Dodgy Plumbing and house purchase
Discussion
Hi guys
in the process buying a house and would be very grateful for any informed views on the enclosed photo. We had a heating engineer visit who confirmed the pipes are for hot and cold water, running up to bathroom in the loft conversion and that to re-route would mean taking up floors and fiddling around with ceilings. It seems crazy to have water pipes running outside the property and it's given me and my wife cold feet, such that we have postponed the survey that was going to take place next week and asked the lawyer to hold off incurring any more cost.
Waiting to speak to the agent, who I am of course keeping at arms length generally, but am questioning if it is that big a deal or is perhaps symptomatic of a general approach which might mean there is more bodywork in the property - a survey would hopefully uncover that but the money we are potentially spending it just doesn't feel right to have pipework in this state.
Have tried to find building control certification the borough website and am awaiting a call back from that team but in current state of panic (2 young kids (4 and 1) and a third one coming in July, living in a very expensive and poor rental with landlords who are not great and who I don't want to give anymore money to!) I thought someone here might help me to see the wood for the trees! Any assistance very greatly appreciated!
in the process buying a house and would be very grateful for any informed views on the enclosed photo. We had a heating engineer visit who confirmed the pipes are for hot and cold water, running up to bathroom in the loft conversion and that to re-route would mean taking up floors and fiddling around with ceilings. It seems crazy to have water pipes running outside the property and it's given me and my wife cold feet, such that we have postponed the survey that was going to take place next week and asked the lawyer to hold off incurring any more cost.
Waiting to speak to the agent, who I am of course keeping at arms length generally, but am questioning if it is that big a deal or is perhaps symptomatic of a general approach which might mean there is more bodywork in the property - a survey would hopefully uncover that but the money we are potentially spending it just doesn't feel right to have pipework in this state.
Have tried to find building control certification the borough website and am awaiting a call back from that team but in current state of panic (2 young kids (4 and 1) and a third one coming in July, living in a very expensive and poor rental with landlords who are not great and who I don't want to give anymore money to!) I thought someone here might help me to see the wood for the trees! Any assistance very greatly appreciated!
I've no idea if it meets the required reg's, but my thoughts looking at the photo:
- It looks to be a poor quality installation
- Plastic pipes used which will be less tolerant to water freezing
- Cable ties look to be the securing method - these can degrade and wear to the point of failure
- Poorly applied lagging with pipes exposed in places
- Lagging already showing signs of deterioration in most areas (severe in some)
If I were looking to buy the house, I would factor the cost to rectify into my offer, or move on.
- It looks to be a poor quality installation
- Plastic pipes used which will be less tolerant to water freezing
- Cable ties look to be the securing method - these can degrade and wear to the point of failure
- Poorly applied lagging with pipes exposed in places
- Lagging already showing signs of deterioration in most areas (severe in some)
If I were looking to buy the house, I would factor the cost to rectify into my offer, or move on.
Not sure I would agree with plastic being more prone to freezing.
But otherwise, yes, looks rough as it comes.
Not just the two water feeds which I missed at first, but the soil pipe, and what I presume is a downspout coming in to the guttering.
And the uPVC window that has clearly been fitted after the beam above was last painted, by someone who clearly didn't care very much.
If there is some sort of story where by an ensuite was put in on a budget semi-temporary for an elderly relative or something, maybe just price for it to be done right.
But as suggested, it does make you wonder if they were happy with that, when else have they had done!
Even if you where running pipes externally, which is basically not a thing, there are ways it could have been done much nicer.
But otherwise, yes, looks rough as it comes.
Not just the two water feeds which I missed at first, but the soil pipe, and what I presume is a downspout coming in to the guttering.
And the uPVC window that has clearly been fitted after the beam above was last painted, by someone who clearly didn't care very much.
If there is some sort of story where by an ensuite was put in on a budget semi-temporary for an elderly relative or something, maybe just price for it to be done right.
But as suggested, it does make you wonder if they were happy with that, when else have they had done!
Even if you where running pipes externally, which is basically not a thing, there are ways it could have been done much nicer.
We have lagged pipes inside an outhouse used as a utility room and they froze in the cold weather we had a couple of weeks ago. I can't see how those pipes outside wouldn't freeze most winters.
The obvious question is if they've done that then what else is hiding / has been bodged.
Re-routing the pipes inside would be disruptive in the short term but is certainly not an impossible job (obviously I'm assuming it's a fairly standard construction / layout).
What price range is the house? Are we talking £100k or £1,000,000?
If you're looking for a project (which it doesn't sound like you are if you're soon to be outnumbered by the small people) then I'd use it as a decent price negotiating point knowing it'll get sorted as part of a full refurb. If you're looking for a forever home that requires very little, then it's probably not the right house for you.
The obvious question is if they've done that then what else is hiding / has been bodged.
Re-routing the pipes inside would be disruptive in the short term but is certainly not an impossible job (obviously I'm assuming it's a fairly standard construction / layout).
What price range is the house? Are we talking £100k or £1,000,000?
If you're looking for a project (which it doesn't sound like you are if you're soon to be outnumbered by the small people) then I'd use it as a decent price negotiating point knowing it'll get sorted as part of a full refurb. If you're looking for a forever home that requires very little, then it's probably not the right house for you.
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The points a few of you raise about if this then what else is the most pressing thing on my mind. Hoping the survey, plus separate electrician and heating engineer visits will help cover much of that but the thought of things coming out after we have forked out a very large amount of money (just shy of £1m) is really quite concerning!
I think our position most likely is do survey and then use as a negotiation point and if there is no movement then good luck to them as we will go elsewhere! Ticking clock not very helpful though!
The points a few of you raise about if this then what else is the most pressing thing on my mind. Hoping the survey, plus separate electrician and heating engineer visits will help cover much of that but the thought of things coming out after we have forked out a very large amount of money (just shy of £1m) is really quite concerning!
I think our position most likely is do survey and then use as a negotiation point and if there is no movement then good luck to them as we will go elsewhere! Ticking clock not very helpful though!
dhutch said:
Not sure I would agree with plastic being more prone to freezing.
I'll stand by that until someone offers me empirical evidence to the contrary (namely because I've nothing to prove otherwise 
)Serious thought though, I can't see from the images what fittings are used, but would anyone like to take a bet on push fit?
Guaranteed these will not like getting a shove from frozen water (if that were to happen).
They appear to run along the soffits - therefore it presumably wouldn't have been that hard to have run the pipe within the roof space instead. Obviously it would have required a bit more work to do so, but any credible installer would have done so I think - meaning it's clearly a proper bodge (as if that wasn't obvious).
Gville said:
Ticking clock not very helpful though!
Unless there is some external factor at play here that is influencing your timings, don't let your own desire to move fast force you into a house that turns into an albatross around your neck. Take a deep breath and do another month more in the rental - otherwise you're just swapping one problem house for another, but this time you own it On a £1m or so property I’d be offering at least £20k less and most likely £50k off just based on that one picture alone. That’s providing the survey threw up nothing structural and assuming the house/location are highly sought after.
If it’s easy to find another house in the area then why bother with the potential for hassle.
If it’s easy to find another house in the area then why bother with the potential for hassle.
RC1807 said:
My thoughts: If the owner thought that was acceptable, what the f
k else have they had bodged / bodged themselves in their ownership?
If correcting that plumbing would be 2k, I'd offer 20k less for the unknowns likely lurking beyond .....
Short answer: run away.
This ^^^^^^god knows what is hidden that cannot be seen. I would walk away.k else have they had bodged / bodged themselves in their ownership?If correcting that plumbing would be 2k, I'd offer 20k less for the unknowns likely lurking beyond .....
Short answer: run away.
mick987 said:
RC1807 said:
My thoughts: If the owner thought that was acceptable, what the fk else have they had bodged / bodged themselves in their ownership?
If correcting that plumbing would be 2k, I'd offer 20k less for the unknowns likely lurking beyond .....
Short answer: run away.
This ^^^^^^god knows what is hidden that cannot be seen. I would walk away.k else have they had bodged / bodged themselves in their ownership?If correcting that plumbing would be 2k, I'd offer 20k less for the unknowns likely lurking beyond .....
Short answer: run away.
I’m repeating what others say:
From that photo alone, I get really nervous. What’s the wire mesh? The shoddy looking finish on what should be basic easy things to do. Even the moss build up on the tiles tells a tale.
Generally everything can be put right or repaired, but I’ve the overwhelming feeling is this place has not been cared for.
From that photo alone, I get really nervous. What’s the wire mesh? The shoddy looking finish on what should be basic easy things to do. Even the moss build up on the tiles tells a tale.
Generally everything can be put right or repaired, but I’ve the overwhelming feeling is this place has not been cared for.
mick987 said:
RC1807 said:
My thoughts: If the owner thought that was acceptable, what the fk else have they had bodged / bodged themselves in their ownership?
If correcting that plumbing would be 2k, I'd offer 20k less for the unknowns likely lurking beyond .....
Short answer: run away.
This ^^^^^^god knows what is hidden that cannot be seen. I would walk away.k else have they had bodged / bodged themselves in their ownership?If correcting that plumbing would be 2k, I'd offer 20k less for the unknowns likely lurking beyond .....
Short answer: run away.
If current owners have been there long term, then the attitude to accept the pipes like that and then soil pipe like that, would have been wondering what else is behind the scenes.
That being said, £25k or whatever buys a LOT of work... And if your not averse to it you could end up with a better house overall.
Lifting floors, messing with plumbing and electrics etc is all doable, just ensure your offer reflects that.
Every house has their own hidden problems, even brand new, but a house like this and the right offer means you get the cash to make it work and improve!!
That being said, £25k or whatever buys a LOT of work... And if your not averse to it you could end up with a better house overall.
Lifting floors, messing with plumbing and electrics etc is all doable, just ensure your offer reflects that.
Every house has their own hidden problems, even brand new, but a house like this and the right offer means you get the cash to make it work and improve!!
That whole picture screams problems, I'm sorry but looks rough as.
The comment 25k buys you a lot of work, sadly these days it doesn't. A decent size kitchen removal, refit and flooring would swallow 25k without blinking. Redoing a bathroom could easily do 10k if your nit diy savvy.
1k or something on another months rent may be money well spent buying better
The comment 25k buys you a lot of work, sadly these days it doesn't. A decent size kitchen removal, refit and flooring would swallow 25k without blinking. Redoing a bathroom could easily do 10k if your nit diy savvy.
1k or something on another months rent may be money well spent buying better
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