standard S1 or 111S
Discussion
I am looking for an S1 and cannot decide between a standard or 111S.
1.First of all, is there a big difference in insurance, the enquieries I have made so far suggests there is?
2.Does the C/R gbox make much difference - the car will be used 90% road 10% track?
3.Can the standard S1 engine be brought up to VVC outputs cheaply enough and at that level which is the nicer engine to use?
4.On another recent posting, one the upgrades to the standard engine to 140 -150 is the ECU. Is this a rechip, another Rover/Lotus ECU or an aftermarket such as Emerald?
Thanks for help chaps
1.First of all, is there a big difference in insurance, the enquieries I have made so far suggests there is?
2.Does the C/R gbox make much difference - the car will be used 90% road 10% track?
3.Can the standard S1 engine be brought up to VVC outputs cheaply enough and at that level which is the nicer engine to use?
4.On another recent posting, one the upgrades to the standard engine to 140 -150 is the ECU. Is this a rechip, another Rover/Lotus ECU or an aftermarket such as Emerald?
Thanks for help chaps
Hi there - you are going to have fun regardless. The price premium is obviously not as great as it would be on a new car.
The 111s gets you slightly wider rims and rubber as standard but as neither model is understeery anyway, the grip levels are high.
You get 143 bhp on the 111s - very little / none of which will come into effect in the lower range over and above the standard S1. In sub 70mph driving it is more the effect of the close ratio box that helps. If you like revs, you get another 1000rpm on the rev range vs standard S1. Up to the point that the standard S1 has to change up and the 111s has more revs to go, they are not as different as the figures suggest. My S2 111s is probably ~160 bhp (Exhaust, induction) but doesn't exactly walk away from S2's with the same mods. Noticeable difference in the 70-100mph range, but not really below that. I probably need more driver mods than engine mods at the moment.
The 111s can probably be pushed to ~170 bhp but beyond that you have to blank the VVC mechanism etc. Standard S1 can get very useful gains from exhaust, induction, 160 throttle bodies and ECU (usually meaning the emerald which is hugely mappable rather than a simple chip) You might find an S1 that already has many of the mods done. Next step would be head & cams. After that, serious internal work if you want to get towards 200bhp. Other option is the sport 160 if you find one.
Try them both, but most importantly find a car that you like the look / colour of, is in good nick and has the sign that it was loved and cared for by its owner. Have you driven any yet?
>> Edited by shangani on Friday 7th October 07:45
The 111s gets you slightly wider rims and rubber as standard but as neither model is understeery anyway, the grip levels are high.
You get 143 bhp on the 111s - very little / none of which will come into effect in the lower range over and above the standard S1. In sub 70mph driving it is more the effect of the close ratio box that helps. If you like revs, you get another 1000rpm on the rev range vs standard S1. Up to the point that the standard S1 has to change up and the 111s has more revs to go, they are not as different as the figures suggest. My S2 111s is probably ~160 bhp (Exhaust, induction) but doesn't exactly walk away from S2's with the same mods. Noticeable difference in the 70-100mph range, but not really below that. I probably need more driver mods than engine mods at the moment.
The 111s can probably be pushed to ~170 bhp but beyond that you have to blank the VVC mechanism etc. Standard S1 can get very useful gains from exhaust, induction, 160 throttle bodies and ECU (usually meaning the emerald which is hugely mappable rather than a simple chip) You might find an S1 that already has many of the mods done. Next step would be head & cams. After that, serious internal work if you want to get towards 200bhp. Other option is the sport 160 if you find one.
Try them both, but most importantly find a car that you like the look / colour of, is in good nick and has the sign that it was loved and cared for by its owner. Have you driven any yet?
>> Edited by shangani on Friday 7th October 07:45
Si,
Another vote for the 111s from me!
I was having the same dilema a few years back.
To me the 111s is just that little bit special. Nicer seats, wider rear rims, extra spoiler, some interior tat and that lovely VVC head and CR box.
As has been said before, the CR box accounts for most of the performance difference 0-60. But it is just really drivable - you've always got just the right gear when you need it. With a sports exhaust and and a CRP it really howls as it nears the rev limit - totally addictive!
That said, if you are going to be doing any longish commutes you would find the standard S1 more relaxed. Mine revs at about 4000-4500 at 80 mph if memory serves? It's a bit manic but it doesn't bother me in the slightest. Specially when I hit those back roads!
In any case, both cars are very similar in performance, the standard is probably a better starting point if you are looking at serious engine mods down the line. the 111s, better if you are just going to stick to bolt on stuff.
111s may hold it's value a little better as well? if that is a consideration.
Don't rule out a sport 135 if you can find one - possibly a good option for you. Or a 160 (needs to be well sorted for road use - better for giving it the works round a track!)
Have fun and drive as many as you can.
Dunc
Another vote for the 111s from me!
I was having the same dilema a few years back.
To me the 111s is just that little bit special. Nicer seats, wider rear rims, extra spoiler, some interior tat and that lovely VVC head and CR box.
As has been said before, the CR box accounts for most of the performance difference 0-60. But it is just really drivable - you've always got just the right gear when you need it. With a sports exhaust and and a CRP it really howls as it nears the rev limit - totally addictive!
That said, if you are going to be doing any longish commutes you would find the standard S1 more relaxed. Mine revs at about 4000-4500 at 80 mph if memory serves? It's a bit manic but it doesn't bother me in the slightest. Specially when I hit those back roads!
In any case, both cars are very similar in performance, the standard is probably a better starting point if you are looking at serious engine mods down the line. the 111s, better if you are just going to stick to bolt on stuff.
111s may hold it's value a little better as well? if that is a consideration.
Don't rule out a sport 135 if you can find one - possibly a good option for you. Or a 160 (needs to be well sorted for road use - better for giving it the works round a track!)
Have fun and drive as many as you can.
Dunc
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