Limit and risks to accepting a Faster payment for car sale
Discussion
I'm possibly selling a car of mine assuming the buyer is happy upon arrival. He's travelling from 4 hours away so the plan is to drive up, inspect and pay on the same day which happens to be a Sunday.
I've read conflicting information online, but my 2 questions are .. assuming no claim of fraud is made by the buyer - Can a faster payment be reversed? I've read online horror stories of banks reversing the transaction after a car is released as they felt its a fraudulent transaction. This is after doing their pre-transfer checks.
secondly , is there a limit to these types of payments daily? I've read £25k is the limit, but can multiple payments be sent on the same day?
Car is just shy of £40k if any relevance.
Happy to hear any advice.
My thoughts are to have receipt ready printed, take a photo of the buyers driving license, and maybe even one of him collecting the car? Proof in case a fraud case is opened.
I've read conflicting information online, but my 2 questions are .. assuming no claim of fraud is made by the buyer - Can a faster payment be reversed? I've read online horror stories of banks reversing the transaction after a car is released as they felt its a fraudulent transaction. This is after doing their pre-transfer checks.
secondly , is there a limit to these types of payments daily? I've read £25k is the limit, but can multiple payments be sent on the same day?
Car is just shy of £40k if any relevance.
Happy to hear any advice.
My thoughts are to have receipt ready printed, take a photo of the buyers driving license, and maybe even one of him collecting the car? Proof in case a fraud case is opened.
Id ask him to confirm he / his bank is able to transfer that amount on a Sunday, thats not normal in my experience.
Id be suggesting the sale would be conditional upon the V5 being put in his name and the detail matching that of a driving licence.
id then be preparing 2 contracts of sale to be signed by you both to cover the transaction.
Presumably the car is free from finance and yours to sell and the individual buying is a private buyer, as opposed to a trader?
Yes I'm a private individual and so is he. Car is owned outright as i purchased it cash and is HPI clear obviously too.
I'll mention to him my concern regarding the amount if it the case that its above the threshold once a few more replies come in. He may already have a plan in place but it only occurred to me today whilst sorting through my paperwork as i found my invoice where i had to pay half & half the next day as it was above the limit. Wasn't a issue for me as i purchased locally from a dealer.
I'll mention to him my concern regarding the amount if it the case that its above the threshold once a few more replies come in. He may already have a plan in place but it only occurred to me today whilst sorting through my paperwork as i found my invoice where i had to pay half & half the next day as it was above the limit. Wasn't a issue for me as i purchased locally from a dealer.
Maximum daily transfer will be £25k or thereabouts. If you do the payment where you put the numbers and the name and the check it does there matches the Bank account name, once it has gone in it can not be reversed. It can take up to 2 hours to do checks. It's usually instant, assuming there are no markers on either account.
The person paying, and doing the name check, will get a message saying its not reversible, funds can not be recalled.
The person paying, and doing the name check, will get a message saying its not reversible, funds can not be recalled.
The faster payments system by definition will almost always have a higher level of internal checks especially as that higher end of the limit which as you say is “ usually “ £25k.
Whether you can make 2 such fp ‘s in quick succession I know not but logic might also suggest that if one doesn’t attract potential delaying checks the other may well ?
Couple this with a Sunday transactional need and potentially I can see issues and added stress - for both of you.
I think at this stage I would be voicing said concerns to the potential buyer just to gauge their reaction.
Whether you can make 2 such fp ‘s in quick succession I know not but logic might also suggest that if one doesn’t attract potential delaying checks the other may well ?
Couple this with a Sunday transactional need and potentially I can see issues and added stress - for both of you.
I think at this stage I would be voicing said concerns to the potential buyer just to gauge their reaction.
Faster Payments can be done on a Sunday without any issue IME. However if you're setting up a New Payee and then immediately making a large payment to them that might cause some issues. In this case the bank would phone your buyer to make sure he knows what he's doing before they release the money.
In terms of "can the transaction be reversed?" the answer to that is "Yes, any transaction can be reversed if the bank think there's sufficient evidence that it should be reversed". However in my experience they normally freeze the account or put the money into suspense until the investigation is complete. We had an issue where we paid £500k to the wrong supplier and it took an age (and the threat of legal action against the recipient) before the money was returned to us. However the payer cannot reverse the transaction on their own, they need the bank's agreement. So if you can provide enough evidence that the transaction is legitimate they shouldn't reverse it.
In terms of "can the transaction be reversed?" the answer to that is "Yes, any transaction can be reversed if the bank think there's sufficient evidence that it should be reversed". However in my experience they normally freeze the account or put the money into suspense until the investigation is complete. We had an issue where we paid £500k to the wrong supplier and it took an age (and the threat of legal action against the recipient) before the money was returned to us. However the payer cannot reverse the transaction on their own, they need the bank's agreement. So if you can provide enough evidence that the transaction is legitimate they shouldn't reverse it.
I bought a car privately for £90K +
The way we agreed to do it was to both go into one of my bank's branch close to the seller's home.
I did a faster payment in the branch after the clerk made sure "I" knew what I was purchasing and was happy to proceed.
The emphasis being on the person purchasing as opposed to the seller.
"A bit anxiety provoking' because I hadn't actually seen the car on the day of the transaction,
The seller saw the transaction had taken place and viewed their bank app to see that.
I had the clerk in front of me to see the purchase completed.
[As an aside, Faster Payment says transaction should be completed in 2 hours. I've had another faster payment checked after a Main Dealer said they hadn't received payment and was astonished to see that from "my confirm" to the money landing in their account took something like 0.07 seconds. That's 0.07 not 0.7].
We went back to the seller's house. The car was there! and it all ended happily.
No appointment was necessary, we knew prior that we just could walk in.
I hope this gives you some actual experience to consider with your own sale.
Just to add, my anxiety / concern was the buyer making a faster payment at the seller's house and the payment stalling for some reason. If that happened I wasn't sure what we would do, from both points of view. On behalf of the OP and myself, I'd be interested to know any others actual experiences.
markiii said:
word of warning
I did just that paying for a car, £1 went through
main payment got stopped
apparently the £1 is something fraudsters typically do to see if gets through
That makes sense. Nobody actually pays £1 in the normal course of business.I did just that paying for a car, £1 went through
main payment got stopped
apparently the £1 is something fraudsters typically do to see if gets through
So why not have him pay £50 or some odd amount like £57.22 which looks legit - obviously he gets back if he doesn't like the car?
markiii said:
word of warning
I did just that paying for a car, £1 went through
main payment got stopped
apparently the £1 is something fraudsters typically do to see if gets through
Hopefully he will have a back up plan if such a thing happens . I'm free any day of the week, but he wants to do a Sunday which isn't ideal. Car won't be released until payment hits but I don't want the guy having a wasted journey if possible. I did just that paying for a car, £1 went through
main payment got stopped
apparently the £1 is something fraudsters typically do to see if gets through
If it was me I'd definitely be doing a weekday.
RGG said:
I bought a car privately for £90K +
The way we agreed to do it was to both go into one of my bank's branch close to the seller's home.
I did a faster payment in the branch after the clerk made sure "I" knew what I was purchasing and was happy to proceed.
The emphasis being on the person purchasing as opposed to the seller.
"A bit anxiety provoking' because I hadn't actually seen the car on the day of the transaction,
The seller saw the transaction had taken place and viewed their bank app to see that.
I had the clerk in front of me to see the purchase completed.
[As an aside, Faster Payment says transaction should be completed in 2 hours. I've had another faster payment checked after a Main Dealer said they hadn't received payment and was astonished to see that from "my confirm" to the money landing in their account took something like 0.07 seconds. That's 0.07 not 0.7].
We went back to the seller's house. The car was there! and it all ended happily.
No appointment was necessary, we knew prior that we just could walk in.
I hope this gives you some actual experience to consider with your own sale.
Just to add, my anxiety / concern was the buyer making a faster payment at the seller's house and the payment stalling for some reason. If that happened I wasn't sure what we would do, from both points of view. On behalf of the OP and myself, I'd be interested to know any others actual experiences.
cheers for the reply. Yes it would be less stressful if it was a weekday. I've voiced my concern to him , so let see if he can do a weekday or even book a cheap hotel for the night. The way we agreed to do it was to both go into one of my bank's branch close to the seller's home.
I did a faster payment in the branch after the clerk made sure "I" knew what I was purchasing and was happy to proceed.
The emphasis being on the person purchasing as opposed to the seller.
"A bit anxiety provoking' because I hadn't actually seen the car on the day of the transaction,
The seller saw the transaction had taken place and viewed their bank app to see that.
I had the clerk in front of me to see the purchase completed.
[As an aside, Faster Payment says transaction should be completed in 2 hours. I've had another faster payment checked after a Main Dealer said they hadn't received payment and was astonished to see that from "my confirm" to the money landing in their account took something like 0.07 seconds. That's 0.07 not 0.7].
We went back to the seller's house. The car was there! and it all ended happily.
No appointment was necessary, we knew prior that we just could walk in.
I hope this gives you some actual experience to consider with your own sale.
Just to add, my anxiety / concern was the buyer making a faster payment at the seller's house and the payment stalling for some reason. If that happened I wasn't sure what we would do, from both points of view. On behalf of the OP and myself, I'd be interested to know any others actual experiences.
d8mok said:
RGG said:
I bought a car privately for £90K +
The way we agreed to do it was to both go into one of my bank's branch close to the seller's home.
I did a faster payment in the branch after the clerk made sure "I" knew what I was purchasing and was happy to proceed.
The emphasis being on the person purchasing as opposed to the seller.
"A bit anxiety provoking' because I hadn't actually seen the car on the day of the transaction,
The seller saw the transaction had taken place and viewed their bank app to see that.
I had the clerk in front of me to see the purchase completed.
[As an aside, Faster Payment says transaction should be completed in 2 hours. I've had another faster payment checked after a Main Dealer said they hadn't received payment and was astonished to see that from "my confirm" to the money landing in their account took something like 0.07 seconds. That's 0.07 not 0.7].
We went back to the seller's house. The car was there! and it all ended happily.
No appointment was necessary, we knew prior that we just could walk in.
I hope this gives you some actual experience to consider with your own sale.
Just to add, my anxiety / concern was the buyer making a faster payment at the seller's house and the payment stalling for some reason. If that happened I wasn't sure what we would do, from both points of view. On behalf of the OP and myself, I'd be interested to know any others actual experiences.
cheers for the reply. Yes it would be less stressful if it was a weekday. I've voiced my concern to him , so let see if he can do a weekday or even book a cheap hotel for the night. The way we agreed to do it was to both go into one of my bank's branch close to the seller's home.
I did a faster payment in the branch after the clerk made sure "I" knew what I was purchasing and was happy to proceed.
The emphasis being on the person purchasing as opposed to the seller.
"A bit anxiety provoking' because I hadn't actually seen the car on the day of the transaction,
The seller saw the transaction had taken place and viewed their bank app to see that.
I had the clerk in front of me to see the purchase completed.
[As an aside, Faster Payment says transaction should be completed in 2 hours. I've had another faster payment checked after a Main Dealer said they hadn't received payment and was astonished to see that from "my confirm" to the money landing in their account took something like 0.07 seconds. That's 0.07 not 0.7].
We went back to the seller's house. The car was there! and it all ended happily.
No appointment was necessary, we knew prior that we just could walk in.
I hope this gives you some actual experience to consider with your own sale.
Just to add, my anxiety / concern was the buyer making a faster payment at the seller's house and the payment stalling for some reason. If that happened I wasn't sure what we would do, from both points of view. On behalf of the OP and myself, I'd be interested to know any others actual experiences.
Transfer the whole amount in one go, my 90K went straight through.
See his passport/license - proof of address. and bank card the money is coming from.
Once you've got it in you account, that's it.
If for any unlikely reason it stalls, the car is not released and make that implicit.
Monday is the following day, so the hotel idea is sound - inconvenient for both, but both will be safe if a bank visit or bank telephone calls are necessary.
I think the risk on the buyer's side - transferring 40K and ending up with a stolen / cat car etc. Which is not the case with yourselves.
Once the money is in your account, you are free to transfer it to another account and that's what I would do.
Just to add, the £1 thing was around at the beginning but is now a fraud alert.
I wouldn't worry about a stop on a payment - if there is an issue with the transfer you have phone support from your bank 24/7 (at least I don't know of a retail bank that doesn't). A faster payment will be automated, so I don't think it makes any difference which day of the week it is - if the payment gets flagged you'll have the same customer service available to verify.
Its been a few years, but I don't recall there being a way to reverse a faster or regular 3 day BACS payment, so the only way it could be reversed is you (or someone with access to your account) making another transaction.
What the seller could do is call customer service and warn them that he's planning a large purchase, that way if payments do get flagged there would be notes against his account.
Its been a few years, but I don't recall there being a way to reverse a faster or regular 3 day BACS payment, so the only way it could be reversed is you (or someone with access to your account) making another transaction.
What the seller could do is call customer service and warn them that he's planning a large purchase, that way if payments do get flagged there would be notes against his account.
Couldn’t he just ring the bank a few days before he arrives, clear and confirm with his bank that £40k transfer can be done on the day? If it doesn’t work and you don’t get the money he doesn’t get the car. It is his responsibility to ensure that he can transfer the money on the day into your account.
I just remembered what I did when I sold a car in 2020 . It was around £30K
The Buyer paid me the full amount into my account about two days before she came to collect the car . It was on the understanding I would return it should she not take the car on the day .
Just a matter of trust on her part , however as we had already met when she viewed the car and she clearly knew where I lived ,had met my dogs and wife , she was fine to do this .
She collected on a Sunday .
As I type I recall, I did exactly the same on Caravan sale but that's a bit less Piston heads to admit , also collected at a weekend
The Buyer paid me the full amount into my account about two days before she came to collect the car . It was on the understanding I would return it should she not take the car on the day .
Just a matter of trust on her part , however as we had already met when she viewed the car and she clearly knew where I lived ,had met my dogs and wife , she was fine to do this .
She collected on a Sunday .
As I type I recall, I did exactly the same on Caravan sale but that's a bit less Piston heads to admit , also collected at a weekend
Henry Cat said:
Maximum daily transfer will be £25k or thereabouts.
It is totally dependent on the sender's bank, and can be set at any level up to the scheme limit of £1,000,000. If the buyer asks, his bank will tell him what his limit it.
What the buyer can't control is whether the transaction will be held up for fraud checks and, if it is, how long it will take to get it released (which could well be much longer at a weekend/outside working hours).
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