Knackered old Porsche with loads of torque...
Discussion
It's that time again.... I've bought another Porsche 
This one was planned to be pretty simple, go buy a nice, low'ish mileage V6 Diesel 958 Cayenne with a tow bar to fulfill general tow car and tip run duties with the plan that it could tow the 957 Rally car down to Africa later this year for Maroc Challenge number 3 and generally be a completely unneedy, low effort vehicle to have around the place. Afterall the V6 diesel lump has a load less pain points than pretty much anything else and I've got the same engine in a Panamera so I don't even have to kee two types of oil filter in stock ....
But then one starts late night Autotrader'ing doesn't one..... and someone tells you how good the V8 diesel is..... and another tells you RP towed an A380 with one..... and then you stumble across one that is the ideal colour combination..... and then you see how many miles it has.... but also that it looks absolutely minty in the photos:
Obviously even considering taking on something with the bork factor of a V8D Cayenne S requires some sensible maths and pondering... and if one factors in that a 170K mile example would be a whole nother level of brave then any sane individual would of course give it a swerve...... but then I noticed it had matching Pirellis on it and five minutes later I'd sent a car dealership in Bristol some money.
As always it's best not to consider these things too much, it's a Silver Cayenne S with a Carrera Red interior... that is sufficient reason on its own!
So rather than a V6 with a tow bar I've purchased the highest mileage V8D on Autotrader that also doesn't have a tow bar
So how bad is it? Well..... it appears (I say whilst touching wood) that it's absolutely perfect with the exception of a small scuff on a wheel arch extension, a small scuff on the back of the drivers seat, a missing towing eye cover (which I've found with a broken clip in the boot) and a bit of very light kerbing on various wheels. It has full history from Porsche, RPM and SCS and that history makes some fairly terrifying reading with the last couple of services having clocked in at £4.5K and £4.3K respectively. It was under warranty with Porsche for most of its life and had various warranty bits like transfer boxes, dampers and a variety of engine sensors during that time.
I've had it a week now, it definitely looks the part on the drive:
And the interior is really a rather wonderful place to be:
But the most interesting thing is how it drives, when these first appeared on the scene I believe they had about (if not the) highest torque output of any production car at 627ftlb. More impressively it makes this at 2000RPM! Playing with a Dragy on my private airfield it does 0-60mph in 5.42 seconds and a standing 1/4 in 13.68 seconds, it also seems to be quite happily doing 36mpg whilst running about. Dynamically the car is pretty decent, it has PASM on springs so firming the dampers up is a button press and whilst it's a big jiggly in sport it does hang on surprisingly well with no real bodyroll - it's on 295s all round so really it should have a lot of mechanical with that much rubber on the road! Really it's quite obscene just how capable it is for something of its size and weight and the ability to do that whilst sniffing 40mpg at points is really quite a unique combination.
One thing that was surprising was how good it sounds! It's definitely a V8 and it has more than a little Scania truck about it, which in my opinion is no bad thing!
It looks a lot better with the engine cover off:
And decently terrifyingly complex. Two DBW throttle bodies, two electronic shut off valves, two EGR valves, a belt driven HP fuel pump hidden in the back of the engine and a metric s
t tonne of sensors including actual turbo speed sensors (just like a WRC car!). Accessing anything aside from the odd bit on top of the engine appears to be dramatic and if either of those turbos has a bad day (and they run at 220K RPM on this!) it's engine out. To be fair to it aside from a bit of mildly crusty alluminium all seems very good under the bonnet and oil consumption over 500 miles or so appears to be negligible as it's not moved on the display!
So a fantastic buy all round I think!
I've had the PCM apart and fitted a cheap wireless Android Auto / Car Play kit to it, which works amazingly well and whilst a bit of a squeeze with the DAB board in there was a pretty quick job on a rainy afternoon:
This makes a huge difference to how modern things feel and I'm amazed how flawlessly it works given the far east roots of this particularliy cheap kit and how it integrates with the PCM in a somewhat hacky way.
So I need to get a tow bar on it next and open a book on what the cause of the first check engine light is
Oh and interestingly... these appear to map to 425bhp and 725 ftlbs
This one was planned to be pretty simple, go buy a nice, low'ish mileage V6 Diesel 958 Cayenne with a tow bar to fulfill general tow car and tip run duties with the plan that it could tow the 957 Rally car down to Africa later this year for Maroc Challenge number 3 and generally be a completely unneedy, low effort vehicle to have around the place. Afterall the V6 diesel lump has a load less pain points than pretty much anything else and I've got the same engine in a Panamera so I don't even have to kee two types of oil filter in stock ....
But then one starts late night Autotrader'ing doesn't one..... and someone tells you how good the V8 diesel is..... and another tells you RP towed an A380 with one..... and then you stumble across one that is the ideal colour combination..... and then you see how many miles it has.... but also that it looks absolutely minty in the photos:
Obviously even considering taking on something with the bork factor of a V8D Cayenne S requires some sensible maths and pondering... and if one factors in that a 170K mile example would be a whole nother level of brave then any sane individual would of course give it a swerve...... but then I noticed it had matching Pirellis on it and five minutes later I'd sent a car dealership in Bristol some money.
As always it's best not to consider these things too much, it's a Silver Cayenne S with a Carrera Red interior... that is sufficient reason on its own!
So rather than a V6 with a tow bar I've purchased the highest mileage V8D on Autotrader that also doesn't have a tow bar
So how bad is it? Well..... it appears (I say whilst touching wood) that it's absolutely perfect with the exception of a small scuff on a wheel arch extension, a small scuff on the back of the drivers seat, a missing towing eye cover (which I've found with a broken clip in the boot) and a bit of very light kerbing on various wheels. It has full history from Porsche, RPM and SCS and that history makes some fairly terrifying reading with the last couple of services having clocked in at £4.5K and £4.3K respectively. It was under warranty with Porsche for most of its life and had various warranty bits like transfer boxes, dampers and a variety of engine sensors during that time.
I've had it a week now, it definitely looks the part on the drive:
And the interior is really a rather wonderful place to be:
But the most interesting thing is how it drives, when these first appeared on the scene I believe they had about (if not the) highest torque output of any production car at 627ftlb. More impressively it makes this at 2000RPM! Playing with a Dragy on my private airfield it does 0-60mph in 5.42 seconds and a standing 1/4 in 13.68 seconds, it also seems to be quite happily doing 36mpg whilst running about. Dynamically the car is pretty decent, it has PASM on springs so firming the dampers up is a button press and whilst it's a big jiggly in sport it does hang on surprisingly well with no real bodyroll - it's on 295s all round so really it should have a lot of mechanical with that much rubber on the road! Really it's quite obscene just how capable it is for something of its size and weight and the ability to do that whilst sniffing 40mpg at points is really quite a unique combination.
One thing that was surprising was how good it sounds! It's definitely a V8 and it has more than a little Scania truck about it, which in my opinion is no bad thing!
It looks a lot better with the engine cover off:
And decently terrifyingly complex. Two DBW throttle bodies, two electronic shut off valves, two EGR valves, a belt driven HP fuel pump hidden in the back of the engine and a metric s
t tonne of sensors including actual turbo speed sensors (just like a WRC car!). Accessing anything aside from the odd bit on top of the engine appears to be dramatic and if either of those turbos has a bad day (and they run at 220K RPM on this!) it's engine out. To be fair to it aside from a bit of mildly crusty alluminium all seems very good under the bonnet and oil consumption over 500 miles or so appears to be negligible as it's not moved on the display!So a fantastic buy all round I think!
I've had the PCM apart and fitted a cheap wireless Android Auto / Car Play kit to it, which works amazingly well and whilst a bit of a squeeze with the DAB board in there was a pretty quick job on a rainy afternoon:
This makes a huge difference to how modern things feel and I'm amazed how flawlessly it works given the far east roots of this particularliy cheap kit and how it integrates with the PCM in a somewhat hacky way.
So I need to get a tow bar on it next and open a book on what the cause of the first check engine light is
Oh and interestingly... these appear to map to 425bhp and 725 ftlbs
Good to see this has its own story now. The V8 does have a lovely 'big rig' sound to it!
But:
'Afterall the V6 diesel lump has a load less pain points than pretty much anything else and I've got the same engine in a Panamera so I don't even have to kee two types of oil filter in stock ....'
Wait. What now? You have another unannounced Porsche as well?
But:
'Afterall the V6 diesel lump has a load less pain points than pretty much anything else and I've got the same engine in a Panamera so I don't even have to kee two types of oil filter in stock ....'
Wait. What now? You have another unannounced Porsche as well?
Love it, I've been banging on about mine for years, and everyone just glazes over. I feel somewhat exonerated now.
Glad to hear the android auto boards seem to have moved on in the last few years. I will swap mine out if you don't find any niggles in the next few months.
No air suspension, I see... Was that a conscious choice to reduce the bork factor*, or just luck of the draw, as the rest of the car is so good?
Congrats again.
* although touch wood they do seem to be quite reliable units compared to JLR's rusty nightmares
Glad to hear the android auto boards seem to have moved on in the last few years. I will swap mine out if you don't find any niggles in the next few months.
No air suspension, I see... Was that a conscious choice to reduce the bork factor*, or just luck of the draw, as the rest of the car is so good?
Congrats again.
* although touch wood they do seem to be quite reliable units compared to JLR's rusty nightmares
poppopbangbang said:
And decently terrifyingly complex. Two DBW throttle bodies, two electronic shut off valves, two EGR valves, a belt driven HP fuel pump hidden in the back of the engine and a metric s
t tonne of sensors including actual turbo speed sensors (just like a WRC car!). Accessing anything aside from the odd bit on top of the engine appears to be dramatic and if either of those turbos has a bad day (and they run at 220K RPM on this!) it's engine out. To be fair to it aside from a bit of mildly crusty alluminium all seems very good under the bonnet and oil consumption over 500 miles or so appears to be negligible as it's not moved on the display!Turbo speed sensors are awesome, and it looks like a very ‘Porsche’ engine. The boudoir interior is excellent, too!
At first glance it seems to be a heart over head purchase, but the condition and service history would suggest it's a sensible buy, of sorts!! Love it! Best of luck.
Sorry, private airfield?! I just don't have a sarcasm detector, so you were probably just messing around as you'd never do such a thing on a public road
))
Sorry, private airfield?! I just don't have a sarcasm detector, so you were probably just messing around as you'd never do such a thing on a public road
))
Northbrook said:
I'm waiting to see the trailer PPBB builds, probably from scratch and/or from another Cayenne, to tow the Cayenne with the Cayenne.
Alas it's almost certainly going to be a Brian James effort but the idea of towing a Cayenne, on a Cayenne, with a Cayenne is rather appealing.... Om said:
Good to see this has its own story now. The V8 does have a lovely 'big rig' sound to it!
But:
'Afterall the V6 diesel lump has a load less pain points than pretty much anything else and I've got the same engine in a Panamera so I don't even have to kee two types of oil filter in stock ....'
Wait. What now? You have another unannounced Porsche as well?
But:
'Afterall the V6 diesel lump has a load less pain points than pretty much anything else and I've got the same engine in a Panamera so I don't even have to kee two types of oil filter in stock ....'
Wait. What now? You have another unannounced Porsche as well?
Diesel Porsche #1
Over over under steer said:
Having previously owned a 981 for seven years the lack of car play drove me mad. I always shied away from doing the board install - lovely and equally frustrating to see someone just get on and do it. What a wuss I was!!!
It's a bit fiddly to do but there's no real difficulty to it, some careful insertion of the ribbon cables is neccesary and the routing of said cables out the front if it has a DAB board too is also a little fiddly but for the most part it's just a case of plugging the bits in and bolting it back up. I also put an SSD in at the same time as I didn't want to risk the mechanical drive packing up before I had chance to clone it. They're just a standard 2.5" SATA drive so an easy job to swap out.
So if you have another PCM equipped Porsche in the future, definitely get the screw drivers out!
Mij91 said:
poppopbangbang said:
Diesel Porsche #1
@Mij91, we talked briefly on my £500 Cayenne readers car thread about my 958 diesel V6. It originally had leaking PASM shocks that were replaced with Sachs non PASM, the independent Porsche garage that ‘coded’ out the PASM didn’t do a complete job and it throws a headlight levelling error.
Porsche GB have sent me a ‘dieselgate’ recall notice so I was thinking of taking it in and having a Porsche tech hopefully sort the PASM delete coding at the same time.
Regarding your comment though - how much difference does the post dieselgate gearbox software make? The car is used for general commuting and occasional long distance trips. I’m not bothered about its sporting prowess!
My V8D after 140k miles. The Carplay still worked though.... 
The stator in the torque converter broke up. Engine out, Torque converter rebuilt and a S/H box fitted. I used to play with American stuff and remember people used to cut the torque converters open, and braze round the vanes for extra strength over the stock spot welds. I think leggy BMW 535Ds suffer the same fate of excessive torque induced converter failure.
You're right, there's little you can do with the motor in. I changed the wastegate actuators whilst the motor was out, as they're prone to wear the plastic worm gear. Starter is also engine out and turbo pipe off to get to.
Still sweet as and just nudging 160K miles now. The engine has never been apart, still on original chains, EGR etc. Owned from new, oil changes every 10k miles. Treated with mechanical sympathy, as well as being regularly ragged when fully warm. All stock.
Original prop too, albeit augmented with a JXB carrier after your recommendation.
I can't find anything to replace it with...
The Carplay still worked though.... The stator in the torque converter broke up. Engine out, Torque converter rebuilt and a S/H box fitted. I used to play with American stuff and remember people used to cut the torque converters open, and braze round the vanes for extra strength over the stock spot welds. I think leggy BMW 535Ds suffer the same fate of excessive torque induced converter failure.
You're right, there's little you can do with the motor in. I changed the wastegate actuators whilst the motor was out, as they're prone to wear the plastic worm gear. Starter is also engine out and turbo pipe off to get to.
Still sweet as and just nudging 160K miles now. The engine has never been apart, still on original chains, EGR etc. Owned from new, oil changes every 10k miles. Treated with mechanical sympathy, as well as being regularly ragged when fully warm. All stock.
Original prop too, albeit augmented with a JXB carrier after your recommendation.
I can't find anything to replace it with...
Gassing Station | Readers' Cars | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff