Mercedes AMG GT 4-Door Coupe ~1400 bhp?
Discussion
Another day, another stupidly rapid performance EV emerges.
It's actually odd to think we live in an increasingly risk averse world, all that government nannying, and somehow the world of motoring appear to have zero barriers when it comes to handing the urchins the keys (or fob) to car with well over 1000hp. But, here we are!
Shown here in concept form but AMG have developed the same basic car and it's going to release next year, this is close to what is coming and it's their answer to the Taycan:
And here is the 'actual' (near enough) car, shown off with high production values but the real thing has nearly twice the power on the rear axle than on the front, so if you wanted to recreate this, it shouldn't be too difficult...
Food for thought... One day this car will be ten years old, probably very affordable and still cheap to run, probably working just fine too. What's going to happen when the kids get these cars!?
Anyway, discuss this car and also the direction the performance car industry is heading now we have such powerful new cars to play around with
It's actually odd to think we live in an increasingly risk averse world, all that government nannying, and somehow the world of motoring appear to have zero barriers when it comes to handing the urchins the keys (or fob) to car with well over 1000hp. But, here we are!
Shown here in concept form but AMG have developed the same basic car and it's going to release next year, this is close to what is coming and it's their answer to the Taycan:
And here is the 'actual' (near enough) car, shown off with high production values but the real thing has nearly twice the power on the rear axle than on the front, so if you wanted to recreate this, it shouldn't be too difficult...
Food for thought... One day this car will be ten years old, probably very affordable and still cheap to run, probably working just fine too. What's going to happen when the kids get these cars!?
Anyway, discuss this car and also the direction the performance car industry is heading now we have such powerful new cars to play around with
Kawasicki said:
Only 1.4 kbhp. Disappoint.
Others have over 2!
Well, this is the crazy world we find ourselves in all of a sudden! 5 minutes ago everyone was clutching their tinkle when the Veyron landed with 1000bhp, now you can buy a practical and 'affordable' 4 door car with well over that power - there are thousands on the roads today!Others have over 2!
Who saw this coming!?
1400hp is probably enough for a daily though
Getting 1000bhp+ from an ICE was an impressive feat of engineering. With an EV, its more a case of putting in a bigger motor, extra motor, bigger battery pack. It feels a bit easy.
I would like to know what the usable range of this AMG will be. It must be stuffed with batteries to actually get anywhere....and back.
I dont see the 'value' in such a car being preserved. A Ferrari engine is a masterpiece. A motor and battery are not. Will that mean that these EVs do ultimately become affordable in the future, to levels that they fall into the wrong hands. I don't see them as appreciating assets or an investment.
The car market is increasingly changing its rules.
I would like to know what the usable range of this AMG will be. It must be stuffed with batteries to actually get anywhere....and back.
I dont see the 'value' in such a car being preserved. A Ferrari engine is a masterpiece. A motor and battery are not. Will that mean that these EVs do ultimately become affordable in the future, to levels that they fall into the wrong hands. I don't see them as appreciating assets or an investment.
The car market is increasingly changing its rules.
TheDeuce said:
Kawasicki said:
Only 1.4 kbhp. Disappoint.
Others have over 2!
Well, this is the crazy world we find ourselves in all of a sudden! 5 minutes ago everyone was clutching their tinkle when the Veyron landed with 1000bhp, now you can buy a practical and 'affordable' 4 door car with well over that power - there are thousands on the roads today!Others have over 2!
Who saw this coming!?
1400hp is probably enough for a daily though
TUS373 said:
Getting 1000bhp+ from an ICE was an impressive feat of engineering. With an EV, its more a case of putting in a bigger motor, extra motor, bigger battery pack. It feels a bit easy.
I would like to know what the usable range of this AMG will be. It must be stuffed with batteries to actually get anywhere....and back.
I dont see the 'value' in such a car being preserved. A Ferrari engine is a masterpiece. A motor and battery are not. Will that mean that these EVs do ultimately become affordable in the future, to levels that they fall into the wrong hands. I don't see them as appreciating assets or an investment.
The car market is increasingly changing its rules.
I think you are underestimating the tech involved here. EVs are inherently more efficient in generating power, but they are also more challenging to package in physical size and weight for a practical range. This one has a very low drag coefficient, along with next gen motors and battery tech. I would like to know what the usable range of this AMG will be. It must be stuffed with batteries to actually get anywhere....and back.
I dont see the 'value' in such a car being preserved. A Ferrari engine is a masterpiece. A motor and battery are not. Will that mean that these EVs do ultimately become affordable in the future, to levels that they fall into the wrong hands. I don't see them as appreciating assets or an investment.
The car market is increasingly changing its rules.
Simply putting in bigger motors and bigger batteries doesn’t work when weight is already a primary issue. The challenge here is to achieve more power and range with the same or less weight.
You could argue that maybe 1400 hp is far more than required for a road car and they should be focusing more on reducing weight and increasing range at this stage. But there are likely to be lesser powered variants which will achieve those aims too.
TUS373 said:
Getting 1000bhp+ from an ICE was an impressive feat of engineering. With an EV, its more a case of putting in a bigger motor, extra motor, bigger battery pack. It feels a bit easy.
I would like to know what the usable range of this AMG will be. It must be stuffed with batteries to actually get anywhere....and back.
I dont see the 'value' in such a car being preserved. A Ferrari engine is a masterpiece. A motor and battery are not. Will that mean that these EVs do ultimately become affordable in the future, to levels that they fall into the wrong hands. I don't see them as appreciating assets or an investment.
The car market is increasingly changing its rules.
You can get 1400 hp, or far higher, from the same size battery pack you'd find I'm a typical EV these days, they don't need to keep adding heavy batteries to get more power, just a slightly larger and heavier motor - we're talking a few kilos difference.I would like to know what the usable range of this AMG will be. It must be stuffed with batteries to actually get anywhere....and back.
I dont see the 'value' in such a car being preserved. A Ferrari engine is a masterpiece. A motor and battery are not. Will that mean that these EVs do ultimately become affordable in the future, to levels that they fall into the wrong hands. I don't see them as appreciating assets or an investment.
The car market is increasingly changing its rules.
As this is a new platform for Merc, I'd expect weight and range to be good, given what they've already achieved in the past and also taking into account that the petrol equivalent would be catastrophically inefficient and itself severely range limited.
A Bugatti Chiron has very similar top trump specs, you won't get more than 200 miles range from one of those even if you drive it fairly politely.
ChocolateFrog said:
Funny that it's only urchins when the £ per bhp comes down to a certain undefined ratio.
As long as it's only millionaires that can afford silly fast cars no one cares. Because somehow how much money you have in the bank directly correlates to how well you can drive.
Indeed. Plenty of absolute pricks come over to London from the Middle East in the summer, and spend their evenings hooning around Knightsbridge in supercars. For those guys, the price of something like this is chump change whatever its actual price is.As long as it's only millionaires that can afford silly fast cars no one cares. Because somehow how much money you have in the bank directly correlates to how well you can drive.
ChocolateFrog said:
As long as it's only millionaires that can afford silly fast cars no one cares. Because somehow how much money you have in the bank directly correlates to how well you can drive.
I'd argue there's probably a some correlation between wealth and common sense/brain power even if it's not a linear... uktrailmonster said:
TUS373 said:
Getting 1000bhp+ from an ICE was an impressive feat of engineering. With an EV, its more a case of putting in a bigger motor, extra motor, bigger battery pack. It feels a bit easy.
I would like to know what the usable range of this AMG will be. It must be stuffed with batteries to actually get anywhere....and back.
I dont see the 'value' in such a car being preserved. A Ferrari engine is a masterpiece. A motor and battery are not. Will that mean that these EVs do ultimately become affordable in the future, to levels that they fall into the wrong hands. I don't see them as appreciating assets or an investment.
The car market is increasingly changing its rules.
I think you are underestimating the tech involved here. EVs are inherently more efficient in generating power, but they are also more challenging to package in physical size and weight for a practical range. This one has a very low drag coefficient, along with next gen motors and battery tech. I would like to know what the usable range of this AMG will be. It must be stuffed with batteries to actually get anywhere....and back.
I dont see the 'value' in such a car being preserved. A Ferrari engine is a masterpiece. A motor and battery are not. Will that mean that these EVs do ultimately become affordable in the future, to levels that they fall into the wrong hands. I don't see them as appreciating assets or an investment.
The car market is increasingly changing its rules.
Simply putting in bigger motors and bigger batteries doesn t work when weight is already a primary issue. The challenge here is to achieve more power and range with the same or less weight.
You could argue that maybe 1400 hp is far more than required for a road car and they should be focusing more on reducing weight and increasing range at this stage. But there are likely to be lesser powered variants which will achieve those aims too.
People will stand and look at Ferrai engine through the glass bonnet. Its a kind of beautiful thing. Im not sure that we will linger to look at inverters and orange cables in a similar way.
TUS373 said:
People will stand and look at Ferrai engine through the glass bonnet. Its a kind of beautiful thing. Im not sure that we will linger to look at inverters and orange cables in a similar way.
TUS373 said:
uktrailmonster said:
TUS373 said:
Getting 1000bhp+ from an ICE was an impressive feat of engineering. With an EV, its more a case of putting in a bigger motor, extra motor, bigger battery pack. It feels a bit easy.
I would like to know what the usable range of this AMG will be. It must be stuffed with batteries to actually get anywhere....and back.
I dont see the 'value' in such a car being preserved. A Ferrari engine is a masterpiece. A motor and battery are not. Will that mean that these EVs do ultimately become affordable in the future, to levels that they fall into the wrong hands. I don't see them as appreciating assets or an investment.
The car market is increasingly changing its rules.
I think you are underestimating the tech involved here. EVs are inherently more efficient in generating power, but they are also more challenging to package in physical size and weight for a practical range. This one has a very low drag coefficient, along with next gen motors and battery tech. I would like to know what the usable range of this AMG will be. It must be stuffed with batteries to actually get anywhere....and back.
I dont see the 'value' in such a car being preserved. A Ferrari engine is a masterpiece. A motor and battery are not. Will that mean that these EVs do ultimately become affordable in the future, to levels that they fall into the wrong hands. I don't see them as appreciating assets or an investment.
The car market is increasingly changing its rules.
Simply putting in bigger motors and bigger batteries doesn t work when weight is already a primary issue. The challenge here is to achieve more power and range with the same or less weight.
You could argue that maybe 1400 hp is far more than required for a road car and they should be focusing more on reducing weight and increasing range at this stage. But there are likely to be lesser powered variants which will achieve those aims too.
People will stand and look at Ferrai engine through the glass bonnet. Its a kind of beautiful thing. Im not sure that we will linger to look at inverters and orange cables in a similar way.
Seriously now - it's all lovely that beautiful cars should have the prettier bits of their mechanicals on display as car porn, but nothing trumps the principle purpose of a fast car: it's there to be fast. A show off car doesn't actually need to be driven fast, but it has to have that ability otherwise it's a fraud. When I was a kid a Lamborghini or Ferrari were incredible because I knew they were insanely fast. We're rapidly approaching a point at which the fastest IC cars can no longer be considered generally unbeatable, they're starting to look slow.
Pointing at a pretty mid mounted engine loses some gravity when everyone in the car park is well aware that the silent car parked next to it is the one that's actually got the pace.
I remember a friend back in the boy racer days of motoring that had a 4 exit titanium tipped exhaust bolted to his Saxo. The exhaust was indeed beautiful, but somewhat undermined by the fact we knew the car itself wasn't actually all that capable.
TUS373 said:
uktrailmonster said:
TUS373 said:
Getting 1000bhp+ from an ICE was an impressive feat of engineering. With an EV, its more a case of putting in a bigger motor, extra motor, bigger battery pack. It feels a bit easy.
I would like to know what the usable range of this AMG will be. It must be stuffed with batteries to actually get anywhere....and back.
I dont see the 'value' in such a car being preserved. A Ferrari engine is a masterpiece. A motor and battery are not. Will that mean that these EVs do ultimately become affordable in the future, to levels that they fall into the wrong hands. I don't see them as appreciating assets or an investment.
The car market is increasingly changing its rules.
I think you are underestimating the tech involved here. EVs are inherently more efficient in generating power, but they are also more challenging to package in physical size and weight for a practical range. This one has a very low drag coefficient, along with next gen motors and battery tech. I would like to know what the usable range of this AMG will be. It must be stuffed with batteries to actually get anywhere....and back.
I dont see the 'value' in such a car being preserved. A Ferrari engine is a masterpiece. A motor and battery are not. Will that mean that these EVs do ultimately become affordable in the future, to levels that they fall into the wrong hands. I don't see them as appreciating assets or an investment.
The car market is increasingly changing its rules.
Simply putting in bigger motors and bigger batteries doesn t work when weight is already a primary issue. The challenge here is to achieve more power and range with the same or less weight.
You could argue that maybe 1400 hp is far more than required for a road car and they should be focusing more on reducing weight and increasing range at this stage. But there are likely to be lesser powered variants which will achieve those aims too.
People will stand and look at Ferrai engine through the glass bonnet. Its a kind of beautiful thing. Im not sure that we will linger to look at inverters and orange cables in a similar way.
TUS373 said:
People will stand and look at Ferrai engine through the glass bonnet. Its a kind of beautiful thing. Im not sure that we will linger to look at inverters and orange cables in a similar way.
- Some* people are looking at the engine for that.
And this is hardly much to stare at (though what are those orange things
)We are judging these things by last century standards. Kids born in this century won't give a stuff.
Murph7355 said:
TUS373 said:
People will stand and look at Ferrai engine through the glass bonnet. Its a kind of beautiful thing. Im not sure that we will linger to look at inverters and orange cables in a similar way.
- Some* people are looking at the engine for that.
And this is hardly much to stare at (though what are those orange things
)We are judging these things by last century standards. Kids born in this century won't give a stuff.
The upcoming generation won't have an established love for cylinders or induction roar, they will judge performance cars for what they're supposed to do - which is to perform. We should all have some appreciation for that logic actually...
If it says 'fast' on the tin then it's supposed to be fast. I'd love the fastest car to be one with a fun engine, but in the end, if performance is the goal, the fun engine has to be sacrificed for the sake of performance. I would feel differently if the goal was 'fun car regardless of actual performance', but that's not what Merc are selling here - they're selling performance.
TheDeuce said:
Very true.
The upcoming generation won't have an established love for cylinders or induction roar, they will judge performance cars for what they're supposed to do - which is to perform. We should all have some appreciation for that logic actually...
If it says 'fast' on the tin then it's supposed to be fast. I'd love the fastest car to be one with a fun engine, but in the end, if performance is the goal, the fun engine has to be sacrificed for the sake of performance. I would feel differently if the goal was 'fun car regardless of actual performance', but that's not what Merc are selling here - they're selling performance.
I think they're selling performance along with 4-door practicality and pushing the envelope on the style front (I like it, inside and out. I also like that it's marmite...that's what high end cars need to be..."outlandish" to differing degrees).The upcoming generation won't have an established love for cylinders or induction roar, they will judge performance cars for what they're supposed to do - which is to perform. We should all have some appreciation for that logic actually...
If it says 'fast' on the tin then it's supposed to be fast. I'd love the fastest car to be one with a fun engine, but in the end, if performance is the goal, the fun engine has to be sacrificed for the sake of performance. I would feel differently if the goal was 'fun car regardless of actual performance', but that's not what Merc are selling here - they're selling performance.
Engines schmengines. I think manufacturers are also appreciating that a lot of people don't have time or possibly even the space to indulge in owning multiple cars. So it's increasingly important to be able to cater for the wife and kids at the same time. Especially with cars costing so much now.
What I'd like to see from Ferrari, Lamborghini, Aston, Porsche etc is some serious engineering talent going into weight reduction. That will be an area of differentiation (beyond style) that I suspect will be difficult for competitors to copy as I suspect exotic materials etc will feature heavily (sic). And as we all know, lighter weight will convey huge performance advantages.
I'm very much last century at 55. But when the tech is right I've never been unduly hell bent not to adopt it. Did ABS spoil any car I ever had?/ Nope. Even though I learnt how to cadence brake. Did PDK spoil my 997? Nope. It enhanced it, even though I know how to heel and toe. Does the Taycan being electric spoil the fun versus my old B7 RS4? Hell no. It's quicker (still wish the Taycan was narrower though).
And to prove I'm not entirely emotionless, the Caterham is staying
Murph7355 said:
TheDeuce said:
Very true.
The upcoming generation won't have an established love for cylinders or induction roar, they will judge performance cars for what they're supposed to do - which is to perform. We should all have some appreciation for that logic actually...
If it says 'fast' on the tin then it's supposed to be fast. I'd love the fastest car to be one with a fun engine, but in the end, if performance is the goal, the fun engine has to be sacrificed for the sake of performance. I would feel differently if the goal was 'fun car regardless of actual performance', but that's not what Merc are selling here - they're selling performance.
I think they're selling performance along with 4-door practicality and pushing the envelope on the style front (I like it, inside and out. I also like that it's marmite...that's what high end cars need to be..."outlandish" to differing degrees).The upcoming generation won't have an established love for cylinders or induction roar, they will judge performance cars for what they're supposed to do - which is to perform. We should all have some appreciation for that logic actually...
If it says 'fast' on the tin then it's supposed to be fast. I'd love the fastest car to be one with a fun engine, but in the end, if performance is the goal, the fun engine has to be sacrificed for the sake of performance. I would feel differently if the goal was 'fun car regardless of actual performance', but that's not what Merc are selling here - they're selling performance.
Engines schmengines. I think manufacturers are also appreciating that a lot of people don't have time or possibly even the space to indulge in owning multiple cars. So it's increasingly important to be able to cater for the wife and kids at the same time. Especially with cars costing so much now.
What I'd like to see from Ferrari, Lamborghini, Aston, Porsche etc is some serious engineering talent going into weight reduction. That will be an area of differentiation (beyond style) that I suspect will be difficult for competitors to copy as I suspect exotic materials etc will feature heavily (sic). And as we all know, lighter weight will convey huge performance advantages.
I'm very much last century at 55. But when the tech is right I've never been unduly hell bent not to adopt it. Did ABS spoil any car I ever had?/ Nope. Even though I learnt how to cadence brake. Did PDK spoil my 997? Nope. It enhanced it, even though I know how to heel and toe. Does the Taycan being electric spoil the fun versus my old B7 RS4? Hell no. It's quicker (still wish the Taycan was narrower though).
And to prove I'm not entirely emotionless, the Caterham is staying
With modern high performance cars, the sort that a normal person might actually be able to put on their drive... The big change is obviously the engine note being taken away - that's sad in a way, but what did that engine note ever actually mean? It meant 'powerful fast car'. These new cars are superior at that fundamental goal, they're very fast and very powerful. It's a net win if the target is to design or own such a car.
Another often overlooked win is the ability to actually enjoy the performance of a powerful EV in an affordable manner. If you have a very powerful IC car then a 20 minute Sunday B road blast results in £20 of fuel being spent, do that every day and you have a £600 fuel bill each month... I have a friend that has that fuel bill in his X4M! Drive a performance EV the same way, your fuel bill might increase from £30 a month to £40. I can make peace with my car not making vroom vroom noises so long as £500 a month (and actually having a faster car) is the compensation.
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