as they are based on the old block design, so tip or not this should not be an issue when looking at buying one of these cars.
Los Angeles said:
Ah, the old chestnut rears it tiptronic head. If you like to work your car straight from hand into transmission don't buy a Tip. I enjoy it because its easy to use, keeps both my hands on the steering wheel - I use the switches on the wheel a lot to change up or down - because I hate changing gear every 1,000 yards in city traffic to negotiate, vehicles, lights, pedestrians, opening doors on parked cars, road gangs at work, buses, cyclists, and speed bumps. On long motorway journeys I don't need a gear stick at all.
I have sat next to rally drivers who drive Tiptronics as if on a rally proving if you drive 'em right they are just as fast as the next Porsche. The main thing to remember is the debate about tronic or stick is completely artificial and a waste ofyour time. You could be in your car driving it right now. Come to think of it .....
Ironic smiley LA. I have sat next to rally drivers who drive Tiptronics as if on a rally proving if you drive 'em right they are just as fast as the next Porsche. The main thing to remember is the debate about tronic or stick is completely artificial and a waste ofyour time. You could be in your car driving it right now. Come to think of it .....
gixxer1000 said:
jonny996 said:
and dare I say it RMS happen a lot less on tips..
erm... "RMS"? What's that?
Sorry, I'm a bit new to all this Porsche lingo.
Gixxer
RMS = rear main seal. It's the crankshaft oil seal behind the flywheel. The engines of the 996 and Boxster series (with the exception of turbos, GT2s and 3s) have had seemingly aggravated issues of this seal leaking and requiring replacement, a major job unfortunately though the costs of the seal itself is peanuts.
If yoiu search the forum for info. you'll find about a million threads on the subject!
gixxer1000 said:
jonny996 said:
and dare I say it RMS happen a lot less on tips..
erm... "RMS"? What's that?
Sorry, I'm a bit new to all this Porsche lingo.
Gixxer
you have just lit the blue touch paper.
Stand well back, make sure all animals are indoors and the children are a safe distance....
nel said:
Until then I consider that the tips are for the bloated plutocrats, the lazy and the infirm.
Edited to add: and women of course!
Edited to add: and women of course!
and mother-in-laws - see separate thread
and not having tip affecting residuals? absolutely no difference at all
in fact there are more people (like me) looking for manuals - I will not countenance buying my TT in bright pink or with a tip but if forced into a choice I'd go with the pink first!!
(but good for you for actually trying a TT tip for yourself and, like me, realising it completely ruins a great car)
I know sod all about how cars actually work so pardon my ignorance...
I test drove a Tip (and have had quite a few as courtesy cars) but decided on a manual. Whilst pressing the buttons was fun for a while it somewhow just seemed to make the car feel lazy and numb.
I was dreaming surfing around the Porsche website looking at the GT3 Cup cars etc and noticed that they run "sequential" gear boxes. Can somebody mechanically minded explain how these are different from the Tip system and could Porsche not develop this system for their road cars?
I test drove a Tip (and have had quite a few as courtesy cars) but decided on a manual. Whilst pressing the buttons was fun for a while it somewhow just seemed to make the car feel lazy and numb.
I was dreaming surfing around the Porsche website looking at the GT3 Cup cars etc and noticed that they run "sequential" gear boxes. Can somebody mechanically minded explain how these are different from the Tip system and could Porsche not develop this system for their road cars?
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