911 v 360, seduced by the dark side. . .
Discussion
After many years of happy 911 ownership I'm considering throwing it all in and going for a Ferrari 360. Has anyone made a similar move? I'd be interested in your experiences both positive and negative. My head tells me to take to a darkened room until the urge has passed, but there's also a red devil on my shoulder i'm afraid. Cheers. Perhaps I should add i'd be doing about 8,000 miles per year.
For gods sake go lie down in a darkened room. Mate of mine bought a 360 F1, red, tubi, the whole shooting match. Sounded lovely and went as well as it looked, although I believe that the handling was slightly less than predictable. He had always wanted a Ferrari after owning a string of fast cars including a 993tt and 2 MK1 GT3's. The love affair with the car lasted about 3 months after which it sat in the Garage gathering dust. He simply didn't have the time to drive it, was scared to leave it parked anywhere and was worried what effect putting miles would have on the car.
After 9 months it was sold at a loss of £19k. If you ask me that's one hell of an expensive itch to have scratched.
If you must have a supercar, stick with Pork and buy a GT2.
After 9 months it was sold at a loss of £19k. If you ask me that's one hell of an expensive itch to have scratched.
If you must have a supercar, stick with Pork and buy a GT2.
I`m into the third year of owning my 360 and have no regrets.20 thousand miles and still on the original clutch ( f1) no reliability issues and fresh back from a two hour cruise around East Anglia, I`m still grinning.
The handling needed some adjustment to suit me ( ta Manu, Scuderia Systems) but the suspension is fully adjustable so a good independent will sort that, I changed from a GT3 ( mk2) into the 360 and like the Porsche your input is what you`ll get out of the car.
The handling needed some adjustment to suit me ( ta Manu, Scuderia Systems) but the suspension is fully adjustable so a good independent will sort that, I changed from a GT3 ( mk2) into the 360 and like the Porsche your input is what you`ll get out of the car.
mikial said:
I`m into the third year of owning my 360 and have no regrets.20 thousand miles and still on the original clutch ( f1) no reliability issues and fresh back from a two hour cruise around East Anglia, I`m still grinning.
The handling needed some adjustment to suit me ( ta Manu, Scuderia Systems) but the suspension is fully adjustable so a good independent will sort that, I changed from a GT3 ( mk2) into the 360 and like the Porsche your input is what you`ll get out of the car.
The handling needed some adjustment to suit me ( ta Manu, Scuderia Systems) but the suspension is fully adjustable so a good independent will sort that, I changed from a GT3 ( mk2) into the 360 and like the Porsche your input is what you`ll get out of the car.
have you tracked the 360 much mikial?? or is it a road car?
peterpeter said:
mikial said:
I`m into the third year of owning my 360 and have no regrets.20 thousand miles and still on the original clutch ( f1) no reliability issues and fresh back from a two hour cruise around East Anglia, I`m still grinning.
The handling needed some adjustment to suit me ( ta Manu, Scuderia Systems) but the suspension is fully adjustable so a good independent will sort that, I changed from a GT3 ( mk2) into the 360 and like the Porsche your input is what you`ll get out of the car.
The handling needed some adjustment to suit me ( ta Manu, Scuderia Systems) but the suspension is fully adjustable so a good independent will sort that, I changed from a GT3 ( mk2) into the 360 and like the Porsche your input is what you`ll get out of the car.
have you tracked the 360 much mikial?? or is it a road car?
No peterpeter I`ve never tracked it, in fact the last track day I did was years ago ( 25 , probably more, at Goodwood in my 3 litre turbo ) it`s strictly a road car, I found the initial turn in would wash out in some circumstances so Manu ( Scuderia S) arranged for a geometry change that incorporated ride height and camber changes , I prefer the car now than the way it was which I believed to be a factory spec compromise.
Incidentally I`m due a visit at Parr where my suspension ( JRZ) is waiting to be fitted to the tt, I`ve dealt with Paul Robe since he was at Coulsdon and I believe Parr to be one of the best specialists around.I`m just contemplating whether or not to have some ECU modifications done at the same time.
Apologies for the hi-jack
I would never have a problem with parking the car, or putting miles on it for that matter, that issue seems to be a UK obsession. A look at the 360s available in Europe shows many that have covered 100,000kms and more. Perhaps, as with 911s, its better to use them regularly than leave then standing. My main concern is the servicing aspect and consumables such as the clutch, with some of the advertised cars having a replacement after less than 10000 miles. Is this down to pulling doughnuts on pub car parks and general abuse or are they just more brittle?? Its the whole head/heart thing I guess. But I do know that although I'm happy to lay the money out to buy one I'd hate to be driving something that I was constantly expecting to break. If I could overcome that then i'd not have a problem. I've been spoilt by bomb proof 911s i suppose.
The clutch on the F1 360 ,when not abused ( this means not being stationary in gear and always flicking into neutral at junctions etc)should last well into the twenty thousand plus miles range, as mine has. I do no city driving whatsoever which helps enormously to establish longevity and prolong the lifespan of the clutch. Consider circa £1200 for a new one.
Warranties are expensive and rise accordingly depending on the age of the car. A set of PZero`s (2- 225/40/18 & 2- 285/35/18) cost me £440 plus vat fitted in August last year.Cam belts are £47.92 plus vat each, by the time they are fitted with the pas belt , a/c belt & alternator belt replaced at the same time this swells to £600 odd.( Franchised dealer)
Hope this helps. M.
Warranties are expensive and rise accordingly depending on the age of the car. A set of PZero`s (2- 225/40/18 & 2- 285/35/18) cost me £440 plus vat fitted in August last year.Cam belts are £47.92 plus vat each, by the time they are fitted with the pas belt , a/c belt & alternator belt replaced at the same time this swells to £600 odd.( Franchised dealer)
Hope this helps. M.
into my 1st 360 after 5 years with 355 and 6 911s before that. My car has covered just short 10k miles and clutch wear is 23 % and CCM brake rotor wear is 25 % .I think this is reasonable as i'm pretty sure the previous owners tracked car quite extensively. You can and should get the dealer selling car to run SD2/SD3 diagnostics when you're there so you can see F1 clutch wear figures yourself. CCM brakes are usually only on CS or 430 so this isn't an issue for 360.
Mikial, you seem to be having a pretty good experience and those sort of costs certainly wouldn't cause any heartache. It's the bills that run into 000's that make the whole thing hard to justify.
It would be useful to meet an owner and get to know a little more about the cars, they're a little thin on the ground in Shropshire! Its obviously not something to rush into.
Thanks for the advice guys, its much appreciated.
It would be useful to meet an owner and get to know a little more about the cars, they're a little thin on the ground in Shropshire! Its obviously not something to rush into.
Thanks for the advice guys, its much appreciated.
mikial said:
....Warranties are expensive and rise accordingly depending on the age of the car. A set of PZero`s (2- 225/40/18 & 2- 285/35/18) cost me £440 plus vat fitted in August last year.Cam belts are £47.92 plus vat each, by the time they are fitted with the pas belt , a/c belt & alternator belt replaced at the same time this swells to £600 odd.( Franchised dealer)
Hope this helps. M.
Hope this helps. M.
Can I ask where you get your tyres from, and where you get it serviced....seem like good value for me.
About security - this is more down to the owners than the car itself IMO. I've left mine all over the place (including New Cross Gate) and it has *never* had anything other than positive remarks made about it (it does get lots of attention, but I've never had bad attention).
I appreciate this is a dangerous comment to make in this particular section of PH, but these are special cars in a way that a Porsche isn't (which is probably why some owners don't like leaving them just anywhere...?). It's nothing to do with outright performance (Porsches are hard to beat there), they just have something about them that makes it a real event driving them (I do decent miles in mine, and the effect has yet to wear off).
If you've always wanted one, go for it.
PS To avoid getting a complete spanking in terms of residuals, keep an open mind about buying from the non-approved network, and don't sell back to them either...
Murph7355, sorry for being a bit slow on the up-take, are you saying tread carefully when buying outside the approved network?? I guess it may be easier to come across cars with suspect or patchy history. Concerning re-sale, i've never had a problem moving the 911s on, although by their nature the Ferrari is more specialist and potential buyers may be looking for the security of a solid warrenty and after sales service etc,thus it'll be pretty difficult to shift privately i would assume. Personally I've always bought 911s privately but have been very picky about the history.
Don't be afraid to look at good independants especially.As Tony says, the opposite.
If you buy from and sell to a dealer, you will take a bath. And you will even have to provide your own vaseline.
Were I a betting man I would say the chap who lost 19k in 9mths did exactly this. And I would suggest that the bulk of it was more "commission" rather than true depreciation.
Go for it. There is no nicer feeling for a petrolhead than opening the garage to see a Ferrari sat in there.
PS When I get more garage space, I'm likely to add a 911 at some point. Will likely be an early RS or maybe a 993. I do like them
If you buy from and sell to a dealer, you will take a bath. And you will even have to provide your own vaseline.
Were I a betting man I would say the chap who lost 19k in 9mths did exactly this. And I would suggest that the bulk of it was more "commission" rather than true depreciation.
Go for it. There is no nicer feeling for a petrolhead than opening the garage to see a Ferrari sat in there.
PS When I get more garage space, I'm likely to add a 911 at some point. Will likely be an early RS or maybe a 993. I do like them
The 993 is an excellent choice, i currently run a c2s which i have nothing but praise for. A fantastic machine with great build quality, performance, looks and residuals. However the later cars just don't do it for me i'm afraid, although i did see a tempting GT3 the other week. The Ferrari thing is because i'm into double figures for 911s owned and think the change may do me good!!!
Murph7355 said:
About security - this is more down to the owners than the car itself IMO. I've left mine all over the place (including New Cross Gate) and it has *never* had anything other than positive remarks made about it (it does get lots of attention, but I've never had bad attention).
reckon you've been lucky.
only this week was driving down holloway road with a blonde girl friend in the car and some guy walking passed shouted 'w@nker' at me - jealous t
ts all over the place who you can't account for 
sleep envy said:
only this week was driving down holloway road with a blonde girl friend in the car and some guy walking passed shouted 'w@nker' at me - jealous tts all over the place who you can't account for
ts all over the place who you can't account for Possibly.
Some cars tend to be more prone than others though, and I'm reasonably sure Ferraris aren't top of the list.
Sad state of affairs though. Morally bankrupt society here we come.
Murph7355 said:
mikial said:
....Warranties are expensive and rise accordingly depending on the age of the car. A set of PZero`s (2- 225/40/18 & 2- 285/35/18) cost me £440 plus vat fitted in August last year.Cam belts are £47.92 plus vat each, by the time they are fitted with the pas belt , a/c belt & alternator belt replaced at the same time this swells to £600 odd.( Franchised dealer)
Hope this helps. M.
Hope this helps. M.
Can I ask where you get your tyres from, and where you get it serviced....seem like good value for me.
About security - this is more down to the owners than the car itself IMO. I've left mine all over the place (including New Cross Gate) and it has *never* had anything other than positive remarks made about it (it does get lots of attention, but I've never had bad attention).
I appreciate this is a dangerous comment to make in this particular section of PH, but these are special cars in a way that a Porsche isn't (which is probably why some owners don't like leaving them just anywhere...?). It's nothing to do with outright performance (Porsches are hard to beat there), they just have something about them that makes it a real event driving them (I do decent miles in mine, and the effect has yet to wear off).
If you've always wanted one, go for it.
PS To avoid getting a complete spanking in terms of residuals, keep an open mind about buying from the non-approved network, and don't sell back to them either...
Servicing is at Lancaster in Colchester and the tyres at a small independent in Suffolk , I believe the supplier to be Michdiver or a similar name.
Maybe I'm lucky, but I've never had any reliability problems with Ferrari's. I guess the only thing I'd question about making this move is whether the 360 is going to be an "old" car pretty quickly (like the 355 looks now).
Driving-wise the 430 is so much better (I thought the gap was bigger than 355-360), and although the shape is still pretty current, I don't know how long this will be the same for. If you don't mind this I'd definitely scratch the itch....
Driving-wise the 430 is so much better (I thought the gap was bigger than 355-360), and although the shape is still pretty current, I don't know how long this will be the same for. If you don't mind this I'd definitely scratch the itch....
sleep envy said:
Murph7355 said:
About security - this is more down to the owners than the car itself IMO. I've left mine all over the place (including New Cross Gate) and it has *never* had anything other than positive remarks made about it (it does get lots of attention, but I've never had bad attention).
reckon you've been lucky.
only this week was driving down holloway road with a blonde girl friend in the car and some guy walking passed shouted 'w@nker' at me - jealous t
ts all over the place who you can't account for Quite. Even my (admittedly cherished and very shiny
!!)poverty spec six year old 996 gets me the "coffee bean shake" on occasion, most recently from a scruffy, obese, sweating, red faced middle aged bloke carrying a LIDLs bag, wearing a shiny olive green suit, plastic tassled loafers and a mustard yellow shirt/red tie combo. I took it as a compliment. How much did he wish he was me. Yeah, all those years in law school and all that money I borrowed to qualify weren't wasted after all.
Edited by Vesuvius 996 on Monday 10th July 10:10
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