Reeves plans £2bn Budget raid on UK retirement savings
Discussion
Utter madness as published already by most news but FT link below.
https://www.ft.com/content/556ba05c-6a30-4d8c-834d...
https://www.ft.com/content/556ba05c-6a30-4d8c-834d...
Well, the state needs money. And clearly our society doesnt want to tax wealth/assets. Especially this forum. Who do you expect is going to end up paying?
Everyone was very happy when we were funded through borrowing instead of taxes and house prices were racing. Now that we need to pay the bill we fall apart. Really?
Im impacted as well but its the right thing to do.
Everyone was very happy when we were funded through borrowing instead of taxes and house prices were racing. Now that we need to pay the bill we fall apart. Really?
Im impacted as well but its the right thing to do.
Too many people on benefits not working, and not enough people working to pay for everything.
The answer, cut spending? Nah, just tax those stupid enough to work more and more to pay for it.
If everything in the press about the budget is true then they are going to remove every remaining incentive there is to bother working for a living.
I honestly think Labour want those who work to only be able to afford to live hand to mouth. Renting from a large corporation for life, not being able to afford to run a car, removing the incentive for paying into a pension, removing the ISA allowance, moving back the state pension age and making them work until the day they drop down dead.
All the whole those who never work get given a house, constantly increasing benefits, a motobility car and a guaranteed pension despite never paying a penny in national insurance.
And with the sheer number of people who never work due to "illness" increasing year on year, this can only increase.
Instead of making like for the scroungers harder in an attempt to force them to work they go after the people who work as it is easier.
Too much stick and not enough carrot, I can just see more and more people either retiring early or just not bothering to work as there is no incentive.
Plus there is no accountability for tax payers money, as someone on here said, £300 billion for Covid, billions wasted on fraud, councils going bankrupt because they were allowed to "invest" money or spend it on vanity projects with zero control.
My company does work for the NHS, I know of several projects where they have spent £100k up front with us, lost interest or the person left and now never return calls or emails.
Because it is tax payers money, no one seems to care.
The answer, cut spending? Nah, just tax those stupid enough to work more and more to pay for it.
If everything in the press about the budget is true then they are going to remove every remaining incentive there is to bother working for a living.
I honestly think Labour want those who work to only be able to afford to live hand to mouth. Renting from a large corporation for life, not being able to afford to run a car, removing the incentive for paying into a pension, removing the ISA allowance, moving back the state pension age and making them work until the day they drop down dead.
All the whole those who never work get given a house, constantly increasing benefits, a motobility car and a guaranteed pension despite never paying a penny in national insurance.
And with the sheer number of people who never work due to "illness" increasing year on year, this can only increase.
Instead of making like for the scroungers harder in an attempt to force them to work they go after the people who work as it is easier.
Too much stick and not enough carrot, I can just see more and more people either retiring early or just not bothering to work as there is no incentive.
Plus there is no accountability for tax payers money, as someone on here said, £300 billion for Covid, billions wasted on fraud, councils going bankrupt because they were allowed to "invest" money or spend it on vanity projects with zero control.
My company does work for the NHS, I know of several projects where they have spent £100k up front with us, lost interest or the person left and now never return calls or emails.
Because it is tax payers money, no one seems to care.
Edited by ThingsBehindTheSun on Saturday 8th November 07:35
Respectfully, once you look into the figures, cutting benefits is saving peanuts relative to our debt and interest so only raising taxes can clean this mess.
I do agree that we have a cultural issue to be solved for benefits. And needs to be addressed. But numbers wise - barely makes a dent at great workload. We are in crisis so need draconian measures.
I dont know how to quote just the nhs part of the previous post - but absolutely ridiculous. Im sure its similar across the board.
I do agree that we have a cultural issue to be solved for benefits. And needs to be addressed. But numbers wise - barely makes a dent at great workload. We are in crisis so need draconian measures.
I dont know how to quote just the nhs part of the previous post - but absolutely ridiculous. Im sure its similar across the board.
Edited by Blue_star on Saturday 8th November 07:43
Blue_star said:
Respectfully, once you look into the figures, cutting benefits is saving peanuts relative to our debt and interest so only raising taxes can clean this mess.
I do agree that we have a cultural issue to be solved for benefits. And needs to be addressed. But numbers wise - barely makes a dent at great workload. We are in crisis so need draconian measures.
I dont know how to quote just the nhs part of the previous post - but absolutely ridiculous. Im sure its similar across the board.
I think people would have less objections to paying more if they could see the state was using the money wisely and efficiently. Cutting welfare might only make a small saving, but make tax increases easier to swallow.I do agree that we have a cultural issue to be solved for benefits. And needs to be addressed. But numbers wise - barely makes a dent at great workload. We are in crisis so need draconian measures.
I dont know how to quote just the nhs part of the previous post - but absolutely ridiculous. Im sure its similar across the board.
Edited by Blue_star on Saturday 8th November 07:43
Blue_star said:
Respectfully, once you look into the figures, cutting benefits is saving peanuts relative to our debt and interest so only raising taxes can clean this mess.
We're spending £170bn a year on benefits excluding pensions that's not peanuts, "only raising taxes can clean this mess up" but she's already made that statement at the last budget, and yet here we are 12 months later with the same solution to the same issue that wasn't fixed by the last tax raid. She'll be back next year as well, record borrowing, record debt, record tax take and it will solve nothing.
They spend £2.3 billion on taxis taking children to school, more than this change will raise.
How much do they spend on housing asylum seekers?
How many bounce back loans are written off as it is too much hassle to chase up?
How much is wasted in the NHS?
How many public sector workers are there who are doing made up jobs?
20% of all new car registrations are motability cars.
One on five adults or working age are out of the workforce.
948,000 youngsters between the age of 16 and 24 are Neets. To be honest they are the sensible ones, there is no incentive for them to ever start the hamster wheel of working for a living.
Let's not fix the problem let's just get all the workers to pay more In tax as that is easier.
It cannot go on forever.
How much do they spend on housing asylum seekers?
How many bounce back loans are written off as it is too much hassle to chase up?
How much is wasted in the NHS?
How many public sector workers are there who are doing made up jobs?
20% of all new car registrations are motability cars.
One on five adults or working age are out of the workforce.
948,000 youngsters between the age of 16 and 24 are Neets. To be honest they are the sensible ones, there is no incentive for them to ever start the hamster wheel of working for a living.
Let's not fix the problem let's just get all the workers to pay more In tax as that is easier.
It cannot go on forever.
I spend 40 years in Banking and learnt lots about financial economics, I have subsequently forgotten it all now in retirement.
However I do remember the basics, and we all know the basics .
It's just like running a house . Money in and money out . The economy of the UK is no different. We have money in and money out . They don't Ballance.
The Government have two leavers to pull yet they only pull one . It's a self fulfilling journey to absolute bankruptcy for us as an individual. The government is doing it on mass scale.
The answer is spend less, the glaring and obvious target is the huge loan repayment interest we pay, benefits for too many and not where deserved, coupled with not working culture .
Punishment for those who work to follow . You can't tax effectively those who are net receivers and not contributors .
However I do remember the basics, and we all know the basics .
It's just like running a house . Money in and money out . The economy of the UK is no different. We have money in and money out . They don't Ballance.
The Government have two leavers to pull yet they only pull one . It's a self fulfilling journey to absolute bankruptcy for us as an individual. The government is doing it on mass scale.
The answer is spend less, the glaring and obvious target is the huge loan repayment interest we pay, benefits for too many and not where deserved, coupled with not working culture .
Punishment for those who work to follow . You can't tax effectively those who are net receivers and not contributors .
I SS a third of salary so this one sounds particularly painful.
The economic doom loop is real.
See also.
https://www.ft.com/content/8463d8f3-e4ae-4ffa-9b7b...
The economic doom loop is real.
See also.
https://www.ft.com/content/8463d8f3-e4ae-4ffa-9b7b...
Edited by AllyM on Saturday 8th November 09:27
Every post is bang on.
Yet many voters think like this 20 year-old who posted on Facebook recently after her father commented on the uncontrolled arrival of asylum seekers...
Yet many voters think like this 20 year-old who posted on Facebook recently after her father commented on the uncontrolled arrival of asylum seekers...
young person said:
'What a shame that the mainstream media s pro- reform, anti-immigrant propaganda has got to my dad
You know the news outlets are right wing because they re owned by billionaires, and persuading ordinary people to blame each other instead of those hoarding the wealth benefits them because it means the aren t held accountable, right?
The people in this country are suffering because of years and years of selfish decision making aimed at keeping the rich richer, taxing ordinary people though the roof while cutting public services when they could fund everything we need from taxing the mega-rich who wouldn t feel the effects at all
Our problems are not caused by asylum seekers, who have every right to seeking safety from a country where their lives are at risk. They aren t coming here illegally either - seeking asylum is never illegal, and the wouldn t take the dangerous journey if they weren t absolutely desperate for safety at the end of it.
Funding the NHS properly, nationalising water and energy and public transport, rent caps - policies that help control this cost of living crisis created by the mega-wealthy that profit from inequality - is the solution to the sad state of our country, not hating people based on where they were born.
So for them the answer is simply 'Soak the rich' and 'Let everyone in'.You know the news outlets are right wing because they re owned by billionaires, and persuading ordinary people to blame each other instead of those hoarding the wealth benefits them because it means the aren t held accountable, right?
The people in this country are suffering because of years and years of selfish decision making aimed at keeping the rich richer, taxing ordinary people though the roof while cutting public services when they could fund everything we need from taxing the mega-rich who wouldn t feel the effects at all
Our problems are not caused by asylum seekers, who have every right to seeking safety from a country where their lives are at risk. They aren t coming here illegally either - seeking asylum is never illegal, and the wouldn t take the dangerous journey if they weren t absolutely desperate for safety at the end of it.
Funding the NHS properly, nationalising water and energy and public transport, rent caps - policies that help control this cost of living crisis created by the mega-wealthy that profit from inequality - is the solution to the sad state of our country, not hating people based on where they were born.
Blue_star said:
Respectfully, once you look into the figures, cutting benefits is saving peanuts relative to our debt and interest so only raising taxes can clean this mess.
I
Respectfully, you need to go back to primary school and re-learn basic maths. You will end up in serious poverty eventually, like many who voted for the current government...I
Edited by Blue_star on Saturday 8th November 07:43
ooid said:
Utter madness as published already by most news but FT link below.
https://www.ft.com/content/556ba05c-6a30-4d8c-834d...
Paywalled.https://www.ft.com/content/556ba05c-6a30-4d8c-834d...
Is this the possible removal of salary sacrifice for pension contributions?
If so, the headline is incorrect. It's not stopping people making pension contributions or taxing pension assets. It's stopping people avoiding NI on their pension contributions.
Salary sacrifice has been around for donkeys years, and was originally permitted when employee pension contributions were limited to 15% of salary. It enabled people to contribute more than that by surrendering salary for an equivalent employer pension contribution. However, of late it has been totally abused with mundane and even workplace pensions being funded this way.
ooid said:
Blue_star said:
Respectfully, once you look into the figures, cutting benefits is saving peanuts relative to our debt and interest so only raising taxes can clean this mess.
I
Respectfully, you need to go back to primary school and re-learn basic maths. You will end up in serious poverty eventually, like many who voted for the current government...I
Edited by Blue_star on Saturday 8th November 07:43
I guess the point I am making is that previous governments were booking debt after debt. Suddenly rates are up due to risk perceived in the market.
This is what attracted our attention and we suddenly want cuts. Current welfare state was running for ages but with debts booked we kicked the can down the road.
I can see you have voted far more intelligently than those who chose labour.
Thing is that the main adversary in election, Farage also admitted that state of affairs is such we need to stabilise finances and cut debt. So clearly not his voter.
Perhaps you voted for the guys who borrowed all the money in the pst 14 years. Not sure why you are so mighty considering they are responsible for where we are.
Or perhaps you didnt vote for any of them and you voted like me so you can join me in primary school. We are clearly equally smart.
Also just the perception of stabilising budget will have positive impact on interest. At £10Bn a month its a low hanging fruit.
There was no need to insult me, was there? What do you disagree with from my way of thinking?
Edited by Blue_star on Saturday 8th November 10:34
Rufus Stone said:
ooid said:
Utter madness as published already by most news but FT link below.
https://www.ft.com/content/556ba05c-6a30-4d8c-834d...
Paywalled.https://www.ft.com/content/556ba05c-6a30-4d8c-834d...
Is this the possible removal of salary sacrifice for pension contributions?
If so, the headline is incorrect. It's not stopping people making pension contributions or taxing pension assets. It's stopping people avoiding NI on their pension contributions.
Salary sacrifice has been around for donkeys years, and was originally permitted when employee pension contributions were limited to 15% of salary. It enabled people to contribute more than that by surrendering salary for an equivalent employer pension contribution. However, of late it has been totally abused with mundane and even workplace pensions being funded this way.
Blue_star said:
Well, the state needs money.
butchstewie said:
I know nobody likes taxes but stuff does cost money.
What the state needs to do is cut back on its spending, or at least cut back on the runaway growth of its spending. And the state isn't acquiring/creating any stuff with its money, it's just spaffing money up the wall. What we're talking about here is the fundamental difference between "spending" and "investing".Panamax said:
Blue_star said:
Well, the state needs money.
butchstewie said:
I know nobody likes taxes but stuff does cost money.
What the state needs to do is cut back on its spending, or at least cut back on the runaway growth of its spending. And the state isn't acquiring/creating any stuff with its money, it's just spaffing money up the wall. What we're talking about here is the fundamental difference between "spending" and "investing".Gassing Station | Finance | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff