Stick or Twist?
Discussion
If you found yourself in a position like a Bottas or Sainz (others available). Where you have been in a top team won races and shown yourself to be an excellent driver but not WC level.
What would your next move be? Stick around F1 in middling to lower cars knowing you have most likely had your shot. Take the money and be happy to just be a part of F1.
Or twist move to another series like Indy or Sportcars for top teams like Porsche, Toyota, Ferrari, Andretti etc where you could be at the sharp end of some very prestigious races. But it’s not F1 and I assume less well paid as well.
What would you do. No wrong answers of course just a bit of fun.
What would your next move be? Stick around F1 in middling to lower cars knowing you have most likely had your shot. Take the money and be happy to just be a part of F1.
Or twist move to another series like Indy or Sportcars for top teams like Porsche, Toyota, Ferrari, Andretti etc where you could be at the sharp end of some very prestigious races. But it’s not F1 and I assume less well paid as well.
What would you do. No wrong answers of course just a bit of fun.
The problem is that money means a lot to anyone, you can probably earn 10 million a year for another 5 years or earn maybe 1.5 driving for Porsche or Toyota or someone in WEC, or maybe a few more in INdycar.
Money talks sadly
Which even though he was kind of forced out, is why I respect Alonso so much for getting away doing Indy, Dakar WEC, he went out there and tried other things, yes he was minted, but Lewis could do this, but wants the money his F1 career can still afford him. It is rare, but I respect Alonso for doing what he did far, far more.
Button was done, but has tried loads of things, fair play,a nd I know Max will do stuff when he stops. More should too, but I think family etc prevents it.
Money talks sadly
Which even though he was kind of forced out, is why I respect Alonso so much for getting away doing Indy, Dakar WEC, he went out there and tried other things, yes he was minted, but Lewis could do this, but wants the money his F1 career can still afford him. It is rare, but I respect Alonso for doing what he did far, far more.
Button was done, but has tried loads of things, fair play,a nd I know Max will do stuff when he stops. More should too, but I think family etc prevents it.
I’ve often wondered this myself and I don’t know what I’d do. I remember Damon Hill won the Japanese GP and WDC 1996 and then a few days later was pounding around a deserted Suzuka in a Bridgestone test car preparing for the move to Arrows. I remember thinking what a come down that must have been.
For Sainz I suppose the hope is still there that he will find his way back into a top seat, and any seat in F1 is better than no seat at all. As competitive as other series might be, there’s no guarantee there will be a way back into F1 if he left.
He might troll around at the back but there will still be opportunities to demonstrate his skills and who knows when a Hungary 1997 scenario present itself again!
For Sainz I suppose the hope is still there that he will find his way back into a top seat, and any seat in F1 is better than no seat at all. As competitive as other series might be, there’s no guarantee there will be a way back into F1 if he left.
He might troll around at the back but there will still be opportunities to demonstrate his skills and who knows when a Hungary 1997 scenario present itself again!
To be fair I wouldn't quite put Sainz in that camp. I think given the right machinery and right support he's got what it takes to be a WDC. I'm not sure if it would happen for him, but if Williams nails the new regs and the rumours of Mercedes having a beast of an engine is true then he's still got his chance.
I'm actually a little excited for Williams at the moment, think they've come a long way since the takeover and have a lot of right people in the right places. Was a big statement signing Sainz and maintaining Albon. These are 2 paid drivers (OK they'll bring a good level of sponsorship), but they're not having to take on drivers for bigger teams etc.
End of the day F1 is the pinnacle of Motorsports, so everyone wants to be there.
I'm actually a little excited for Williams at the moment, think they've come a long way since the takeover and have a lot of right people in the right places. Was a big statement signing Sainz and maintaining Albon. These are 2 paid drivers (OK they'll bring a good level of sponsorship), but they're not having to take on drivers for bigger teams etc.
End of the day F1 is the pinnacle of Motorsports, so everyone wants to be there.
Jayho said:
To be fair I wouldn't quite put Sainz in that camp. I think given the right machinery and right support he's got what it takes to be a WDC. I'm not sure if it would happen for him, but if Williams nails the new regs and the rumours of Mercedes having a beast of an engine is true then he's still got his chance.
I'm actually a little excited for Williams at the moment, think they've come a long way since the takeover and have a lot of right people in the right places. Was a big statement signing Sainz and maintaining Albon. These are 2 paid drivers (OK they'll bring a good level of sponsorship), but they're not having to take on drivers for bigger teams etc.
End of the day F1 is the pinnacle of Motorsports, so everyone wants to be there.
If Mercedes manage to to do what they did in 2014 and nail the new engine regs, there’s a good chance of podium finishes for Williams in 2026. I suspect that Carlos has his eggs in that basket, while waiting for any other opportunity that arises. There’s a lot of rookies around this season, and it’s not impossible that one or more of them will turn out to be a dud. I'm actually a little excited for Williams at the moment, think they've come a long way since the takeover and have a lot of right people in the right places. Was a big statement signing Sainz and maintaining Albon. These are 2 paid drivers (OK they'll bring a good level of sponsorship), but they're not having to take on drivers for bigger teams etc.
End of the day F1 is the pinnacle of Motorsports, so everyone wants to be there.
I think every driver wants to be an F1 driver for as long as possible. Obviously the money is an order of magnitude more than any other series will pay, but also it’s easy to be forgotten about if you’re not in the paddock.
Hence the likes of Bottas taking a development and reserve driver role at Mercedes over a WEC or Indycar drive, for which teams in both series would likely have bent over backwards for his signature. He’s not one who needs the money either, would have earned close to $100m over his career in salary and sponsorships.
Will be interesting to see what happens with Daniel Ricciardo this year, there’s a rumour that he might end up in a NASCAR at Daytona which would be something of a swerve. He’s apparently living in the US, was posting about the Los Angeles fires last week.
bergclimber34 said:
The problem is that money means a lot to anyone, you can probably earn 10 million a year for another 5 years or earn maybe 1.5 driving for Porsche or Toyota or someone in WEC, or maybe a few more in INdycar.
Money talks sadly
Which even though he was kind of forced out, is why I respect Alonso so much for getting away doing Indy, Dakar WEC, he went out there and tried other things, yes he was minted, but Lewis could do this, but wants the money his F1 career can still afford him. It is rare, but I respect Alonso for doing what he did far, far more.
Button was done, but has tried loads of things, fair play,a nd I know Max will do stuff when he stops. More should too, but I think family etc prevents it.
I think Lewis wants an 8th WDC more than the money. IMHOMoney talks sadly
Which even though he was kind of forced out, is why I respect Alonso so much for getting away doing Indy, Dakar WEC, he went out there and tried other things, yes he was minted, but Lewis could do this, but wants the money his F1 career can still afford him. It is rare, but I respect Alonso for doing what he did far, far more.
Button was done, but has tried loads of things, fair play,a nd I know Max will do stuff when he stops. More should too, but I think family etc prevents it.
LHRFlightman said:
I think Lewis wants an 8th WDC more than the money. IMHO
9th. But I would stick. I can't imagine life outside of F1 being anywhere near as "interesting" as life inside of it and it would be a bit like a fundamental career change to a "normal" person, but if you enjoyed the F1 then why not stay there?
Don't get me wrong, I suspect all the travel etc is actually a nightmare of a life (would be for me) but the question was theoretical.....
LHRFlightman said:
bergclimber34 said:
The problem is that money means a lot to anyone, you can probably earn 10 million a year for another 5 years or earn maybe 1.5 driving for Porsche or Toyota or someone in WEC, or maybe a few more in INdycar.
Money talks sadly
Which even though he was kind of forced out, is why I respect Alonso so much for getting away doing Indy, Dakar WEC, he went out there and tried other things, yes he was minted, but Lewis could do this, but wants the money his F1 career can still afford him. It is rare, but I respect Alonso for doing what he did far, far more.
Button was done, but has tried loads of things, fair play,a nd I know Max will do stuff when he stops. More should too, but I think family etc prevents it.
I think Lewis wants an 8th WDC more than the money. IMHOMoney talks sadly
Which even though he was kind of forced out, is why I respect Alonso so much for getting away doing Indy, Dakar WEC, he went out there and tried other things, yes he was minted, but Lewis could do this, but wants the money his F1 career can still afford him. It is rare, but I respect Alonso for doing what he did far, far more.
Button was done, but has tried loads of things, fair play,a nd I know Max will do stuff when he stops. More should too, but I think family etc prevents it.
Stick to F1 is the simple no-brainer answer but depends on age, status and what stage of your F1 career.
Eg.
Alonso - box office and can afford to take a hiatus but choice of teams narrowed.
Sainz - not box office but operates at very high level and still in prime years. Stay in F1. Risk of being forgotten about and a younger driver becoming flavour of the month.
Bottas - twilight years, no race seats. If it was me I'd leave F1 and get my racing kicks elsewhere. He must be getting paid very, very good money for doing the worst roles of an F1 driver: sim work, PR, and seen standing in the garage with headphones and pretending to be interested in what's going on around you.
Eg.
Alonso - box office and can afford to take a hiatus but choice of teams narrowed.
Sainz - not box office but operates at very high level and still in prime years. Stay in F1. Risk of being forgotten about and a younger driver becoming flavour of the month.
Bottas - twilight years, no race seats. If it was me I'd leave F1 and get my racing kicks elsewhere. He must be getting paid very, very good money for doing the worst roles of an F1 driver: sim work, PR, and seen standing in the garage with headphones and pretending to be interested in what's going on around you.
LHRFlightman said:
I think Lewis wants an 8th WDC more than the money. IMHO
Merc offered a 1 year deal whereas Ferrari offered 2+ years; same reason Alonso left Alpine for AM.cjm said:
Button and Rosberg are interesting ones, seems like Button blew lots of his money were he was earning big and is still driving, and Rosberg, quit driving but is hanging around F1 where he could have still had a seat...
It's definitely a rare one - Rosberg is one of only two F1 drivers who retired after winning their first World Championship, the other being Mike Hawthorn (who tragically died 3 months into his retirement in a car crash on the A3). I understand the whole reaching the summit, all your mental preparation and commitment throughout the year to finally achieve your dream, but to then retire from the sport your love at only 31! I mean he was barely out of his 20's when he stopped racing altogether, fair play to him I guess, but I know I couldn't have done that, I would need to keep racing something, somewhere!
Jasandjules said:
9th.
But I would stick. I can't imagine life outside of F1 being anywhere near as "interesting" as life inside of it and it would be a bit like a fundamental career change to a "normal" person, but if you enjoyed the F1 then why not stay there?
Don't get me wrong, I suspect all the travel etc is actually a nightmare of a life (would be for me) but the question was theoretical.....
I think this is a very relevant point, I'm surprised no one else has made it. It seems obvious to me that even before some of these guys were making any real money, or even believed they one day would be, they trained and begged for drives and pushed to get as high up in motorsport as they could - they're racing drivers. Money aside, if they want to race cars, a lot of them will take an F1 drive over other options so long as it's on the table.But I would stick. I can't imagine life outside of F1 being anywhere near as "interesting" as life inside of it and it would be a bit like a fundamental career change to a "normal" person, but if you enjoyed the F1 then why not stay there?
Don't get me wrong, I suspect all the travel etc is actually a nightmare of a life (would be for me) but the question was theoretical.....
Another way to demonstrate how much racing drivers actually want to race in F1 is to consider certain pay drivers - kids that grew up with billionaire parents and were set for life before they were born! They don't need F1 money, they don't need to have a job at all, racing or otherwise - they could spend their weekends banging supermodels on the yacht. But they instead choose to knuckle down at least hard enough to get a super license and eventually end up in F1, which needless to say, is a huge time commitment and seriously hard work - all for money they don't need.
Lastly, can they even get used to their F1 income level enough to rely upon it continuing at that level? Do they even give much thought to the bank balance? It's quite hard as an F1 driver to enjoy their high incomes in the traditional sense because there's so much they can't do. They can't enjoy fancy food whenever they wish, their diet is largely prescribed. They can't go out and buy any car they want, because that would upset their team, who has already given them a free car anyway, If they buy a plane, the world hates them. They can buy one or more amazing homes, but their staff will spend more time in them than they do.
I think mostly, it's not about the money for the drivers, so much as it is between the teams trying to attract the best drivers - that competition, effectively a bidding war, carries the side effect of the better drivers ending up making tens of millions a season. If the sport didn't work that way, most if not all of them would still have aimed for F1 and would have stayed once they'd got there.
TheDeuce said:
Another way to demonstrate how much racing drivers actually want to race in F1 is to consider certain pay drivers - kids that grew up with billionaire parents and were set for life before they were born!
Can't remember his name, this reminded me of the paid for Indian racing driver who did the lower formula's with family money. All I remember is him being absolutely terrible, not knowing how flags work (aka making it way through the field on the cooldown lap once the race was finished) and once being stuck and being told by his pit team that when doing a 3 point turn you need to turn the wheel when going backwards as well as forwards.Jayho said:
TheDeuce said:
Another way to demonstrate how much racing drivers actually want to race in F1 is to consider certain pay drivers - kids that grew up with billionaire parents and were set for life before they were born!
Can't remember his name, this reminded me of the paid for Indian racing driver who did the lower formula's with family money. All I remember is him being absolutely terrible, not knowing how flags work (aka making it way through the field on the cooldown lap once the race was finished) and once being stuck and being told by his pit team that when doing a 3 point turn you need to turn the wheel when going backwards as well as forwards.Enjoy
Speed Badger said:
cjm said:
Button and Rosberg are interesting ones, seems like Button blew lots of his money were he was earning big and is still driving, and Rosberg, quit driving but is hanging around F1 where he could have still had a seat...
It's definitely a rare one - Rosberg is one of only two F1 drivers who retired after winning their first World Championship, the other being Mike Hawthorn (who tragically died 3 months into his retirement in a car crash on the A3). I understand the whole reaching the summit, all your mental preparation and commitment throughout the year to finally achieve your dream, but to then retire from the sport you love at only 31! I mean he was barely out of his 20's when he stopped racing altogether, fair play to him I guess, but I know I couldn't have done that, I would need to keep racing something, somewhere!
Rosberg seemed like someone who loved racing and being in F1, until he had to push his limits to win the WDC. After he quit, he could get back to enjoying life.
TheDeuce said:
Jasandjules said:
9th.
But I would stick. I can't imagine life outside of F1 being anywhere near as "interesting" as life inside of it and it would be a bit like a fundamental career change to a "normal" person, but if you enjoyed the F1 then why not stay there?
Don't get me wrong, I suspect all the travel etc is actually a nightmare of a life (would be for me) but the question was theoretical.....
I think this is a very relevant point, I'm surprised no one else has made it. It seems obvious to me that even before some of these guys were making any real money, or even believed they one day would be, they trained and begged for drives and pushed to get as high up in motorsport as they could - they're racing drivers. Money aside, if they want to race cars, a lot of them will take an F1 drive over other options so long as it's on the table.But I would stick. I can't imagine life outside of F1 being anywhere near as "interesting" as life inside of it and it would be a bit like a fundamental career change to a "normal" person, but if you enjoyed the F1 then why not stay there?
Don't get me wrong, I suspect all the travel etc is actually a nightmare of a life (would be for me) but the question was theoretical.....
Another way to demonstrate how much racing drivers actually want to race in F1 is to consider certain pay drivers - kids that grew up with billionaire parents and were set for life before they were born! They don't need F1 money, they don't need to have a job at all, racing or otherwise - they could spend their weekends banging supermodels on the yacht. But they instead choose to knuckle down at least hard enough to get a super license and eventually end up in F1, which needless to say, is a huge time commitment and seriously hard work - all for money they don't need.
Lastly, can they even get used to their F1 income level enough to rely upon it continuing at that level? Do they even give much thought to the bank balance? It's quite hard as an F1 driver to enjoy their high incomes in the traditional sense because there's so much they can't do. They can't enjoy fancy food whenever they wish, their diet is largely prescribed. They can't go out and buy any car they want, because that would upset their team, who has already given them a free car anyway, If they buy a plane, the world hates them. They can buy one or more amazing homes, but their staff will spend more time in them than they do.
I think mostly, it's not about the money for the drivers, so much as it is between the teams trying to attract the best drivers - that competition, effectively a bidding war, carries the side effect of the better drivers ending up making tens of millions a season. If the sport didn't work that way, most if not all of them would still have aimed for F1 and would have stayed once they'd got there.
F1 is seen as the pinical of motor sport by some, but not everyone.
Yes it has the highest profile, but lets face it the racing isnt the best.
And if you are in the wrong car, then forget winning.
There are alot of other championships that offer much better racing.
The one thing F1 has is money.
But the drivers have to work bloody hard to get it. Its a life i used to be involved in, not as a driver obviously, and its hard work.
I now work in sportscars, have for a few decades, and the work life balance is very different, and most drivers i have spoken to think the same, including alot of ex F1 drivers, yes the money isnt as good, although not much less, different for the drivers i know.
But its worth it just to be able to see your family some times.
Money is irrelevant unless you have the time to spend it.
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