Jaguar 2.0 Ingenium engine FUBARed...

[Ganglandboss]

We have a Jaguar XE R-Sport with the 2.0 Ingenium diesel engine. I was driving home from my parent's house on Tuesday. As I joined the motorway, somebody was dawdling on the sliproad at about 35 mph, and did not show any signs of putting their foot down. When I got a gap in traffic in the net lane, I accelerated, and the restricted performance light came on, as I hit 65.

I decided to nurse it to the next junction, and it began to smoke, really badly. I got off the motorway and it stank of oil. The plume of smoke was lingering around where I stopped.

I called the AA and eventually got recovered. They could not get a patrol out, so they came around to our house yesterday morning.

I noticed when I lifted the bonnet that there was a lot of soot, and the oil has been completely consumed.

The AA man plugged it in and got the following:





The one he said he was worried about is the camshaft position sensor, and says it has the look of timing chain problems.

Does anybody have any thoughts on the prognosis?

Can anybody reccomensd a specialist who could do the works? We are in Wilmslow, Cheshire. I have a Disco 3 and we have a car trailer hire place nearby, so I can tow it anywhere reasonable.

Thanks!

[E-bmw]

Ganglandboss said:

I noticed when I lifted the bonnet that there was a lot of soot, and the oil has been completely consumed.

I would say you need a new/replacement engine, I doubt there would be a need for a "specialist" to diagnose this, just a competent garage.

[normalbloke]

I got as far as ‘Ingenium’…

[ThingsBehindTheSun]

normalbloke said:

I got as far as ‘Ingenium’…

Same, as soon as I read that I knew it was new engine time.

[MB140]

Have a search for a poster on here called Etsy. He more competent than most mechanics and has just had this issue.

Sorry but it’s new engine time more than likely. These engines fail faster than a wes nickers disappear.

Your choice is basically sell as is and take the hit and never buy another car with that engine again.

Or

Buy a used engine from a breaker (expensive because they are in high demand because there all failing) and you don’t know the condition of the used engine which could also be fubar. Then get rid asap before that one fails.

The choice is yours.

[Steve H]

E-bmw said:

I would say you need a new/replacement engine, I doubt there would be a need for a "specialist" to diagnose this, just a competent garage.

Agreed, although a typical replacement on these chocolate engines runs well into 5 figures so a lot of workshops just won’t take them on. A big bill with low margin and heavy warranty potential just isn’t worthwhile unless you know all the ins and outs.


Kudos to the OP though for being brave enough to own two JLR products .

[Richard-D]

Steve H said:

Agreed, although a typical replacement on these chocolate engines runs well into 5 figures so a lot of workshops just won’t take them on. A big bill with low margin and heavy warranty potential just isn’t worthwhile unless you know all the ins and outs.


Kudos to the OP though for being brave enough to own two JLR products .

The right kind of garage will fit a 2nd hand engine providing a warranty on their work but not the engine itself. I bet these engines are expensive as a result of their fragility though. The car is probably going to need to be worth 10k plus (ISH) to justify this route for a non-diyer.

[stevemcs]

Scrap it, your looking around 10k if the engine is knackered, no point in going second hand as it’s probably there because the engine is knackered.

[Steve H]

Richard-D said:

The right kind of garage will fit a 2nd hand engine providing a warranty on their work but not the engine itself. I bet these engines are expensive as a result of their fragility though. The car is probably going to need to be worth 10k plus (ISH) to justify this route for a non-diyer.

The “right kind of garage” will still get shouted at when that second hand turd inevitably detonates and the cheapskate customer conveniently forgets the warnings he was given and thinks he should not have to pay for the labour for fitting another pre-stressed timebomb.


You are right about the vehicle needing a certain value to be even worth a repair though, unfortunately the only way to avoid expensive repairs on Ingenium engines is to buy a car that doesn’t have one fitted.

[GreenV8S]

Steve H said:

unfortunately the only way to avoid expensive repairs on Ingenium engines is to buy a car that doesn’t have one fitted.

I'm definitely going to steal this.

[Ganglandboss]

Thanks for the replies. I have done a bit of research and I have found a few places that will collect the car and rebuild the engine. I am getting prices ranging from around £4,000 to £7,000, most coming around £5,000, and warranties varying from 3 months to 2 years.

Most, understandably, say there could be extra work when they strip it. The most promising one is a guy in Bolton who is quoting £4,500 with a 2 year unlimited mileage warranty. He said the only extra could be the turbo, which he said would cost up to £500 to rebuild, or exchange for a reconditioned unit.

I have been looking at the value of the car; they seem to be going for around £6,000 for a private sale. I have found a website that buys problem cars, and they have offered £1,250, so it is a bit of a no-brainer. I think the next steps are phone around breakers and see if anybody can improve on that.

Car shopping this afternoon!

Steve H said:

Kudos to the OP though for being brave enough to own two JLR products .

Would you be impressed if I told you I also have a Lotus Elise with a K-Series engine?

[stevemcs]

Stick it on ebay, you might get a bit more for it. But usually with a knackered engine thet are worth weigh in.

[Sylvias_Father]

I have the same car (but have had the chain replaced). Can I ask, what age and mileage did it fail at?

[Steve H]

Sounds like the right way to go, a £5k rebuild would be hard to trust and so would its warranty I’m afraid.

Maybe break the habits of a lifetime and avoid an engine that has a built in countdown for the next one so you can still afford all those head gaskets for the Lotus .

[Ganglandboss]

Sylvias_Father said:

I have the same car (but have had the chain replaced). Can I ask, what age and mileage did it fail at?

It's a 66 plate and it has just under 75,000 miles on it.

[Sylvias_Father]

Ganglandboss said:

Sylvias_Father said:

I have the same car (but have had the chain replaced). Can I ask, what age and mileage did it fail at?

It's a 66 plate and it has just under 75,000 miles on it.

Thanks. Mine is 65 with 110k miles. Did you have it regularly serviced and the timing chain replaced? (I appreciate a chain should be for "life")

Anyway, it's been reliable so far, apart from replacing an engine mount. Fingers crossed.

[stevieturbo]

Sylvias_Father said:

Thanks. Mine is 65 with 110k miles. Did you have it regularly serviced and the timing chain replaced? (I appreciate a chain should be for "life")

Anyway, it's been reliable so far, apart from replacing an engine mount. Fingers crossed.

No chain is ever for life, likewise with oils, belts, whatever.

Does seem a disgrace that JLR just build ste. Some of their vehicles look really good, but doubt I'd ever buy one when the engineering/reliability is so bad.

Really governments should have tougher mandates on reliability and less on emissions ste that makes vehicles unreliable. Any modern engine should easily last 100k, and if looked after should still be going well at 300k unless abused by a total bellend.

[Ganglandboss]

I was talking to a couple of people at my diving club the other night, and they were asking if I had tried running it since. One said there's nothing to lose by trying, and it might be worth filling it with oil and trying it. My OH asked if we could give it a try, so I got some oil.

I filled it up this afternoon, and I plugged it into my iCarsoft JLR diagnostic computer. I got the same nine fault codes the AA man got. I cleared them, and went for a restart; it ran.

It is smoking a little bit, but I would expect that with oil in the exhaust. There is also smoke coming from the dipstick tube, which I understand can be due to damaged piston rings. I have not compression tested it yet, but I can do at some point over the next couple of days.

The engine sounds okay, but I have not taken it above idle I ran it for around ten minutes and no fault codes have come up.

I'm thinking the next step is to check the turbo?

I am not expecting it to be totally fixed, but if I can get it running well enough to get it to go the 2 miles down the A34 to We Buy Any Car, we might get a bit more than the £1,250 on offer at the moment. We have spoken to the guy in the hut at Tesco, and we have been honest with him. He is offering less than the problem car website, but he said if we can bring it to him running, he could probably get a lot more.

[leef44]

I guess you have nothing to lose trying. A friend had a poorly Ford Galaxy 2.0 turbo diesel and could not get her mechanic to fix it. I told her to put some premium super fuel in either BP or Shell (not sure what the diesel version is called). She did this and it started running better again after a tank or so.

Could be worth a try.

[stevieturbo]

Ganglandboss said:

I was talking to a couple of people at my diving club the other night, and they were asking if I had tried running it since. One said there's nothing to lose by trying, and it might be worth filling it with oil and trying it. My OH asked if we could give it a try, so I got some oil.

I filled it up this afternoon, and I plugged it into my iCarsoft JLR diagnostic computer. I got the same nine fault codes the AA man got. I cleared them, and went for a restart; it ran.

It is smoking a little bit, but I would expect that with oil in the exhaust. There is also smoke coming from the dipstick tube, which I understand can be due to damaged piston rings. I have not compression tested it yet, but I can do at some point over the next couple of days.

The engine sounds okay, but I have not taken it above idle I ran it for around ten minutes and no fault codes have come up.

I'm thinking the next step is to check the turbo?

I am not expecting it to be totally fixed, but if I can get it running well enough to get it to go the 2 miles down the A34 to We Buy Any Car, we might get a bit more than the £1,250 on offer at the moment. We have spoken to the guy in the hut at Tesco, and we have been honest with him. He is offering less than the problem car website, but he said if we can bring it to him running, he could probably get a lot more.

If it starts and runs, you need to see if it will drive, and if so how well.