Lady Diana & Sir Winston.
Discussion
After watching a documentary on Sir Winston Churchill i couldnt help notice some similarities in the charachters of Sir Winston and Lady Diana Spencer.
They seem two very different people,he very outward going and full of fight,she very shy and gentle,but there seems to be a very popular side to them both that the british public took them to their hearts,i think one of there qualities was they came across as very real people that quite openly made their mistakes.
They seem two very different people,he very outward going and full of fight,she very shy and gentle,but there seems to be a very popular side to them both that the british public took them to their hearts,i think one of there qualities was they came across as very real people that quite openly made their mistakes.
ZR1cliff said:
,i think one of there qualities was they came across as very real people that quite openly made their mistakes.
Sorry not everyone thought the same as you.
I always thought that Diana was a complete act who was guided by spin doctors and publisity agents.
IMO the real Diana was a simpleton who liked to stick pins in peoples arses. What did she actualy acheive?
If she didnt look the way she did no one would give a F what she did. Its just luck that she was born pretty.
Churchil was a real life hero who put his life on the line in the Boar war IIRC showed true leadership during WW2 and didnt he also start the NHS?
To compare the two of them is to me a huge insult to Winston.
Thats just my opinion Im quite happy for people to dissagree.
>> Edited by pesty on Friday 14th October 21:42
Good Evening, or should i say Good Afternoon sir?! pesty said:
He also made an almighty Balls up with "fortress singapore"
Not to mention Gallipoli.
But the Germans had been bombing civilians in WW1 as well, with Zeppelins. They even built a four-cough massive gun to bombard Paris from 75 miles away. Assuming that they'd started the same tricks again doesn't sound too unreasonable.
pesty said:
Churchil was a real life hero who put his life on the line in the Boar war IIRC showed true leadership during WW2 and didnt he also start the NHS?
Sorry Pesty me ol' mate,...simply could not let that pass.
Churchill had many qualities, not to be disregarded just because one disliked his politics, but:.....
Churchill? start the NHS?.....
That was Mr Bevin, old chap, different party all together......
I doubt if Winston had any sympathy with the downtrodded needy masses, it wasn't his style...
Pigeon said:
He also made an almighty Balls up with "fortress singapore"
Not to mention Gallipoli.
But the Germans had been bombing civilians in WW1 as well, with Zeppelins. They even built a four-cough massive gun to bombard Paris from 75 miles away. Assuming that they'd started the same tricks again doesn't sound too unreasonable.
Isnt history wonderfull. We should remember people for the good things they did, not the errors we all see in hindsight............
Very true... it has to be said that Gallipoli had a worthy motive - trying to find an alternative to the slaughter in the trenches. That it was an almighty cockup and just turned into more of the same doesn't detract from that. The other part of my post was using WW1 to show one of his WW2 actions in a more favourable light.
And talking of WW1 - tanks.
And talking of WW1 - tanks.
8Pack said:
Churchil was a real life hero who put his life on the line in the Boar war IIRC showed true leadership during WW2 and didnt he also start the NHS?
Sorry Pesty me ol' mate,...simply could not let that pass.
Churchill had many qualities, not to be disregarded just because one disliked his politics, but:.....
Churchill? start the NHS?.....
That was Mr Bevin, old chap, different party all together......
I doubt if Winston had any sympathy with the downtrodded needy masses, it wasn't his style...
Always glad to be corrected. perhaps I'm getting mixed up with the welfare state? I'm sure he did something along those lines. I distinctly remember thinking ooo I didnt know he did that unfortunately I cant remember what it was.
Pigeon said:
pesty said:
He also made an almighty Balls up with "fortress singapore"
Not to mention Gallipoli.
.
MMM are you sure that was his fault? didnt the generals on the ground make the desicion to entrench on the beach even though no one was around for miles because they failed to send out scouts and by the time they had finished days later the turkish army had taken the high ground?
or am I getting my battles mixed up again
>> Edited by pesty on Saturday 15th October 01:34
Vipers said:
Isnt history wonderfull. We should remember people for the good things they did, not the errors we all see in hindsight............
I very much agree with you there Vipers, but it's the difficulty of seeing through all the smoke and mirrors, the re-writing of history, and the files hidden for 100 yrs that makes a true assesment impossible.
>> Edited by 8Pack on Saturday 15th October 01:35
Jeez, there's some poor understanding of history going on here.
For a start, Churchill deliberately used the accidental bombiing of London to escalate teh bombing war into city centres, and this single act swung the war in Britain's favour. Why? Because he knew Hitler would be infuriated and would target wholesale retaliation on Britain's cities, and this took the spotlight off our airbases which, at the time, were teetering on the brink of being bombed out of existence. The onset of the blitz enabled British fighter command to rebuild and get back some semblance of control and directly resulted in us winning the Battle of Britain.
Churchill was originally a Conservative MP who crossed the floor twice. He was a compassionate man and was troubled by the Conservative Malcontents of the early 1920s. He is widely credited as being the founder of the NHS during his time as a Labour man, in discussion with Nye Bevan who stuck around and made it happen.
For a start, Churchill deliberately used the accidental bombiing of London to escalate teh bombing war into city centres, and this single act swung the war in Britain's favour. Why? Because he knew Hitler would be infuriated and would target wholesale retaliation on Britain's cities, and this took the spotlight off our airbases which, at the time, were teetering on the brink of being bombed out of existence. The onset of the blitz enabled British fighter command to rebuild and get back some semblance of control and directly resulted in us winning the Battle of Britain.
Churchill was originally a Conservative MP who crossed the floor twice. He was a compassionate man and was troubled by the Conservative Malcontents of the early 1920s. He is widely credited as being the founder of the NHS during his time as a Labour man, in discussion with Nye Bevan who stuck around and made it happen.
Mmmh! Well, I have to say Mon Ami Mate, I haven't heard that before, although I know that he did indeed "cross the house" twice in his career, but I thought: to the Liberals, who were then the second party.
The First Labour government was in 1945 and I don't believe that he ever joined them. He "may" have had discussions with Nye Bevan during the coalition government during the war though..
The First Labour government was in 1945 and I don't believe that he ever joined them. He "may" have had discussions with Nye Bevan during the coalition government during the war though..
8Pack said:
Mmmh! Well, I have to say Mon Ami Mate, I haven't heard that before, although I know that he did indeed "cross the house" twice in his career, but I thought: to the Liberals, who were then the second party.
The First Labour government was in 1945 and I don't believe that he ever joined them. He "may" have had discussions with Nye Bevan during the coalition government during the war though..
You are partly correct and I had forgotten that it was a Liberal that he first entered the house. He crossed to the Conservatives but then became a Labour supporter just before the war. He led the wartime coalition as a Labour supporter and appointed Bevan, and several other Labour luminaries, into his cabinet. He rejoined the Conservatives formally in, I think, 1950. Interestingly he fell from favour after running a general election campaign in which he attempted to draw parallels between Labour Party dogma and Nazism!
pesty said:
Mon Ami Mate said:
He is widely credited as being the founder of the NHS during his time as a Labour man, in discussion with Nye Bevan who stuck around and made it happen.
Thanks MAM I know thought I had heard that.
Now am I somewhere near on Galipoli?
Churchill was NEVER a "Labour" politician.....period............. rightwing Liberal ..Yes...
His "involvement" during the war with a "coalition" government was just that......A coalition of all the parties during wartime to fight a war.......nothing "as such" to do with Churchill.
>> Edited by 8Pack on Saturday 15th October 03:16
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