Moving area for better schools / quality of life?

[Crumpet]

As per the title, has anyone moved area specifically to be in the catchment of top state secondary schools?

We live in an area that’s got some of the lowest performing schools in the country and would be described by many as a ‘sthole’. It’s West Yorkshire, and it’s a fking dump. There are some ok villages, and we’re in one of them, but you’re still always a stones throw from places you really don’t want to be near.

Aside from the state of the schools there’s just an ever growing amount of ‘stuff’ that’s starting to chip away at our happiness - and we’re generally very happy! There’s the clear social decline that seems to be taking place everywhere; think balaclava wearing, e-bike riding, lawless, machete carrying scum. There’s a noticeable increase in crime. There’s the ever increasing amount of littering and fly-tipping; almost every night some bd will have fly-tipped a load of st on one of the lanes in and out of our village. The hedges are so strewn with litter that it’s sickening. The pavements and lanes are covered with dog st. 5000 new houses are planned a mile or so away, massive agricultural buildings are being built for no actual purpose and there’s a huge industrial development being built on the edge of the village. It’s all just making me want to live somewhere else as I don’t really enjoy where we are now. I actually hate the area as it offers nothing that I like but I’m fortunate that I spend most of my time away.

But has anyone moved for the above reasons - primarily schooling - and it not worked out? Are we going to be swapping one lot of issues for a different set of issues?

It’s hard to put this without sounding like a dick, but it’ll be to somewhere a bit more upmarket and affluent, the current focus being York and Ripon. Financially it should be a total win as we’d resigned ourselves to budgeting for our two children to go to private school. I’d much rather they went to state school and this move would be a solution that saves the best part of £300k over 7 years. I just think those numbers are insane, not helped by Labour’s spiteful tax - another topic entirely!

So, greener grass on the other side or just another shade of brown?

[lizardbrain]

It’s all correlated for better or worse . And generally house prices tell you all you need to know.

[beambeam1]

Regardless of the schooling situation it sounds like you need to move for your own sanity anyway. Move and do it with enough time for yourselves and kids to settle into the area too before school.

[okgo]

What other issues do you think you could see?

As the second poster says, there’s very good reason that people with the funds to do so generally live in fairly defined pockets of the U.K. it’s because they’re nice and it’s harder for aholes who don’t know how to behave to be there, exceptions apply everywhere of course.

Anyway, yes we did it (though not for state schools) and it’s been worth it, and I say that having paid out a lot of money on fees and stamp as we bought a house in 2020 we shouldn’t have so had to buy again. Life to short to be unhappy in your home.

[DonkeyApple]

You get just one chance to give your children the best start in life and the second most important part of that is schooling. If you have the means to use the private system or buy into the catchment of a top state school then do it. It's just 7 years of your adult life but a massive part of theirs. You probably only need to stay there for a few years after while they do uni and settle into careers and then you can go back to living where you want to for the rest of your lives.

[Aluminati]

I absolutely understand where you are coming from.

I was born in London (E2) my parents strived to get us out, and succeeded. Then came round 2, I needed to do the same for my lad, the cancer was spreading. I succeeded.
I now live in a small village in Essex, the schools are top drawer. We have community. People say good morning. Simple stuff. I wish you every success. We originate from a mining family in Sheffield. The last rellies left there are at their wits end.

[Simpo Two]

DonkeyApple said:

If you have the means to use the private system or buy into the catchment of a top state school then do it. It's just 7 years of your adult life but a massive part of theirs.

Would areas that have the 11+ be an asset in this case?

[okgo]

Simpo Two said:

Would areas that have the 11+ be an asset in this case?

My wife went to Aylesbury grammar for while and said it was rough as assholes.

[Turtle Shed]

Others will disagree, fair enough, but I'd go down the private education route and move close to the school you choose.

Yes it's expensive, but there are worse things to spend (a lot of) money on, but I'd do so again in a heartbeat.

There is also a chance, but only a chance, that the private education will result in them getting better jobs and higher earnings than if they went through the state system.

Just my two cents, and there are of course some great state schools out there.

[Crumpet]

beambeam1 said:

Regardless of the schooling situation it sounds like you need to move for your own sanity anyway. Move and do it with enough time for yourselves and kids to settle into the area too before school.

I agree. We want to move. And we would have moved long ago. But….

What I omitted in my original post was the main catch - both sets of parents. They’re both mid 70s now and they’ve both been there for our children since they were born (now 9 and 10). They do the school run 2-3 times a week, my parents take them to sports clubs, we frequently have dinner with them, they run me to the station every now and again to get to work…….they’ve been absolutely key to us being in the position we are. They don’t ask for much in return, although I do do a lot for my parents. And we’d be abandoning them when they probably need us most.

My parents seem like they’re ten years younger and I fear that moving away would take away something that gives them purpose. Their friends have either died, moved away or have health issues and both my brothers have buggered off down south. They also live in the same village and are affected by, and are similarly frustrated by, the same issues.

okgo said:

What other issues do you think you could see?

More of the same maybe? Massive housing developments encroaching on wherever we buy, farmers - self proclaimed protectors of the countryside - abandoning whatever principles they claim to have had whenever they see £££ signs, further spread of the rot in society, other issues I hadn’t even considered?

[Crumpet]

DonkeyApple said:

You get just one chance to give your children the best start in life and the second most important part of that is schooling. If you have the means to use the private system or buy into the catchment of a top state school then do it. It's just 7 years of your adult life but a massive part of theirs. You probably only need to stay there for a few years after while they do uni and settle into careers and then you can go back to living where you want to for the rest of your lives.

I totally agree. Their education is our priority above all else. We feel like they’ve had the best start in life so far up to age ten; eldest is ridiculously bright but is lazy unless pushed, youngest is more average but still has potential. We have no issues with the state primary they’re at because the catchment area is other semi-rural villages and the parents are all decent people. A lot of parents have issues with the secondary schooling ahead; most don’t have the means to go private or escape but we know of a few who’ve moved solely for schooling - two to York!

The private school in our current area has slipped from being a top 100 to barely scraping into the top 500 now. I went there when it was a top 100 school but hated it. I have no love for it whatsoever. I resent paying £40k+ a year for it.

But, as I mentioned above in reply to a previous post, there’s the major factor of abandoning both sets of parents. There are a lot of trade-offs but I think they’d probably say their Grandchildren need the best education possible.

[beambeam1]

Crumpet said:

My parents seem like they re ten years younger and I fear that moving away would take away something that gives them purpose. Their friends have either died, moved away or have health issues and both my brothers have buggered off down south. They also live in the same village and are affected by, and are similarly frustrated by, the same issues.

You're probably not going to be able to appease both sets of parents and everyone else in this circumstance, sooner you get comfortable with that idea the better. I'd imagine if they thought you stayed behind for them they'd be mortified, they clearly want the best for your kids and are likely to understand your decision.

As for your parents, would they move too? During the pandemic my parents went out on walks around our hometown when restrictions were eased. Myself and my three brothers, all long-term partners or married with families, have more or less went to University and stayed in or around Edinburgh for the last 20 years. Our parents realised the town we grew up in had decayed and that most of the people they grew up with or knew seemed to be dying, have moved away or generally be MIA. So, they sold up and moved to the closest small town they could find and afford a like for like bungalow in. It was the best thing they ever did as growing grandchildren and a fresh social circle has given them a new lease of life. They have never looked back.

Our parents can be more resilient than we give them credit for.

[Crumpet]

Aluminati said:

I absolutely understand where you are coming from.

I was born in London (E2) my parents strived to get us out, and succeeded. Then came round 2, I needed to do the same for my lad, the cancer was spreading. I succeeded.
I now live in a small village in Essex, the schools are top drawer. We have community. People say good morning. Simple stuff. I wish you every success. We originate from a mining family in Sheffield. The last rellies left there are at their wits end.

Interesting that your relatives in Sheffield are at their wits end. For the same reasons I mention? In Sheffield you really do have to choose your area carefully, but they do at least have some good schools!

Without opening up a wider debate about some pretty divisive issues, I feel that if you’re in one of the nicer parts of the UK you’re totally oblivious to the massive decline that’s taking place elsewhere. What some people state as not being an issue is very, VERY clearly an issue when you’re living with it and can see it every day.

A handful of my work colleagues have now left the UK entirely, largely for tax reasons, but also because of the continual decline.

[Crumpet]

beambeam1 said:

As for your parents, would they move too?

Well! I actually broached this with them the other day. My other brother has apparently been trying to get them to move to Surrey to be near them!

They say if we move they will move. They’re in a very strong position financially.

I actually sent them a place in York; a massive Manor House with a cottage in the grounds and suggested we go halves! They said “well we’ll have to go and look at it”.

Her parents won’t go anywhere. A Barnsley miner doesn’t leave Barnsley! Realistically we need to be within an hours drive.

[Earthdweller]

Crumpet said:

Aluminati said:

I absolutely understand where you are coming from.

I was born in London (E2) my parents strived to get us out, and succeeded. Then came round 2, I needed to do the same for my lad, the cancer was spreading. I succeeded.
I now live in a small village in Essex, the schools are top drawer. We have community. People say good morning. Simple stuff. I wish you every success. We originate from a mining family in Sheffield. The last rellies left there are at their wits end.

Interesting that your relatives in Sheffield are at their wits end. For the same reasons I mention? In Sheffield you really do have to choose your area carefully, but they do at least have some good schools!

Without opening up a wider debate about some pretty divisive issues, I feel that if you re in one of the nicer parts of the UK you re totally oblivious to the massive decline that s taking place elsewhere. What some people state as not being an issue is very, VERY clearly an issue when you re living with it and can see it every day.

A handful of my work colleagues have now left the UK entirely, largely for tax reasons, but also because of the continual decline.

Ah yes

My home town in Blackburn .. it's lost, a former shadow of its former self

I'm out of it now, but still have family living in it and they are at their wits end about the place and quality of life

What really is noticeable is the approach to the town and the litter and shabbiness of it

I think it's quite telling about a place .. if you drive in to it and the verges are clear, clean and well maintained and it looks cared for ... it's likely to be a good place to live

[okgo]

You could move in with your parents or you could heavily sell in the smart move of downsizing into a city flat or similar.

I’d imagine you’d have to choose carefully to avoid the dross, but it probably means spending as much as you can. As DonkeyApple said, it doesn’t need to be permanent, in fact I’ve gone interest only mostly on the ‘house that suits my kids school’ because I’ll flog it when they bugger off and move somewhere else.

[oddman]

Might be worth checking if your kids are eligible for the state grammar schools in West Yorkshire.

Two in Halifax and one in Heckmondwike.

There are pockets of really nice and GVFM housing and villages in West Yorks but you're never far from an absolute sthole.

[Gazzab]

Over the last couple of decades I have lived in Surrey, the Peak District and now West Yorkshire (near Holmfirth). My kids ended up at school in Bakewell which was fine. The youngest ended up with a 1st from Manchester despite covid messing with his A levels. There are plenty of decent areas to live in and around West Yorkshire and of course there are plenty of decent schools too. You need to decide where you want to live and then investigate the schools.

[Crumpet]

okgo said:

You could move in with your parents or you could heavily sell in the smart move of downsizing into a city flat or similar.

I d imagine you d have to choose carefully to avoid the dross, but it probably means spending as much as you can. As DonkeyApple said, it doesn t need to be permanent, in fact I ve gone interest only mostly on the house that suits my kids school because I ll flog it when they bugger off and move somewhere else.

Well the budget would be healthy-ish, something like £1m if aiming for state schools. Or mortgage free at £700k and keep options open for going private in York. We’ve seen houses we like but they’re few and far between because, presumably, people snap them up due to the schools.

I’ve sort of got this past the wife by saying she can stop working in the job she hates. Ironically she needs to be near stholes for her line of work! That does affect the budget and plans somewhat.

It would likely be a ten year plan because we’ve always thought we’d retire to the N Yorks coast. We already have a place there and there are very few places I’d rather be.

From all the posts - and thanks to everyone who has posted - it does seem like there’s a general view of escaping to the better places if you can. I’ve long held the view that the UK is going to split into st towns and nice towns and nothing in between, the st ones in a death spiral and the better ones getting ever better. Not so much white flight, but middle-class flight.

[Crumpet]

oddman said:

Might be worth checking if your kids are eligible for the state grammar schools in West Yorkshire.

Two in Halifax and one in Heckmondwike.

There are pockets of really nice and GVFM housing and villages in West Yorks but you're never far from an absolute sthole.

We’ve missed the boat on the selection for those schools but we’re not presently in the catchment anyway.

In any case, they’re both in complete stholes, which is one reason for the potential move. We’re in one of those ‘pockets’ but the rot is just spreading too close now.