Downgrading an EPC
Discussion
Is it possible to downgrade an EPC?
We bought an Ex-USAF house at the end of last year, i was surprised to see the EPC was a C, i looked it up and it states it has double glazing (which it does) loft insulation and cavity wall insulation.
The loft insulation is fine its around 200mm. We've found out that it does not have cavity wall insulation, the cavities were never filled on the houses and the double glazing is close to 40 years old, it is very inefficient and is obviously well beyond its life span.
We factored in the cost of replacing the doors and windows but with the current EPC rating we're not eligible for any government grants towards the cost of insulating so wondered if we could downgrade now we have better information
We bought an Ex-USAF house at the end of last year, i was surprised to see the EPC was a C, i looked it up and it states it has double glazing (which it does) loft insulation and cavity wall insulation.
The loft insulation is fine its around 200mm. We've found out that it does not have cavity wall insulation, the cavities were never filled on the houses and the double glazing is close to 40 years old, it is very inefficient and is obviously well beyond its life span.
We factored in the cost of replacing the doors and windows but with the current EPC rating we're not eligible for any government grants towards the cost of insulating so wondered if we could downgrade now we have better information
DavePanda said:
Is it possible to downgrade an EPC?
We bought an Ex-USAF house at the end of last year, i was surprised to see the EPC was a C, i looked it up and it states it has double glazing (which it does) loft insulation and cavity wall insulation.
The loft insulation is fine its around 200mm. We've found out that it does not have cavity wall insulation, the cavities were never filled on the houses and the double glazing is close to 40 years old, it is very inefficient and is obviously well beyond its life span.
We factored in the cost of replacing the doors and windows but with the current EPC rating we're not eligible for any government grants towards the cost of insulating so wondered if we could downgrade now we have better information
If the surveyor who got the EPC wrong won't correct it - could you just get another EPC done? I think they cost about £70.We bought an Ex-USAF house at the end of last year, i was surprised to see the EPC was a C, i looked it up and it states it has double glazing (which it does) loft insulation and cavity wall insulation.
The loft insulation is fine its around 200mm. We've found out that it does not have cavity wall insulation, the cavities were never filled on the houses and the double glazing is close to 40 years old, it is very inefficient and is obviously well beyond its life span.
We factored in the cost of replacing the doors and windows but with the current EPC rating we're not eligible for any government grants towards the cost of insulating so wondered if we could downgrade now we have better information
PhilboSE said:
I think you have to be lower than a D (which is realistically as low as you would go, based on what you’ve said) AND be on limited income to qualify for the grants.
Worth checking before doing anything about the EPC, as it’s a fast moving landscape.
Yes, D or below makes you eligible, don't need to be on limited income but certain benefits can qualify for further funding, thankfully Child benefit counts for that.Worth checking before doing anything about the EPC, as it’s a fast moving landscape.
popeyewhite said:
GasEngineer said:
If the surveyor who got the EPC wrong won't correct it - could you just get another EPC done? I think they cost about £70.
Recent EPC cost me £100. Now I'm wondering if I paid too much!Silvanus said:
A big issue with EPC's is that in most cases it isn't a properly trained surveyor (Building Surveyor) that carries them out, its a box ticking exercise with no real in-depth analysis of how a building is constructed or how they perform. They would be a lot more expensive but more useful if done properly.
^^^^absolutely agree, totally a present crude way of producing an energy performance certificate. The person producing an EPC, simply accepts the answers to questions offered by property owner, with no visible property checks. With properties EPC's listed online, quite easy for the surveyor to just mirror ratings of a property to that of other nearby similar propertiesWings said:
^^^^absolutely agree, totally a present crude way of producing an energy performance certificate. The person producing an EPC, simply accepts the answers to questions offered by property owner, with no visible property checks. With properties EPC's listed online, quite easy for the surveyor to just mirror ratings of a property to that of other nearby similar properties
Sorry, that’s BS. The EPC assessor should not be taking the property owners word for things, they have to have evidence and for most elements, photographic evidence as well as floor plans showing how the sizes have been worked out as well as the heat loss etc.The EPC assessor should be subject to audits through whoever they are accredited with and using to lodge the certificates. If they haven’t got evidence then they will have to resubmit the EPC.
PurpleFox said:
Sorry, that’s BS. The EPC assessor should not be taking the property owners word for things, they have to have evidence and for most elements, photographic evidence as well as floor plans showing how the sizes have been worked out as well as the heat loss etc.
The EPC assessor should be subject to audits through whoever they are accredited with and using to lodge the certificates. If they haven’t got evidence then they will have to resubmit the EPC.
This is my experience too. I had a loft conversion done before EPCs were a thing and didn’t have architects plans or photographic evidence of the 150mm PIR we put in the ceiling. Consequently the EPC assessor gave us no credit for it despite me dropping ceiling downlights and showing him exposed PIR where it was apparent.The EPC assessor should be subject to audits through whoever they are accredited with and using to lodge the certificates. If they haven’t got evidence then they will have to resubmit the EPC.
Consequently the #1 recommendation on the EPC to improve it was to install loft insulation…I told the buyers under no circumstances whatsoever to even think about it.
FlossyThePig said:
popeyewhite said:
GasEngineer said:
If the surveyor who got the EPC wrong won't correct it - could you just get another EPC done? I think they cost about £70.
Recent EPC cost me £100. Now I'm wondering if I paid too much!I insisted that he bill me £60 for each one as they took quite a lot of work. Sometimes you can pay too little for something.
I used OVO
They had an offer to do a Home Assessment for £15.
Looks like it is £25 now... and you have to be a customer of theirs.
Maybe see if your energy supplier has a similar offer?
They had an offer to do a Home Assessment for £15.
Looks like it is £25 now... and you have to be a customer of theirs.
Maybe see if your energy supplier has a similar offer?
Presumably the Government will announce how the Home Energy Model, which will replace the standard assessment procedure for EPCs, will work shortly. I believe that the consultation period is now over.
From what I have read HEM will favour electric heating so this might in itself downgrade existing EPCs.
I believe that initially HEM will only apply to new builds but will eventually be extended to all properties.
From what I have read HEM will favour electric heating so this might in itself downgrade existing EPCs.
I believe that initially HEM will only apply to new builds but will eventually be extended to all properties.
jmn said:
From what I have read HEM will favour electric heating so this might in itself downgrade existing EPCs.
I keep reading this but it’s a bit bewildering. The purpose of an EPC was to give you an idea of the energy efficiency of the building - which translates to a cost of heating.With electric heat units costing x4.7 as much as a gas heat unit, this will now be different (unless you have the worlds most efficient heat pump system).
So a “better” rated property could actually be more expensive to heat now using electricity compared with the same properly heated by gas with a worse rating.
So it’s more of an “eco” rating on the assumption we wint generate electricity by burning fossil fuels.
I renovated a flat last year and replaced 1970s storage heaters with gas - because you can’t install heat pumps in flats.
Silvanus said:
A big issue with EPC's is that in most cases it isn't a properly trained surveyor (Building Surveyor) that carries them out, its a box ticking exercise with no real in-depth analysis of how a building is constructed or how they perform. They would be a lot more expensive but more useful if done properly.
Makes sense as one of the local guys who does them is the local locksmith As a matter of interest how long does everyone think it should take to do an EPC?
If you are going to measure the property, measure all the windows, inspect the cavity, check the loft insulation etc how long will that take. Then you have to enter all the information in the software and generate the report.
Don’t forget travel time to the property.
If doing all that do we really expect a good job for £100? Which presumably includes VAT!
If you are going to measure the property, measure all the windows, inspect the cavity, check the loft insulation etc how long will that take. Then you have to enter all the information in the software and generate the report.
Don’t forget travel time to the property.
If doing all that do we really expect a good job for £100? Which presumably includes VAT!
PhilboSE said:
jmn said:
From what I have read HEM will favour electric heating so this might in itself downgrade existing EPCs.
I keep reading this but it’s a bit bewildering. The purpose of an EPC was to give you an idea of the energy efficiency of the building - which translates to a cost of heating.With electric heat units costing x4.7 as much as a gas heat unit, this will now be different (unless you have the worlds most efficient heat pump system).
So a “better” rated property could actually be more expensive to heat now using electricity compared with the same properly heated by gas with a worse rating.
So it’s more of an “eco” rating on the assumption we wint generate electricity by burning fossil fuels.
I renovated a flat last year and replaced 1970s storage heaters with gas - because you can’t install heat pumps in flats.
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