Breaking (or removing) a toilet - any tips?

[davek_964]

Our downstairs toilet has been leaking when flushed (cistern to toilet, so clean water fortunately). It's a suspended toilet, and it seems the leak has rusted the bolts enough that on one side it is absolutely siezed solid (the bolts are where the toilet seat / lid screw on, and screw vertically in to a plastic mount at the bottom behind the bowl).

We've had 2 plumbers who have failed to get the bolt free - and we've now reached the point where the head (allen key) is rounded. Options are limited because there is a plastic bush type thing that sits around (and above) the head of the bolt which the fixture for the toilet seat / lid screw into.
There is no real access to the bottom of the bolt.

So - the current plumber has decided that the only option is to break the toilet to get it off. We have accepted this, and bought a replacement toilet. But.....

We do have a few concerns about smashing a toilet to pieces in the bathroom - not least because the floor standing cistern has a glass front. And of course it doesn't just need to be smashed, it needs to be smashed such that it can be removed.

A quick search suggests that duck tape on the toilet will reduce the risk that the plumber will be cut to shreds by shards of porcelain when he attempts this. And we're going to put hardboard up against the tiles in the bathroom / floor / front of the cistern etc.

But any other tips (or ideas of how to get the damn toilet off without smashing it!).

Plumber is good (current one was recommended by somebody and already did some other stuff for us) - but we're not really confident that this is going to go well...... (he's due on Monday).

[tegwin]

If the supporting bolt is sat in a plastic bush.... how about getting a blowtorch on the bush and burning it out... You might then find that the bolt head will pass through the ceramic leaving it untouched?!

[davek_964]

tegwin said:

If the supporting bolt is sat in a plastic bush.... how about getting a blowtorch on the bush and burning it out... You might then find that the bolt head will pass through the ceramic leaving it untouched?!

I'm not sure that would work, because - even if the bolt would fit through the ceramic - it will still be bolted at the bottom (which I think is the mount to the cistern).

However - although there isn't much access to the bottom of the toilet, there is probably enough to get a blowtorch there. And the bolt is into a metal thread in a plastic mount........ I wonder if we could melt the surrounding plastic and pull the bolt and thread up.......

Thanks for the idea

[AJLintern]

Would an oscillating multi tool blade fit in there to cut through the bolt?

[Neptune188]

If you can get a drill on to the rounded off head, google Easy Outs. I've only ever once been defeated with them (and that's because the easy out snapped...)

[b14]

Or possibly the surgical use of a chisel and hammer to break the porcelain around the bolt rather than just smashing up the whole thing, to avoid too much collateral damage?

[Vanden Saab]

Meh, protection on the floor, club hammer and bang, bang it is off.

[davek_964]

Vanden Saab said:

Meh, protection on the floor, club hammer and bang, bang it is off.

That's what it will come to.

Since posting, the plumber has changed plans and will come tomorrow. My wife decided that the bolt WOULD come out, and I should spend my evening trying..........

Attacking from below isn't possible - the thread the bolt screws into is just too far away from the bottom of the toilet.

My borescope showed that an alternative approach might work - instead of removing the bolt that holds the toilet to the mount - why not undo the bolt holding the toilet to the cistern?
But that didn't work - the extra thread is too long for a normal 19mm socket to get to the nut, and there isn't enough space to get a long socket in there (even if I had a deep 19mm socket). Aha I thought - 19mm ring spanner......... but no, because the bottom of the toilet sticks out and you can't get the ring spanner on the nut.

So, back to attacking from the top. Wife insisted I try to break the plastic surround from the bolt - which I eventually managed to do with a drill. She believed I'd be able to get mole grips in there - which I knew I wouldn't (and was now able to prove this) - and I did point out that even if I could, we'd have no leverage.

But - I did manage to drill enough of a hole in the bolt that I could get my stud extractor in there. I got the biggest one in there, it bit well - I was sure it was finally going to turn........... and the stud extractor snapped.

That bolt isn't undoing - especially since there is now half a stud extractor stuck in the head.

So tomorrow, the plumber will use brute force, and we'll hope that is a simple solution.

[miroku1]

The Allen bolt should come out it just tightens down into a recess on a horizontal bolt , which is what holds the pan back to the wall . You need to remove the silicon round the pan , give the pan a shake to loosen it then undo bolt , pretty straightforward usually

[Yabu]

davek_964 said:

That's what it will come to.

Since posting, the plumber has changed plans and will come tomorrow. My wife decided that the bolt WOULD come out, and I should spend my evening trying..........

Attacking from below isn't possible - the thread the bolt screws into is just too far away from the bottom of the toilet.

My borescope showed that an alternative approach might work - instead of removing the bolt that holds the toilet to the mount - why not undo the bolt holding the toilet to the cistern?
But that didn't work - the extra thread is too long for a normal 19mm socket to get to the nut, and there isn't enough space to get a long socket in there (even if I had a deep 19mm socket). Aha I thought - 19mm ring spanner......... but no, because the bottom of the toilet sticks out and you can't get the ring spanner on the nut.

So, back to attacking from the top. Wife insisted I try to break the plastic surround from the bolt - which I eventually managed to do with a drill. She believed I'd be able to get mole grips in there - which I knew I wouldn't (and was now able to prove this) - and I did point out that even if I could, we'd have no leverage.

But - I did manage to drill enough of a hole in the bolt that I could get my stud extractor in there. I got the biggest one in there, it bit well - I was sure it was finally going to turn........... and the stud extractor snapped.

That bolt isn't undoing - especially since there is now half a stud extractor stuck in the head.

So tomorrow, the plumber will use brute force, and we'll hope that is a simple solution.

Deep socket usable still ?

A box spanner or a pass through socket set/Halfords vortex socket set might be another option if you try again before a plumber