Digital Voice and fibre to the premises
Discussion
I'm currently with BT, fibre to cabinet. My old copper phone line master socket is in the inner hallway, under the stairs. Wire comes in under the eaves at the back of the bungalow. There is no access to the phone cable, as a dormer conversion was built over it 20 years ago.
We had a letter from BT last week, saying we had to switch to Digital Voice in April. Since we have no mobile signal here, I phoned them to get a backup battery for the BT router - no power=no phone.
While I was on the phone, they offered to upgrade my copper line to full fibre. 150mbps for the same price we are currently paying for 65. They plan to use the existing poles for the fibre.
The problem is, getting the fibre to a point that has power and ethernet (to the switch in the loft). I think the only option will be the integral garage, but that's not a good place for the cordless phone base station.
With BT Digital Voice, is it possible to have the DECT base station remote from the BT router?
We had a letter from BT last week, saying we had to switch to Digital Voice in April. Since we have no mobile signal here, I phoned them to get a backup battery for the BT router - no power=no phone.
While I was on the phone, they offered to upgrade my copper line to full fibre. 150mbps for the same price we are currently paying for 65. They plan to use the existing poles for the fibre.
The problem is, getting the fibre to a point that has power and ethernet (to the switch in the loft). I think the only option will be the integral garage, but that's not a good place for the cordless phone base station.
With BT Digital Voice, is it possible to have the DECT base station remote from the BT router?
https://stl.tech/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/img2-1...
The ont needs power to convert the fibre to ethernet & this can be remote from your router if you have a ethernet link to connect them together.
That said if the connection is via a poll and you already have a switch in the loft could you not put the ont & router there?
You might offer a drink to the openreach guy to get him to do it, I had mine installed up there.
The ont needs power to convert the fibre to ethernet & this can be remote from your router if you have a ethernet link to connect them together.
That said if the connection is via a poll and you already have a switch in the loft could you not put the ont & router there?
You might offer a drink to the openreach guy to get him to do it, I had mine installed up there.
We’ve just had fibre installed by OpenReach (we didn’t even ask for it, I just started getting texts & emails saying we were going to get it installed) and the engineer was willing to put the fibre all the way through to the centre of our house (bungalow) and put both the grey junction box and the ONT inside a cupboard. But only because I had gone into the (mostly I boarded) loft and put a conduit (with pull cord) in place and had a solid conduit already in place we could use to get the cable down from the loft. Ended up spending a good few hours helping him with pushing the cabling though etc, but it got us what we wanted.
I think the less you expect them to sort out/ the more you can prepare and help them, the more likely they are to do what you want. My chap said they were only allowed into lofts if they were fully boarded.
Edit to add, our chap had an excellent 4mm push rod setup (on a reel) which was used to push the draw cord through 11m of conduit. So you can get things to places you can’t see/access as long as there is a clear route…
I think the less you expect them to sort out/ the more you can prepare and help them, the more likely they are to do what you want. My chap said they were only allowed into lofts if they were fully boarded.
Edit to add, our chap had an excellent 4mm push rod setup (on a reel) which was used to push the draw cord through 11m of conduit. So you can get things to places you can’t see/access as long as there is a clear route…
Running the fibre to under the stairs would be a mammoth task, lifting the floor in the dormer conversion.
I've already got ethernet cabling in the garage and under the stairs, but not a direct cable between the two. I'm guessing an ethernet coupler would be a bad idea here, but would a dumb 4 port switch be OK for joining them?
I see that BT do a "digital voice adaptor" that's paired with the router, and is plugged in near to the DECT base station. Presumably this is a wifi device, as it's paired by pressing the router's WPS button.
https://www.bt.com/help/user-guides/phones/digital...
I guess this adaptor would do the job?
If that adaptor will work, the router and optical terminator can go in the garage, then ethernet up to my switch. My master Mesh node and HA mini PC can go next to the router. Phone base station can stay where it is, and all will be fine until we have a power cut. I'd need two battery backup supplies...
I've already got ethernet cabling in the garage and under the stairs, but not a direct cable between the two. I'm guessing an ethernet coupler would be a bad idea here, but would a dumb 4 port switch be OK for joining them?
I see that BT do a "digital voice adaptor" that's paired with the router, and is plugged in near to the DECT base station. Presumably this is a wifi device, as it's paired by pressing the router's WPS button.
https://www.bt.com/help/user-guides/phones/digital...
I guess this adaptor would do the job?
If that adaptor will work, the router and optical terminator can go in the garage, then ethernet up to my switch. My master Mesh node and HA mini PC can go next to the router. Phone base station can stay where it is, and all will be fine until we have a power cut. I'd need two battery backup supplies...
Mr Pointy said:
Can you site the Termination Point in the garage & then get a network cable to where you want the router to be?
You say they offered you the same price as your existing service - did that include Digital Voice & keeping yor existing line number?
The only way would be to join 2 existing cables. Getting a new cable to under the stairs would be a massive job.You say they offered you the same price as your existing service - did that include Digital Voice & keeping yor existing line number?
They said the price and service would be the same, just an upgrade to fttp and double the speed.
I'll have a look behind where the phone is, make sure that there are 2 ethernet cables going up into the loft. Obviously I'll need 2 - one to connect to the optical modem, and one back up to the network switch.
I suppose the l9ng-term answer is just to use voip phones, but finding a 3 or 4 pack of cordless phones that work with voip is tricky. BT have discontinued their ones, EE say they only work with BT/EE phone service - no good if I switch supplier in the future. Google search brings up loads of stuff that is just normal DECT, and office-type corded phones.
I've currently got 4 Panasonic handsets linked to a common base station. All working perfectly.
I suppose the l9ng-term answer is just to use voip phones, but finding a 3 or 4 pack of cordless phones that work with voip is tricky. BT have discontinued their ones, EE say they only work with BT/EE phone service - no good if I switch supplier in the future. Google search brings up loads of stuff that is just normal DECT, and office-type corded phones.
I've currently got 4 Panasonic handsets linked to a common base station. All working perfectly.
It does seem as if we are going massively backwards in terms of interoperability, especially with regards to DV which should be much more generic & not a closed sytem. Zen do Fritz! Fons which work with the Fritz!Box router they provide (I don't know if it would work with Panasonic phones) & Andrews & Arnold have a VOIP solution with their Yealink VOIP phones which is at least more generic VOIP & not DV:
https://www.zen.co.uk/phone/fritzfon-c6
https://www.aa.net.uk/voice-and-mobile/voip-inform...
https://www.zen.co.uk/phone/fritzfon-c6
https://www.aa.net.uk/voice-and-mobile/voip-inform...
I run a business from home, and the majority of my customers call me on the landline. Having the same number is vital - the only reason I've stuck with BT. No other supplier will guarantee keeping the same number.
I have multiple phones around the house because I hate carrying it with me as I move between the workshop, office, and kitchen/diner. Greasy hands full of clocks/clock parts
Mobile phone stays in the kitchen, so that I know where it is. It doesn't ring much, and if it does, I can answer the call on my watch.
I'm happy with service and equipment that I've currently got, but we are being forced into Digital Voice, and the fibre upgrade is free.
Can you really just receive and make "landline" calls on a mobile?
Looking at the products out there, it seems that the handset market isn't really ready for consumer voip as implemented by BT. Maybe it never will be, and the landline phone will just die out.
I have multiple phones around the house because I hate carrying it with me as I move between the workshop, office, and kitchen/diner. Greasy hands full of clocks/clock parts
Mobile phone stays in the kitchen, so that I know where it is. It doesn't ring much, and if it does, I can answer the call on my watch.
I'm happy with service and equipment that I've currently got, but we are being forced into Digital Voice, and the fibre upgrade is free.
Can you really just receive and make "landline" calls on a mobile?
Looking at the products out there, it seems that the handset market isn't really ready for consumer voip as implemented by BT. Maybe it never will be, and the landline phone will just die out.
Lots of options.
You can move your dect base station out to the garage well before bt migrate you & test it works as expected by running a internal call to test it has sufficient radio penetration to reach your farthest zones.
Dect normally have a great range & I suspect this will work well but obviously better to test first rather than assume.
The home hub2 has a green phone socket allowing the phone to connect to the hub2 and use your existing device.
You could add a additional ethernet line e tween the garage & wherever the dect base station is and use a phone cable to rj45 to connect them up, this must be direct not via a switch.
You could place the ont in the garage and move the router to the loft, again ont to router must be direct not via a switch. And the dect controller will need to be in the loft or connected via a direct extension elsewhere.
Or you place the ont & router in the loft.
You can move your line to voip via another supplier who will be able to take over your line, however this could be more complicated. But it would allow you to keep the current hardware as there are devices that run voip to dect masters much like the hub2
Really need to understand the challenges as it’s a touch unclear at the moment.
Btw the bt extension box suggested might work but you will potentially have issues with this and your mesh system but again need to understand more.
You can move your dect base station out to the garage well before bt migrate you & test it works as expected by running a internal call to test it has sufficient radio penetration to reach your farthest zones.
Dect normally have a great range & I suspect this will work well but obviously better to test first rather than assume.
The home hub2 has a green phone socket allowing the phone to connect to the hub2 and use your existing device.
You could add a additional ethernet line e tween the garage & wherever the dect base station is and use a phone cable to rj45 to connect them up, this must be direct not via a switch.
You could place the ont in the garage and move the router to the loft, again ont to router must be direct not via a switch. And the dect controller will need to be in the loft or connected via a direct extension elsewhere.
Or you place the ont & router in the loft.
You can move your line to voip via another supplier who will be able to take over your line, however this could be more complicated. But it would allow you to keep the current hardware as there are devices that run voip to dect masters much like the hub2
Really need to understand the challenges as it’s a touch unclear at the moment.
Btw the bt extension box suggested might work but you will potentially have issues with this and your mesh system but again need to understand more.
Edited by Captain_Morgan on Tuesday 11th March 08:18
Edited by Captain_Morgan on Tuesday 11th March 08:31
Upgraded my mum about 6 months ago to digital voice with BT as the new tariff basically halved her cost. Line comes in upstairs but Dect base is in kitchen (she has an old big button BT dect system, they don’t do a big button digital phone yet), BT supplied a wireless digital to analogue adapter (small box with plug on back and rj11 socket). Plugged her fall alarm and phone into it and they have worked faultlessly even through numerous power cuts.
Have also impressed with the new wi-fi mesh, cover the whole house with the router and one extender disk where it used to take four of the old disks.
Looked at the BT battery back up decided would just get a standard UPS if needed in the future as did not seem that good value.
Have also impressed with the new wi-fi mesh, cover the whole house with the router and one extender disk where it used to take four of the old disks.
Looked at the BT battery back up decided would just get a standard UPS if needed in the future as did not seem that good value.
Captain_Morgan said:
Lots of options.
You can move your dect base station out to the garage well before bt migrate you & test it works as expected by running a internal call to test it has sufficient radio penetration to reach your farthest zones.
You could add a additional ethernet line to where ever the dect base station is and use a phone cable to rj45 to connect them up, this must be direct not via a switch.
Place the ont in the garage and connect to the loft, again ont to router must be direct not via a switch. And the dect controller will need to be in the loft or connected via a direct extension elsewhere.
Or you place the ont & router in the loft.
You can move your line to voip via another supplier who will be able to take over your line, however this could be more complicated.
Really need to understand the challenges as it’s a touch unclear at the moment.
Btw the bt extension box suggested might work but you will potentially have issues with this and your mesh system but again need to understand more.
So, I could have the fibre terminate in the garage, use an existing cat5 cable up to where the switch is to plug into the router.You can move your dect base station out to the garage well before bt migrate you & test it works as expected by running a internal call to test it has sufficient radio penetration to reach your farthest zones.
You could add a additional ethernet line to where ever the dect base station is and use a phone cable to rj45 to connect them up, this must be direct not via a switch.
Place the ont in the garage and connect to the loft, again ont to router must be direct not via a switch. And the dect controller will need to be in the loft or connected via a direct extension elsewhere.
Or you place the ont & router in the loft.
You can move your line to voip via another supplier who will be able to take over your line, however this could be more complicated.
Really need to understand the challenges as it’s a touch unclear at the moment.
Btw the bt extension box suggested might work but you will potentially have issues with this and your mesh system but again need to understand more.
Router would then connect to the switch.
Use another existing cat5 cable, from the "phone" socket on the router down to under the stairs, then convert it to a phone plug for the base station?
If I can do that, using existing cabling, that would be ideal.
The current copper cable comes from a pole in the neighbour's back garden on the left side, across my garden, and into the right side back corner of my bungalow. Through the loft space, under the dormer floor, down into the pantry cupboard, through a block wall, into the space under the stairs to the master socket.
Because of several lots of building work over the years (dormer conversion and staircase, kitchen refurb), the cable is mostly inaccessible.
Best route into the house seems to be the integral garage, on the left side of the house.
All the cat5 cabling runs into the loft space above the garage, but on the righthand side . Loft floor in this area is all boarded.
This part of the loft is currently empty, as we had an ASHP fitted in December, and they needed access to run the feed to the new consumer unit in the garage.
I'll see if the Openreach engineer can run the fibre into the garage loft, and across to where the cat5 cables and switch are located. Then I could have everything in the same place, and just use an existing cat5 cable for the DECT base station.
I'm not keen on putting the DECT base station in the garage, as it would "waste" one phone, and I wouldn't be able to see the flashing red light when someone has left a message.
clockworks said:
So, I could have the fibre terminate in the garage, use an existing cat5 cable up to where the switch is to plug into the router.
Router would then connect to the switch.
Use another existing cat5 cable, from the "phone" socket on the router down to under the stairs, then convert it to a phone plug for the base station?
If I can do that, using existing cabling, that would be ideal.
The current copper cable comes from a pole in the neighbour's back garden on the left side, across my garden, and into the right side back corner of my bungalow. Through the loft space, under the dormer floor, down into the pantry cupboard, through a block wall, into the space under the stairs to the master socket.
Because of several lots of building work over the years (dormer conversion and staircase, kitchen refurb), the cable is mostly inaccessible.
Best route into the house seems to be the integral garage, on the left side of the house.
All the cat5 cabling runs into the loft space above the garage, but on the righthand side . Loft floor in this area is all boarded.
This part of the loft is currently empty, as we had an ASHP fitted in December, and they needed access to run the feed to the new consumer unit in the garage.
I'll see if the Openreach engineer can run the fibre into the garage loft, and across to where the cat5 cables and switch are located. Then I could have everything in the same place, and just use an existing cat5 cable for the DECT base station.
I'm not keen on putting the DECT base station in the garage, as it would "waste" one phone, and I wouldn't be able to see the flashing red light when someone has left a message.
If the line terminates in the garage then.Router would then connect to the switch.
Use another existing cat5 cable, from the "phone" socket on the router down to under the stairs, then convert it to a phone plug for the base station?
If I can do that, using existing cabling, that would be ideal.
The current copper cable comes from a pole in the neighbour's back garden on the left side, across my garden, and into the right side back corner of my bungalow. Through the loft space, under the dormer floor, down into the pantry cupboard, through a block wall, into the space under the stairs to the master socket.
Because of several lots of building work over the years (dormer conversion and staircase, kitchen refurb), the cable is mostly inaccessible.
Best route into the house seems to be the integral garage, on the left side of the house.
All the cat5 cabling runs into the loft space above the garage, but on the righthand side . Loft floor in this area is all boarded.
This part of the loft is currently empty, as we had an ASHP fitted in December, and they needed access to run the feed to the new consumer unit in the garage.
I'll see if the Openreach engineer can run the fibre into the garage loft, and across to where the cat5 cables and switch are located. Then I could have everything in the same place, and just use an existing cat5 cable for the DECT base station.
I'm not keen on putting the DECT base station in the garage, as it would "waste" one phone, and I wouldn't be able to see the flashing red light when someone has left a message.
The ont connects to the hub2 via a ethernet line to the loft, the hub2 then connects to the switch, the switch then connects to existing wired devices and your mesh access points.
The bt socket on the hub2 uses a direct (unswitched) connection back to the dect station.
clockworks said:
I run a business from home, and the majority of my customers call me on the landline. Having the same number is vital - the only reason I've stuck with BT. No other supplier will guarantee keeping the same number.
You can port your existing number to any VOIP provider. Then, your phone calls can be received anywhere you've got an internet connection. We've had gigaset handsets and a gigaset N300 VOIP/DECT base station (which supports both analog phone and VOIP) for years now. Initially we had the 'home number' on a copper line and business on VOIP - (running over a 50mb/s line-of-sight wireless internet connection). Now the home line is also VOIP.
The advantages of true VOIP are huge. One handset can make outgoing calls on either line. You can make multiple outgoing calls on the same line from different handsets. Mobile apps allow you to receive/make "landline number" calls when you're out and about. You can keep your number even if you move to a different geographical area.
And, best of all, you're no longer tied to BT. We use nimvelo for the business line, and voipfone for home. Both now running over a Gigaclear connection.
TownIdiot said:
At the risk of repeating myself - why don't you use your mobile?
Or buy some voip phones.
There's no mobile signal in the house, so it's landline or WiFi calling on the mobile. Most customers call my landline number. I don't want to carry my mobile from room to room as I'm moving around, working.Or buy some voip phones.
If you mean answer landline calls on my mobile, I haven't figured out how to do that.
I've tried googling for a 3 or 4 pack of voip cordless phones, and I can't see many options apart from the EE offering, which says it only works with EE or BT - no good if I switch suppliers in the future?
I'm loath to use anything other than Panasonic. I've used BT and Samsung in the past, and they were rubbish. The Panasonic phones are over 10 years old, and still work perfectly.
If you Google "switch BT phone number to voip" then quite a few options will appear.
I am sure some other posters can recommend.
The landline calling will work over WiFi, as well as when you are out and about with mobile signal.
And fair enough if you don't want to carry your mobile around - it's just a cheap and easy solution. You can buy voip handsets so worth looking at them and comparing to the cost of any cabling that's required.
I am sure some other posters can recommend.
The landline calling will work over WiFi, as well as when you are out and about with mobile signal.
And fair enough if you don't want to carry your mobile around - it's just a cheap and easy solution. You can buy voip handsets so worth looking at them and comparing to the cost of any cabling that's required.
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