Engine cost and supplier

[scooby8272]

I think i will be wanting around 400BHP.

Just looking at the American Speed crate turnkey motor at 400 BHP which costs $7815 + shipping/tax/taX/TAX/TAX

Then i look at a randon US site to compare and a 420 BHP crate turnkey motor costs $5525 + shipping etc etc

Whats the difference, will they both not just drop in ?

I am a bit on a numptie with V8 chevy's so any help on the differences would be really helpful.

Cheers

[NDS]

Check out the LSx options ( the " new" vertion of the small block chevy) Fuel injection and value for money.

[G Man]

scooby8272 said:

I think i will be wanting around 400BHP.

Just looking at the American Speed crate turnkey motor at 400 BHP which costs $7815 + shipping/tax/taX/TAX/TAX

Then i look at a randon US site to compare and a 420 BHP crate turnkey motor costs $5525 + shipping etc etc

Whats the difference, will they both not just drop in ?

I am a bit on a numptie with V8 chevy's so any help on the differences would be really helpful.

Cheers

The AS engine will have all the right bits in the right place to fit and its the Ultima factorys choice

Get a LS engine be all means but you will need to source and exhaust and cat by yourself

[steve_d]

To fit in the Ultima chassis there are a number of things like sump depth and short water pump that have to be correct. No doubt other suppliers could make you one but you would need to know all the limitations.

Steve

[CanAm Dave]

Hi Justin

The only real difference is that the AS engine will drop in but other will not! The reason is that the engine requires a shallow sump pan, the right oil pick-up for that sump, short water pump, and the alternator bracket and pulleys that run with the short water pump. Apart from that there is not much difference. The shallow sump pan is needed due to a chassis crossmember running below it.

If you fancy another project along with the car build, I have a 420HP 383 (6.3litre) AS Chevy in parts in my garage. It was the original engine from my Can-Am. It has covered less than 3000 miles. If you do not fancy rebuilding it and your not in a rush then I would be happy to build it for you. Send me a mail if your interested.

I read about your car in PPC looks like you did a top job on that! I loved the car PC, only wish I new enough to do the same in my Can-Am now I've gone EFI.

Regards Dave
www.v8yes.co.uk

If you want to go with the more modern LS series Chevy then you wouldn't go wrong with these guys. www.lspower.co.uk

Edited by CanAm Dave on Friday 22 September 17:33

[chuntington101]

these guys are worth a look! alot of people in the states recomend them. but the normal LS engine "problems" need to be concidered!

www.turnkeyengine.com/products.html

thanks Chris.

[chuntington101]

and can i ask a question why AS charge sooo much more for an Ultima engine compeard to there normal engines? it cant be that exspensive to get pre 79 (is that right??) blocks can it?

here is an example

427 c.i. 535 hp @5600 rpm 560 ft. lbs. torque @4200 rpm 535 hp $14,895.00 (utima price)

427 CID Brutus 550 engine Dart engine block, Comp Cams roller cam, 210-220 CNC ported AFR cyl. heads, ASE 4340 steel crankshaft, 6" ASE 4340 steel rods, JE forged pistons, Edelbrock Air Gap or Victor Jr. intake manifold, 10.0 comp., up to 600 hp. 500-600 hp $9,995.00

thanks Chris.

[GTWayne]

I fail to see the mystery surrounding this subject. Ultima and AS have worked together to bring the layman a tried and tested combination right? Both concerns are businesses trying to make a healthy profit for their efforts and we as the buying public either pay, as some may see it, through the nose for a factory backed recommendation or do your own thing. The choice of power train used is only dictated by three things: Imagination, determination and depth of wallet. Once you have mastered these obstacles, the world is your oyster!

[andygtt]

maybe compare the AS Utima engine prices against their non Ultima engine packages, here you will see the same kind of price difference and then appreciate that their package basically drops into an Ultima with MSD sump alternator etc etc..

They don't just lump profit margin on because its going into an Ultima.

[GTWayne]

Andy, you and I both know that it does not cost that much more to build a motor specifically designed for an Ultima install and should the factory not be able to furnish a builder with the correct information required, and I can't imagine for one second for that to be the case, folk here on PH are always keen to show the way. Another requisite that I failed to mention in my previous post is confidence. Once you have this, it makes things a lot more simple IMHO.

Edited by GTWayne on Saturday 23 September 05:24

[tuxman]

I built my first engine using uk suppliers at a massive saving and there is no issues getting everything to fit they are all standard components they are not designed especialy for ultimas even the engine mounts are stock units ,someone like chris at W.A.S.P. can supply you with everything you need including turnkey engines .simon

[andygtt]

There are certain things that are specific to the application such as a 7in big wing sump (£350) low mount alternator, short water pump etc. these are not usually included in the std engine packages and add up.

My point was look at the AS web site and you will see the same engine package for a non Ultima arount $2k cheaper.

I know you can build your own cheaper and having done both the build you own and buy form AS I would personnely go the build my on route.

Edited by andygtt on Saturday 23 September 09:58

[chuntington101]

andygtt said:

There are certain things that are specific to the application such as a 7in big wing sump (£350) low mount alternator, short water pump etc. these are not usually included in the std engine packages and add up.

My point was look at the AS web site and you will see the same engine package for a non Ultima arount $2k cheaper.

I know you can build your own cheaper and this is the route I would take, remember that I have done both.

they add a little more than $2k on there!!

from the website:

427 c.i. 535 hp @5600 rpm 560 ft. lbs. torque @4200 rpm 535 hp $14,895.00 (utima price)

427 CID Brutus 550 engine Dart engine block, Comp Cams roller cam, 210-220 CNC ported AFR cyl. heads, ASE 4340 steel crankshaft, 6" ASE 4340 steel rods, JE forged pistons, Edelbrock Air Gap or Victor Jr. intake manifold, 10.0 comp., up to 600 hp. 500-600 hp $9,995.00

now with my maths thats a $4900 diffrence, and you get a new Dart block for that price! even if you have to get a carband other bits and bobs, is it really that much??

thanks Chris.

[andygtt]

OK I should mention that am specifically refering to the 400bhp engine package the originator was asking about.

[BogBeast]

I re-used my old all-iron chev from my old Firebird.

The only thing that took a bit of thinking about was the sump, bit of measuring after a test fit and I ended up with Moroso pan IIRC. easy peasy.

Crate engines not for me - I had more fun specing/building my own. But then I am a builder more than a driver/rider..

[Graham-P]

If you decide to rebuild you will need the following:
Short water pump of your choice, I chose an Edelbrock comp.
Engine mounts Lakewood , part# LAK-24084 $65.00 (Summit) though in the end I used Energy Suspension mounts.
Lower alt bracket, March part# MCH-20215 $135.00 (Summit)
The oil pan is a Canton, part# 15-250 £219.00 (WASP)
The oil pick up pipe is part# 20-010 £25.00 (WASP)


Chances are the pulleys will be out of alignment, I went for the serpentine pulleys as there’s less chance of throwing a belt.

[fastco]

Here's a place for engine options mate... http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Chevy-engine-Co Cheers! Dr,Dee

Edited by fastco on Thursday 28th September 07:03

Edited by fastco on Wednesday 4th October 16:37

[Boosted LS1]

It would be even cooler if you could drop in and see your own engine being built with a camera on you.

Boosted.

[Puppetmaster]

fastco said:

Here's a place for engine options mate...

So basicly these engines are the same as the AS engines? So, for instance, the standard exhaust should fit?

[DHGTR]

hi, i have an engine from fastco and it is built to fit the ultima.

dave