Questions Regarding Mini Cooper S

[d3vine]

Hello, I am given the opportunity to own a 1969 Mini Cooper S. It's an original Cooper S which was modified for Hill Climbs. It has matching numbers. It's in mint condition. The car has over 130bhp, aspirated. It does 0-60mph in 5.8 secs. From what the owner said, the engine is extensively modified with lightweight parts (ie. carbon fibre push rods). He said, it's a reliable daily driver. So my question, is it worth paying 30K USD for it? I might negotiate a bit if it's worth it.

It sounds like a quick car. And if it's really original, the value should hold up. My only concern is, if I purchase it for that amount. Will I beable to resell it for the same or more.

[cooperman]

I don't know what the values are like in the USA. It sounds a bit on the high side to me. You could call my buddy in California, Bill Rogers, who has a 1071 'S' rally car prepared by me over here and used on a couple of Historic events before Bill took it to CA. His number is 1-805-498-0846. He would have a good idea of values and would be pleased to help.

Peter

[d3vine]

Hi Cooperman, do you have his email? What are Cooper S modified for Hill Climbs go for in the UK? Is 0-60mph 5.8secs for a Mini Cooper S seems feasible or bit exaggerated? I was also told that it can out corner a Lotus Elise.

[tim-d]

I'd treat all S's with some suspicion - there are an incredible number of fakes out there (some crude badging & bits others, many originally created to be replicas very finely & accurately done, others still built for pure profit from the unwary)- many created in the UK have been exported with the genuine car still being extant in the UK (or doubly exported) - a std car in good condition over here would probably cost 6- 10K (£ dependent upon restoration state - from the physical standpoint it is reasonably easy to make numbers match and doesn't necessarily make it an original car - the S's had some uniques features & fitments - so make sure what you're looking at is the genuine article - some expert help required / highly recommended here. A good starting point would be to obtain a heritage certificate (?) and scan all available documents very closely...
As to performance anything is possible but faster than a lotus (though I have no idea what an elise can do!) and a good daily driver would seem to be a bit of a contradiction (wouldn't normally equate the two)
30K US sounds a lot but all dependent on condtion and build cost / modification status by the sounds of things has had a sizeable amount of cash spent on it............

[mr dann]

I know a guy who fakes coopers/s's and finds it rather funny how gullible people are. I don't know where he gets the V5's from but he does and creates the odd hybrid/etc/etc. He had a Mk2 mini which he cunningly sold as a MK1 970S and it went on ebay for a lot of cash. Since that most have been played with and a lot of others are suspect, I'd only pay top whack for a car which I knew the history of. £10K absolute tip top original car. £7K for a 970 and £8K for a 1071, that's what I would pay. I got a freshly restored shell (66) for £1.5K and have spent the rest of the money making it go faster. Minis are about modifying and fun and unless you plan to do historic racing, I don't think real Mk1 S's are value for money given the current price.

[4WD]

If it's modified anyway, I'd rather buy a fully tuned version with a honda or kad lump for that money! A set of 10" wheels, lights and nice grille don't cost that much do they. Who cares about the V5, particuarly as there are so many modified and fakes.

[Paul V]

I'd want to see a full build spec sheet from the engine builder, if this guy built it himself then I'd consider paying someone to give the engine a once over to make sure it has all the bits inside that you are paying for, I bought a late 60's cooper a few years back It was reshelled using a later mk4 shell though so I only paid a few hundred pounds for it. But would have been easy to swap the ID over to a MK2 shell I had been offered. Check the shell to make sure it is original, try to find out if someone local can who knows about coopers can inspect the car too. As said if it's a modified you're after I'd go for a modified normal mini, if you want a Cooper S buy an all original Cooper S.

[d3vine]

Here's what the owner told me. Does it sound like a cheap setup, hyped up? The body is all original with heritage certificate. If I could get it for low, mid 20s USD, I don't mind paying for it. People in the states are jacking up the price of Mini's like crazy. A cheap Morris Mini reshelled, with rust, and high mileage cost 7-9k USD. I have seen original Mini Cooper, late 60s asking for 20k USD.

Base on the specs below, you Mini experts tell me can it be duplicated for under 20k USD? Or if it's possible, how much would a Mini Cooper S with the spec below, mint condition, original body, matching numbers, got proof of authenticity (heritage certificate) cost to build/modify from an original Cooper S?

This is a real 1969 Austin Mini Cooper S. This car has won more than 20 first place finishes, at various hill climb and rally events. This is the most fun that you can have on four wheels. 0-60 in 5.8 seconds and over 130bhp. Handles like a go-kart. Please read just some of the many upgrades this car has. Only 1500miles since full engine rebuild. Original all steel body in perfect rust free condition. This car was prepared between the years of 1979-1981 to UK group 5 specifications, fitted with group 5 fiberglass airdam and wheel flairs. Used competitively until 1989 for mostly slalom and hill climb, road use since then. Engine has been upgraded, rebulit and tuned since then. It has been lowered by 75mm, wheel archs cut and rewelded to suit clearance. Original headliner and black interior door panels and rear seats. Original sliding windows and cable door pulls. Heated rear window. Corbeau GT4 race seats and racing harnesses. Mada dash with smith instrumentation with behind dash noise insulation. All gauges work perfectly. Mountney steering wheel with cooper hub. Stainless steel wiper arms. Adjustable ride height. Standard S brakes all around. Carbon Metallic front pads. Repco Brake booster. Synthetic DOT 5 high performance brake and clutch fluid. 1275cc Cooper S over bored to 1340cc, Powermax forged dish pistons 12.5:1 compression ratio. Stage 3 Vizard cylinder head. High tensile studs and head bolt down system. Stainless steel rim flow valves, Iskendarian 160 double valve springs and roller rockers, carbon fiber push rods. Vizard VP3C camshaft good for 7500 rpm, EN40B crankshaft. Ultra light steel flywheel and back plate. Orange competition diaphragm and clutch. 4 synchro straight cut close ratio gear box, will do 50 mph in first gear !!!. Ultra short shift linkage assembly. Standard 3.44 differential with tuftrided crosspin. Twin 1.75 inch stage 3 SU carburetors with trumpets, all polished. Electronic fuel pump. Mainflow custom built intake manifold. Big bore exhaust. Water injection system. Oil cooler.

[haynes]

I would have though with all those mods it wouldnt have any real value as a cooper S, because its so far from original, its only value would be on any notable history, or its competition performance and how tidy it is.

With a 130hp and twin 1.75s its gonna be very cammy so although drivable on the road itll be hard work, although a typical stage 3 head isnt enough to give 130hp, that'll take a full race head.

As for outperforming an elise, from my experience at hillclimbs they are typically a couple of seconds quicker over a 40 second run, ok you mind find a novice elise driver being beaten by the best in the under 1400cc class, and it depends on the state of tune of the elise.

[guru_1071]

no s had cable door pulls

i doubt 130 bhp would be either reliable or suitable as a daily driver, i sure wouldnt like to drive my racer as a 'daily driver'

i think the seller is trying to have your pants down tbh!

its a mongaral and over here would be worth around 3500 grand, mk 2 's arnt worth a lot or desirable, and one modified as much as this one will be of no interest to a collector.

carbon fibre push rods have a nasty habit of failing as well, no body uses them anymore!!

get the chassis and engine number of the seller - that will tell you what it is!

[cooperman]

Be afraid, be very afraid!!!