Motorway crossovers in the central reservation
Poll: Motorway crossovers in the central reservation
Total Members Polled: 13
Discussion
Over recent days there have been a rash of incidents/accidents that have caused motorway closures with drivers stuck in jams for hours on end. This morning an incident on the Thelwall Viaduct has led to closure of the northbound M6 and consequently massive cost to the economy.
Is it time to reintroduce crossover points in the central reservation that can be dismounted by the emergency services and, with appropriate traffic management, enable vehicles to be released from the jam onto the opposing carriageway? These would be demountable or open-able sections wih similar collision resistance to the existing barrier.
I see that there are risks, and that awkwardly positioned HGVs could scupper the possibility of using a crossover point. There is also a cost consideration. At what centres would they be provided? At least one between junctions, maybe at 1 or 2 mile centres. But I don’t think it’s beyond the wit of man to derive a workable solution.
Imo the benefits would outweigh the costs, and I think it would be worth a trial at least. What are your thoughts?
Is it time to reintroduce crossover points in the central reservation that can be dismounted by the emergency services and, with appropriate traffic management, enable vehicles to be released from the jam onto the opposing carriageway? These would be demountable or open-able sections wih similar collision resistance to the existing barrier.
I see that there are risks, and that awkwardly positioned HGVs could scupper the possibility of using a crossover point. There is also a cost consideration. At what centres would they be provided? At least one between junctions, maybe at 1 or 2 mile centres. But I don’t think it’s beyond the wit of man to derive a workable solution.
Imo the benefits would outweigh the costs, and I think it would be worth a trial at least. What are your thoughts?
I'd definitely support this. Currently it seems that we cost the accident consequences in injuries etc but completely ignore the costs of delays, both financial and health, and of secondary collisions caused in the queuing traffic.
A few weeks ago I was in a queue 10 miles long which trapped some people for hours- all because of a car fire. The ability to turn the traffic around would have been a huge benefit.
A few weeks ago I was in a queue 10 miles long which trapped some people for hours- all because of a car fire. The ability to turn the traffic around would have been a huge benefit.
I did see suggestion years ago that a motorway could be designed with the carriageways the other way round. Still overtaking on the right but the southbound could be to the West of the Northbound so emergency services and breakdown trucks could park on one hard shoulder while attending to an incident on the other rather than a 10 mile round trip to the next exit. This would assume easy crossing over the crash barrier, but it would also make the crossover system easier because you would enter the hard shoulder of the other carriageway rather than the overtaking lane. Of course you would have to build a new motorway from scratch.
Whilst perhaps an idea that is based on common sense, I don't think that this would be practical or even achievable in practice.
By the time that an appropriately trained team of workers arrived to open up the central reservation, it should be possible for the police and/or highways officers to start turning around the built up traffic, to get the vehicles off at the previous exit.
Even if a removable central barrier system was put in place, the odds of that section of barrier being at the point of the road closure is small, meaning that to get back to the location of such a removable barrier, the built up traffic would need to be turned around anyway to drive back down the motorway.
In that scenario, we are back to my first point about the vehicles going back to the previous exit to come off the motorway.
By the time that an appropriately trained team of workers arrived to open up the central reservation, it should be possible for the police and/or highways officers to start turning around the built up traffic, to get the vehicles off at the previous exit.
Even if a removable central barrier system was put in place, the odds of that section of barrier being at the point of the road closure is small, meaning that to get back to the location of such a removable barrier, the built up traffic would need to be turned around anyway to drive back down the motorway.
In that scenario, we are back to my first point about the vehicles going back to the previous exit to come off the motorway.
When the M25 was closed at J6 a couple of months back, people were trapped in 37C+ heat for 7-8 hours. They couldn't be turned around because the whole central res is solid concrete the whole length. And the emergency services took ages to reach the scene because it's a 4 laner with no hard shoulder.
Mandat said:
Even if a removable central barrier system was put in place, the odds of that section of barrier being at the point of the road closure is small, meaning that to get back to the location of such a removable barrier, the built up traffic would need to be turned around anyway to drive back down the motorway.
But traffic up to the crossover could be released, reducing the number of people caught in the incident.speedking31 said:
P675 said:
Why should I have to suffer on the non-crashed side
Because the people caught up in the incident might be on their way to do something that will benfit you in the future. It evens out the pain a bit. It could be you caught in the queue next time.I support it, I don’t really understand why they shut motorways both ways because there’s a crash one side, the bought out those green barriers a few years back to Shield accidents from view so why do both sides need to be shut apart from when there’s a fire with smoke blowing across both carriagewaysb
Still exist in a lot of places, but their use isn't as straightforward as you might believe.
They need to be in just the right place. They often need specific tools or 'keys' to open and the crews that would be opening them are the same crews clearning up the mess or putting out closures to start with.
They need traffic management on the other side, which is also resource, time and traffic intensive.
It's very often quicker to get traffic past the scene if possible, or to turn them around from the back of the queue if the closures have gone on quickly enough.
I've seen FRS cut a metal barrier to release traffic through the middle, only for a HGV to sink in the soft centre reserve and block both sides until recovery could get there and drag it out because the water faries hadn't thought it through.
In short, it is possible, and will be considered if there are barriers nearby, but it's rarely feasible due to traffic issues and staffing. I have seen some designs that significantly reduce the manpower required to actually open the barrier, but I have no clue if they are being planned into future works on non concrete sections.
They need to be in just the right place. They often need specific tools or 'keys' to open and the crews that would be opening them are the same crews clearning up the mess or putting out closures to start with.
They need traffic management on the other side, which is also resource, time and traffic intensive.
It's very often quicker to get traffic past the scene if possible, or to turn them around from the back of the queue if the closures have gone on quickly enough.
I've seen FRS cut a metal barrier to release traffic through the middle, only for a HGV to sink in the soft centre reserve and block both sides until recovery could get there and drag it out because the water faries hadn't thought it through.
In short, it is possible, and will be considered if there are barriers nearby, but it's rarely feasible due to traffic issues and staffing. I have seen some designs that significantly reduce the manpower required to actually open the barrier, but I have no clue if they are being planned into future works on non concrete sections.
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