Syncology NAS - what am I doing wrong - it all feels clunky

[jesusbuiltmycar]

Today a new DS224+ NAS arrived - I set it up with 2 x 4TB drives using SHR. I plan(ned) to use it to backup

iCloud Photos
iCloud Documents
iCloud encrypted folders (Cryptomator)
Ubuntu mini-pc running Home Assistant / Ad Guard + other stuff
Macbook Timemachine
etc.


I created a number of folders including one to use as a backup of my iCloud photos and specified the size to use (300GB)....

Then setup the Syncology Photos App on my iPhone, gave it the folder name and ... it ignored the folder I had created and shoved them under /home/ ...

Then I tried to backup some folders from my MAC using the Synology drive client - again it ignored the folder I had created and made its own under /home (using the name matching the shared folder i had created).

This all seems incredibly limiting - I have planned out a backup strategy and the whole thing appears to be setup for people that use tablets/smart phones! Why can't I get it to use the folders I have selected?

Should I bin all of the "apps" and simply use cron + rsync to manually do the backups?

it gets worse - the one Synology Drive Client job I created that should have copied on folder called "Paperwork" and all of its sub directories created 20 folders called "Paperwork-xxxx" where xxxx is a timestamp - each "Paperwork" folder had a bit of the original content in.

Further research reveals that "Synology Drive Client" does not work with iCloud directories ...

Edited by jesusbuiltmycar on Sunday 26th January 21:47

Edited by jesusbuiltmycar on Monday 27th January 07:19

[Griffith4ever]

Same NAS. I created a share called "PCBackups" and then use Built in Active Backup for Business to backup my PC - I "think" there is a small client on my PC - I'm not back home for a week. That runs weekly

I also run "Hyperbackup" on the NAS and that backs-up the backup to a portable HDD plugged into it - which I take "off site".

I "THINK", IIRC, you need to create shares rather than just "folders" on the NAS - to get the folders looking like you want. This is all from memory and I'll need to check when I get back.

Its the best NAS OS I've experienced, in a home environment. Runs rings around the old Netgear offerings.

[jesusbuiltmycar]

Thanks for the tip about "Hyperbackup" - not usre I will use it as the NAS is likely going to be returned as it is by far the most disappointing product I have purchased in a long time.

Turns out that the only way to backup certain folders from the iCloud is manually (or by writing a zsh script and manually running / using cron)

The main reason I bought it was to backup my iCloud photos which is a total sh:ceonsoredt-show - the best solution appears to be via the Synology Photos App which requires leaving an iPhone plugged in for about a week unlocked, this slowly copies the photos over.

Looks like I am not alone in this: https://www.reddit.com/r/synology/comments/1ibfym9...

The only alternative is a multi stepped manual approach:

1: get an external harddrive
2: create a "new Photos library" (launch photos holding the option key)
3: Set the second Photos library to download all copies locally
4: Then manually copy it to the NAS ...

Not sure if there is any point in doing step 4 the hard drive is already a backup - so it kind of defeats the reason for spending £500 on a NAS + 2 hard drives...

Edited by jesusbuiltmycar on Monday 27th January 22:20

[Craikeybaby]

There is certainly some jumping through hoops needed to get things done the Synology way. Personally I don't back up my iCloud Photos - that is the point of iCloud. Although they are probably on my NAS via TimeMachine.

[Griffith4ever]

Sounds very convoluted. On mine I use:
Active Backup for Business - it has access to shares on my desktop. Once a week. If I get an email that its failed then I power on my PC!, or close Outlook!
Hyperbackup does the NAS to external disk backup - its suited to it whereas Active Backup isn't (can't remember why)
My Photos are on Google Photos, and my PC in a folder - (That active backup backs up). I let my phone sync with google photos but occasionally, I plug it into my PC and simply transfer the files to my "Pics" folder.

That's it. All works like a charm.
Virtual Machine Manager works well and runs my Home Assistant
I also run a Plex media server off it - with a large WD HDD on USB as my movie store.

I'd say its far from clunky, but then I'm not trying to integrate with online services (icloud or google photos) so I'm shielded from that.

[LunarOne]

Don't use Synology Photos - that's designed to replace iCloud Photos or Google Photos. If you want to keep using iCloud photos but also back up to your NAS, use the DS File app. It has a photo backup function under the hamburger menu that copies photos and videos to any location you want on your NAS. You can configure it to upload only photos if you want, and only over WiFi. And it can convert Apple HEIF format to normal JPGs if you wish. That's my preferred way of working.

[jesusbuiltmycar]

Can the DS file app copy direct from iCloud to the NAS or do the photos need to be physically present on the MacBook? If the latter then that’s no good.

The DS app sounds like it is for accessing the NAS when away from home which sounds like a recipe for disaster - I doubt Synology’s security cuts the mustard - I have read the QNAP have certainly fallen foul of hackers… I only want to use it for local backups and plan to block external access for the NAS in my router - I have iCloud for anything I need when away from home and I trust Apple’s security a lot more some random NAS company.

I assumed that if / once Synology Photos had completed it could be used to update the backup - why would anyone use it to replace iCloud / Apple photos? It feels like something from 20 years ago and would be like swapping a modern car for an Austin All Aggro

I am starting to think that setting up a cheap PC as a Linux box would be a damn site better - I could at least automate everything instead of doing the Synology Hokey Cokey

Edited by jesusbuiltmycar on Tuesday 28th January 07:01

[eeLee]

Firstly, consider Tailscale on your devices and on the Synology; it's a graceful and secure way to access it.

It seems you want to back up certain items to the Synology unit. If you have already synced to iCloud then I would use CloudSync to sync down to the Synology, I do not use and have never used their Apps.

Most awesome is, if you have a MacBook, to target the Synology as your TimeMachine backup. This just works and gives you a defence-in-depth on getting content back. I think your purchase is a good one, you are just arriving with an intention that does not leverage the strengths of the ecosystem....maybe a slight pivot will help you get the most out of it.

Plus I assume there is always Docker for other functionality with this model to extend with.

[biggiles]

Synology seems to be the Mac of NAS... if you do it their way, it works wonderfully. Had one for a small biz, once all set up "their way" It Just Worked. Very reassuring.

Just don't try to do anything too off-piste, it doesn't like that. If you want to do complex re-sizing/RAID levels/customisations etc., then consider alternatives.

[jesusbuiltmycar]

I only want it to do one thing well - automate the backup of files locally - so far it appears to have a load of ‘features’ that are at best poorly implemented (e.g. Synology Photos) and at worst possible security weaknesses.

As mentioned I do not need remote access when away from home and I do not really need access from my phone and I certainly do not want to use Synology’s photo management. IMHO a NAS is for backups.

It clearly does not play well with Apple unless I start faffing with Docker + Python + third party software combined with manual scripts. If that is the only way then the faff factor it feels like a downgrade from plugging in a portable hard drive and either running TimeMachine, doing the Apple Photos trick I mentioned above or running rsync in a terminal.

(The Apple Photos trick will not work with SMB mounted drives, ergo it is not compatible with the Synology NAS).

I opted for Synology NAS based on the slick marketing and because I thought it would be simpler than rolling my own. I now fail to see what this NAS gives me vs a cheap PC running Linux acting as a server for the disks, which would have better hardware and more scope for future upgrades.

[eeLee]

The Synology will run AFP too. Again, I don't know exactly what you want to do with Photos. If you want to backup your MacBook, Time Machine.

Maybe layer on Syncthing on the NAS and Mac if you want to sync/backup at file level?

I've had Synology for years and never use their Apps. They work across macOS and Windows really well.

Also check out synocommunity for other solutions that might help with your challanges.

[outnumbered]

jesusbuiltmycar said:

I opted for Synology NAS based on the slick marketing and because I thought it would be simpler than rolling my own. I now fail to see what this NAS gives me vs a cheap PC running Linux acting as a server for the disks, which would have better hardware and more scope for future upgrades.

If that's definitely all you want, then I agree, Synology isn't worthwhile for your use case.

Personally, I used to run a home-brew server setup that contained photos, music, various backups, Radius server, VPN termination etc. I've moved most of that onto a Synology device, and it's a lot simpler to administer now, plus it gives me simple VM capability which has been very useful.

[Mandat]

I've been using Synology NAS servers for over 10 years in my small home-office, and I currently run three Synology machines (including a DS224+); 1 as the main data server, with the other two as separate backups.

I don't know anything about Macs, so perhaps I'm barking up the wrong tree, but it seems to me that whatever backup method you are using need to be set up on your Mac (and not on the NAS), with the target pointing at the NAS device.

Synology have many different apps available but I think that they are mostly used to manipulate & backup data already on the NAS to different servers, folders, locations, etc. However, I would be surprised if the Synology apps were not able to integrate well with a Mac to carry out basic backup functions such as what you are trying to achieve.

[LunarOne]

The problem is not Synology, it's with Apple who obfuscate things and make it difficult for other solutions to tie in. Why? Because they want you to spend money on their iCloud Subscription rather than using a NAS. That's why you can't configure your iPhone to back itself up to anything other than iCloud.

I'd be very surprised if Synology's Active Backup for business can't back up wherever your iCloud data on your Mac as long as its all synced to your Mac though.

[RizzoTheRat]

If your iCloud photos already synced to your Mac, then you should be able to use Synology Drive Client to backup the files from the Mac.

I use Dropbox to sync my phone's photos to my PC and then Synology Drive Client to back up the PC. I'd assume you could use iCloud the same way.

[CharlesElliott]

If you store your iCloud library on your PC you can back it up from there. Synology offers other ways to do cloud backup from other providers (e.g. OneDrive) but not iCloud. I can only assume this is because of a restriction on the Apple side.

[jesusbuiltmycar]

The issue is that the iCloud Photos full library are only available on iCloud - they are not all on the mac and are pulled as needed. There are Python scripts that can fetch the library but I was led to believe that Synology already had plenty of Apple specific features - looks like the only thing Apple they support is TimeMachine (which backs up the contents of a Mac not the iCloud).

As I have said - overall I am very disappointed - even the hardware is pretty poor (no option to add an nVME SSD as a cache, little scope for memory upgrades - only 1GB ethernet etc etc.)

My options are all very manual ... the only improvement is that I do not need to manually plug in an external hard drive (although transfer to/from the external hard drive is way quicker that the network bound NAS).

[LunarOne]

I have the DS1821+ with the 5-drive DX-517 expansion for a total of 13 drives in two RAID6 arrays. I actually back up the important stuff from the internal array to the external one, so that I have a local backup. I also backup to both Backblaze and to AWS Glacier. Upgraded to 8GB RAM and there's the option to add 2x SSD caches, more memory and a PCIe slot to upgrade to 10Gb Ethernet. But it should have been clear that you would not have these options with the basic 2-bay unit - it's all very clear on Synology's website.

The way I do it to avoid iCloud filling up my PC hard drive is to create a 1TB iSCSI LUN which I present to my PC as a regular drive, and I have iCloud deposit its data (both files and photos) onto that drive. I can then use my computer's backup software to back up that drive to the NAS. This works around iCloud's refusal to store its data on an SMB share to protect their subscription revenue.

The problem is Apple, not Synology.

[Craikeybaby]

Thanks to this thread I learned about the Python script to get files out of Apple Photos - previously I have relied on Apple to back up my iCloud Photos (generally my important photos are in Lightroom), but I'll give the script a try to back them up onto my Synology NAS, just in case there is a problem with Apple.

[jesusbuiltmycar]

There are 2 ways of using the script -manually or via docker...


There is a reddit thread giving a simple recipe for running it manually - I wil try and drop a link later.