Driver shortage... again
Discussion
This old trope again, higher wages, not enough young people taking it up etc etc
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14437569/...
Isn'y just an excuse to get Euros in to do the job or will wages and working conditions actually change?
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14437569/...
Isn'y just an excuse to get Euros in to do the job or will wages and working conditions actually change?
Those companies paying proper rates for people they treat with respect working reasonable hours and shift patterns oddly enough don't have any trouble recruiting drivers.
It has ever been thus.
There never has been a shortage of lorry drivers, the industry is addicted to dumbing and deskilling itself down to get ever cheaper disinterested uncaring disloyal staff, those responsible for this in boardrooms can't accept they are the authors of their own headaches.
Treat good staff with respect, encourage drivers to continuously skill themselves up with rewards and advancement into better shifts/pay for constantly improving safety/performance/loyalty/reliability, it works, you retain the higher quality staff who know a good thing when they see it, win win for everyone.
One problem now showing itself though is tax thresholds, the salaries at the better jobs have crossed the higher tax rate threshold, little point in doing an extra shift only to see half the pay disappear in tax and NI.
It has ever been thus.
There never has been a shortage of lorry drivers, the industry is addicted to dumbing and deskilling itself down to get ever cheaper disinterested uncaring disloyal staff, those responsible for this in boardrooms can't accept they are the authors of their own headaches.
Treat good staff with respect, encourage drivers to continuously skill themselves up with rewards and advancement into better shifts/pay for constantly improving safety/performance/loyalty/reliability, it works, you retain the higher quality staff who know a good thing when they see it, win win for everyone.
One problem now showing itself though is tax thresholds, the salaries at the better jobs have crossed the higher tax rate threshold, little point in doing an extra shift only to see half the pay disappear in tax and NI.
Smint said:
Those companies paying proper rates for people they treat with respect working reasonable hours and shift patterns oddly enough don't have any trouble recruiting drivers.
I would tend to agreeThere are far too many hauliers offering subterranean rates to try and compete and subsequently cutting corners to try and stay afloat as a result - a big corner being driver welfare.
I feel for those hauliers who struggle, but it really should be a case of if you're not able to stand the heat, you should get out of the fire.
If there's no shortage of drivers and there are unfilled job vacancies, than what are all the drivers doing instead of driving jobs? They aren't sitting around with their thumbs up their bums waiting for the phone to ring.
I expect the reality is that there is a shortage of drivers, and if we want to fill that gap, employers will need to make the jobs more attractive to encourage people to either return to driving jobs or to retrain as drivers (which will create shortages of workers in other industries) or we need to import more drivers. The latter is the quick fix. Longer term, the solution is probably for the employers to figure out ways of delivering more goods with fewer drivers because we have labour shortages across the entire economy and we need to start getting more work done with the people we've got available. That's the "productivity growth" we keep banging on about.
I expect the reality is that there is a shortage of drivers, and if we want to fill that gap, employers will need to make the jobs more attractive to encourage people to either return to driving jobs or to retrain as drivers (which will create shortages of workers in other industries) or we need to import more drivers. The latter is the quick fix. Longer term, the solution is probably for the employers to figure out ways of delivering more goods with fewer drivers because we have labour shortages across the entire economy and we need to start getting more work done with the people we've got available. That's the "productivity growth" we keep banging on about.
I retired from an IT job and retrained to get my class 1 HGV license. Cost me quite a bit with having to self fund the practical training and 5 days Certificate of Professional Competence (CPC). I then couldn’t get an HGV driving test as there weren’t any examiners 
I decided to fully retire instead. Best decision I ever made.
I decided to fully retire instead. Best decision I ever made.
ATG said:
If there's no shortage of drivers and there are unfilled job vacancies, than what are all the drivers doing instead of driving jobs? They aren't sitting around with their thumbs up their bums waiting for the phone to ring.
They are doing forklift or warehouse work because a) it's not paid that much less, all things considered
and
b) it means they are doing shift work where they know when they will be home, rather than getting stuck God-knows-where overnight because they've run out of driving time due to any number of out-of-their-control cock-ups or incompetence.
Why bother living the (s
tty) life of a truck driver for a pound or two an hour more than warehouse work? It's simply not worth it for what is a skilled job with very unpredictable and unsocial hours.ATG said:
If there's no shortage of drivers and there are unfilled job vacancies, than what are all the drivers doing instead of driving jobs? They aren't sitting around with their thumbs up their bums waiting for the phone to ring.
I expect the reality is that there is a shortage of drivers, and if we want to fill that gap, employers will need to make the jobs more attractive to encourage people to either return to driving jobs or to retrain as drivers (which will create shortages of workers in other industries) or we need to import more drivers. The latter is the quick fix. Longer term, the solution is probably for the employers to figure out ways of delivering more goods with fewer drivers because we have labour shortages across the entire economy and we need to start getting more work done with the people we've got available. That's the "productivity growth" we keep banging on about.
I have a class 1 licence and I would like a couple of days a week doing something at the moment. I occasionally look at indeed and the HGV jobs are a couple of pounds above minimum wage with rubbish shifts and nights out. I'm just not interested in that.I expect the reality is that there is a shortage of drivers, and if we want to fill that gap, employers will need to make the jobs more attractive to encourage people to either return to driving jobs or to retrain as drivers (which will create shortages of workers in other industries) or we need to import more drivers. The latter is the quick fix. Longer term, the solution is probably for the employers to figure out ways of delivering more goods with fewer drivers because we have labour shortages across the entire economy and we need to start getting more work done with the people we've got available. That's the "productivity growth" we keep banging on about.
Actually started a volunteer job recently as I'd rather do something interesting and community spirited for free than something miserable for crap money.
ATG said:
If there's no shortage of drivers and there are unfilled job vacancies, than what are all the drivers doing instead of driving jobs? They aren't sitting around with their thumbs up their bums waiting for the phone to ring.
I expect the reality is that there is a shortage of drivers, and if we want to fill that gap, employers will need to make the jobs more attractive to encourage people to either return to driving jobs or to retrain as drivers (which will create shortages of workers in other industries) or we need to import more drivers. The latter is the quick fix. Longer term, the solution is probably for the employers to figure out ways of delivering more goods with fewer drivers because we have labour shortages across the entire economy and we need to start getting more work done with the people we've got available. That's the "productivity growth" we keep banging on about.
There’re on the agencies picking and choosing the good jobs to take and leaving the crap. General haulage is the pits these days, most graft, most hours and worst pay. I expect the reality is that there is a shortage of drivers, and if we want to fill that gap, employers will need to make the jobs more attractive to encourage people to either return to driving jobs or to retrain as drivers (which will create shortages of workers in other industries) or we need to import more drivers. The latter is the quick fix. Longer term, the solution is probably for the employers to figure out ways of delivering more goods with fewer drivers because we have labour shortages across the entire economy and we need to start getting more work done with the people we've got available. That's the "productivity growth" we keep banging on about.
Get on with an agency who recruit for the main parcel companies or even some supermarket work as they pay the best these days without doing extra test like ADR etc. We have regular lads at ours who hammer it on the run up to Xmas and other busy times like Easter then just chill on 1/2/3 days a week the rest of the year.
One agency for us was offering paid hotels, paid meals, £25 and hour and £1000 bonus in November/December just gone.
Richard-D said:
ATG said:
If there's no shortage of drivers and there are unfilled job vacancies, than what are all the drivers doing instead of driving jobs? They aren't sitting around with their thumbs up their bums waiting for the phone to ring.
I expect the reality is that there is a shortage of drivers, and if we want to fill that gap, employers will need to make the jobs more attractive to encourage people to either return to driving jobs or to retrain as drivers (which will create shortages of workers in other industries) or we need to import more drivers. The latter is the quick fix. Longer term, the solution is probably for the employers to figure out ways of delivering more goods with fewer drivers because we have labour shortages across the entire economy and we need to start getting more work done with the people we've got available. That's the "productivity growth" we keep banging on about.
I have a class 1 licence and I would like a couple of days a week doing something at the moment. I occasionally look at indeed and the HGV jobs are a couple of pounds above minimum wage with rubbish shifts and nights out. I'm just not interested in that.I expect the reality is that there is a shortage of drivers, and if we want to fill that gap, employers will need to make the jobs more attractive to encourage people to either return to driving jobs or to retrain as drivers (which will create shortages of workers in other industries) or we need to import more drivers. The latter is the quick fix. Longer term, the solution is probably for the employers to figure out ways of delivering more goods with fewer drivers because we have labour shortages across the entire economy and we need to start getting more work done with the people we've got available. That's the "productivity growth" we keep banging on about.
Actually started a volunteer job recently as I'd rather do something interesting and community spirited for free than something miserable for crap money.
East of England (assuming not Kent) means you'll be competing with all the Romanians and Latvians who will happily work for the minimum wage that the agency pays them. And, assuming you are a native Brit, you'll be the only person in the transport office, yard and warehouse that speaks English.
Tisy said:
East of England (assuming not Kent) means you'll be competing with all the Romanians and Latvians who will happily work for the minimum wage that the agency pays them. And, assuming you are a native Brit, you'll be the only person in the transport office, yard and warehouse that speaks English.
Yep, that's the reason it doesn't pay enough to be worth the grief. It does make a nonsense of the claim that there aren't enough drivers though.When I was driving class 1, early 2000 up until 2013, any agency driver was viewed with suspicion (espcecially by the shunters, who are a breed all of their own) because they tended not to give a st about the equipment, were new drivers and were often on "better" money, but without all the extras that FT get.
Driving is an unskilled job and the pay reflects that - unskilled as in anyone can complete a general haulage delivery and it's only the ADR, specialist jobs that involve some brain power that attract good money, but lets face it what HGV job is really specialist - crane, forklift, cement...?
t about the equipment, were new drivers and were often on "better" money, but without all the extras that FT get.Driving is an unskilled job and the pay reflects that - unskilled as in anyone can complete a general haulage delivery and it's only the ADR, specialist jobs that involve some brain power that attract good money, but lets face it what HGV job is really specialist - crane, forklift, cement...?
Edited by nismocat on Friday 28th February 03:56
nismocat said:
When I was driving class 1, early 2000 up until 2013, any agency driver was viewed with suspicion (espcecially by the shunters, who are a breed all of their own) because they tended not to give a st about the equipment, were new drivers and were often on "better" money, but without all the extras that FT get.
Driving is an unskilled job and the pay reflects that - unskilled as in anyone can complete a general haulage delivery and it's only the ADR, specialist jobs that involve some brain power that attract good money, but lets face it what HGV job is really specialist - crane, forklift, cement...?
Depends what your definition of general haulage is. Driving a 45ft fridge from Wakefield RDC to Crick RDC and reload empties - yes, any numpty can open and close the back doors, set the CC at 56 and eventually get themselves backed on the door at a jaunty angle, but well enough for the dock leveller to bridge the gap. But general haulage loading odd-shaped machinery parts on a flat in the pissing rain and wind, and then having to rope and sheet it ? Yeah, good luck to your unskilled driver there! Even if he or she somehow manages to get the sheets over it all in the correct order so that the wind doesn't rip them all off once they get above 20 mph, the chances of it all sliding off the side at the first roundabout or coming through the cab when they press the brake pedal a bit too keenly are very high. t about the equipment, were new drivers and were often on "better" money, but without all the extras that FT get.Driving is an unskilled job and the pay reflects that - unskilled as in anyone can complete a general haulage delivery and it's only the ADR, specialist jobs that involve some brain power that attract good money, but lets face it what HGV job is really specialist - crane, forklift, cement...?
Edited by nismocat on Friday 28th February 03:56
nismocat said:
When I was driving class 1, early 2000 up until 2013, any agency driver was viewed with suspicion (espcecially by the shunters, who are a breed all of their own) because they tended not to give a st about the equipment, were new drivers and were often on "better" money, but without all the extras that FT get.
Driving is an unskilled job and the pay reflects that - unskilled as in anyone can complete a general haulage delivery and it's only the ADR, specialist jobs that involve some brain power that attract good money, but lets face it what HGV job is really specialist - crane, forklift, cement...?
Yes any fool can take a modern truck on open roads, yet despite the auto gearboxes and all the 3 letter acronym electronic safety stuff now fitted to stop fools doing what they do enough of them are still ramming other vehicles up the arse and turning the whole bloody lot over on straight roads, not to mention the untold unreported damage when close quarter maneuvering is involved...t about the equipment, were new drivers and were often on "better" money, but without all the extras that FT get.Driving is an unskilled job and the pay reflects that - unskilled as in anyone can complete a general haulage delivery and it's only the ADR, specialist jobs that involve some brain power that attract good money, but lets face it what HGV job is really specialist - crane, forklift, cement...?
Edited by nismocat on Friday 28th February 03:56
Driving trucks properly for years on end is not an unskilled job, but as i said above unskilled unthinking disinterested one size fits all cheap as chips bums on seats is sadly what many parts of the industry wanted, and that short sighted attitude continues to bite the industry in the arse, hence why every few years we hear of the wailing in the tabloids from the usual sources hoping to get the regime in No 10 at any one time to throw more taxpayer funded (yours and mine) money at people who never wanted to be truck drivers in the first place or to allow drivers to be shipped in from any third world crap hole you could think of...5 minutes perusing Youtube road carnage involving trucks in some of those crap holes ought to fill anyone normal with dread.
The better drivers (assuming they are fortunate enough, or not) to live in the right areas usually gravitate to the better jobs, but even the better jobs suffer their own hiccups because the management in the industry have a habit of learning in the usual suspect logistics mobs...which themselves have done so much to ruin our industry...so new managers steeped in logistics thinking appear at even the best of whats left out there and bring their one size fits all thinking with them, it takes a while once in a part of the industry that still requires and appreciates skill care customer focus etc before they see the light.
When these management types land in a good sometimes specialist outfit they are shocked by the terms and conditions drivers enjoy, in some cases they attempt to change things by bringing in new shift patterns for new recruits paying less for more hours or more shifts, after a while reality bites.
The other problem with our industry is the drivers themselves.
If they are lucky enough to land on what was described correctly above one of the last surviving dead mans shoes jobs (often but not always own account), unless they look after that job and resist taking the piss out of the usually generous sick pay etc...well you get my drift.
Lots of spot of posts above. As mentioned, the east is dead for driving jobs really, depending where about maybe some container work not usually greatly paid though.
The ‘central belt’ is where all the main big companies/top payers are, Preston, Warrington, Birmingham, Coventry, Milton Keynes etc.
As above it’s not a ‘skilled’ job but even then there are some atrocious drivers out there, damaging trucks/trailers so there off the road, damaging loads etc drivers that no company actually wants. Decent drivers, and decent not just a driving but also showing up on time, being reliable, not taking the piss with sick leave etc are getting more rare.
The ‘central belt’ is where all the main big companies/top payers are, Preston, Warrington, Birmingham, Coventry, Milton Keynes etc.
As above it’s not a ‘skilled’ job but even then there are some atrocious drivers out there, damaging trucks/trailers so there off the road, damaging loads etc drivers that no company actually wants. Decent drivers, and decent not just a driving but also showing up on time, being reliable, not taking the piss with sick leave etc are getting more rare.
Gassing Station | Commercial Break | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff