NC ITB's vs supercharged?
Discussion
Hi Guys
I had a NA that was turbo'd and fantastic. Made the mistake of wanting something faster so I sold it. I've had several cars since but miss the NA.
As much as I'd like to get another NA I want to do some Euro road trips and think AC and Cruise would be really handy so looking at getting a NC.
The standard car is a bit too slow so im thinking of getting either the BBR super 225 (ITB) setup or the BBR stage 1 supercharger setup but can't decide which to go for?
I've had a drive of the supercharged demonstrator car that was great but can't help thinking the ITB setup may be more suitable as I like revving the engine out on B roads and track days.
I'm hoping somebody here may have had drives of either and ideally both to give a good account of the feel of each?
Thanks
I had a NA that was turbo'd and fantastic. Made the mistake of wanting something faster so I sold it. I've had several cars since but miss the NA.
As much as I'd like to get another NA I want to do some Euro road trips and think AC and Cruise would be really handy so looking at getting a NC.
The standard car is a bit too slow so im thinking of getting either the BBR super 225 (ITB) setup or the BBR stage 1 supercharger setup but can't decide which to go for?
I've had a drive of the supercharged demonstrator car that was great but can't help thinking the ITB setup may be more suitable as I like revving the engine out on B roads and track days.
I'm hoping somebody here may have had drives of either and ideally both to give a good account of the feel of each?
Thanks
I cant help much but ive deliberated on this myself as i fancied doing a conversion.
It is a tough choice tbh but personally i think the Suoercharged route would make for such a great car.
Obviously the ITB route would suit you if you liked the noise but i have read of a few issues with the BBR conversion and their after care service is somewhat lacking.
It is a tough choice tbh but personally i think the Suoercharged route would make for such a great car.
Obviously the ITB route would suit you if you liked the noise but i have read of a few issues with the BBR conversion and their after care service is somewhat lacking.
Not directly comparable, but I DIY fitted the BBR stage 2 turbo kit to my NC back in 2017. I found BBR's aftercare excellent - several different ecu maps provided following logging of the ecu data to make sure it was optimised for my engine. I had one issue after about 4 months where the weld attaching the tailpipe to the rear silencer box failed. Silencer box and tailpipe trim (which was damaged after bouncing down the road) both replaced without quibble.
I've done about 16,000 miles since then without a single issue, and the car's an absolute hoot to drive. I normally get bored of car's quite quickly, but I still love driving this.
Dave
I've done about 16,000 miles since then without a single issue, and the car's an absolute hoot to drive. I normally get bored of car's quite quickly, but I still love driving this.
Dave
I had a stage 1 BBR supercharger fitted to my NC2 a couple of years ago as I found the standard car to be too slow.
I went with the supercharger over the BBR Super 200/225 conversion as there's quite a big different in power/torque, particularly with the 225 where the cost is similar. And I'm not so interested in revving out the engine.
I didn't consider a turbo as I wanted to do some track days.
The extra power added by the supercharger increases linearly with revs, so the supercharged version feels very similar to the standard car, just more power whilst sounding a bit meatier - I've got a decat BBR manifold, with the rest of the exhaust standard.
One point to note about ITBs is that they may exceed noise levels for some tracks.
From various Facebook posts, I created torque & power charts for various BBR conversions, and the two original Corten-Miller supercharger conversions to give some approximate comparisons - these might be of interest to you.
Torque:
Power:
I went with the supercharger over the BBR Super 200/225 conversion as there's quite a big different in power/torque, particularly with the 225 where the cost is similar. And I'm not so interested in revving out the engine.
I didn't consider a turbo as I wanted to do some track days.
The extra power added by the supercharger increases linearly with revs, so the supercharged version feels very similar to the standard car, just more power whilst sounding a bit meatier - I've got a decat BBR manifold, with the rest of the exhaust standard.
One point to note about ITBs is that they may exceed noise levels for some tracks.
From various Facebook posts, I created torque & power charts for various BBR conversions, and the two original Corten-Miller supercharger conversions to give some approximate comparisons - these might be of interest to you.
Torque:
Power:
Having run a supercharged Mk1 for a number of years i think given the choice again I'd go for TB's.
I like their simplicity and in terms of bang for your bucks they really do make sense.
If you're after more power then changing the cams should see to that.
However if you're after the whine you cant beat a supercharger.
I like their simplicity and in terms of bang for your bucks they really do make sense.
If you're after more power then changing the cams should see to that.
However if you're after the whine you cant beat a supercharger.
A good friend of mine bought an NC and put Meister R club race coilovers, poly bushes and race pads on it.
(By way of validating my opinion… I have raced sports cars for more than 25 years with some success in various Radical championships )
Anyway we drove it at Bedford with standard engine. Terrific little car, clearly rear wheel drive with a lovely balance, amazing braking, and really rewarding to chase driving improvements… but probably too much grip for the power
He then added BBR200 and we went back to Bedford . Although unofficial lap times would confirm it is quicker, the BBR 200 kit still does not have enough mid range power to make the car any more fun. The data logger showed the vmax for BBR200 was only 3mph higher than standard..
So he took it back to BBR for stage 2 supercharger. And now it’s got enough torque to be steered on the throttle in 2nd and third gear. It’s not a tyre shredding monster but is night and day better than the BBR200.
So while the BBR200 dyno charts all look good, and even the lap times are improved, it still is too underpowered for track day tyres and good suspension. ITBs will not provide big slugs of midrange…which is what the car needs to become truly playful.
Having just bought my own road / track day NC I will not spend any money on tuning it…I will upgrade coilovers pads and leave it.. if you want to transform the way the car drives on track and have the budget then super charging is the way to go…
Don’t have any video of the supercharged car as it was way way too loud for Bedford and we got thrown off after one lap.
https://youtu.be/WDJoZ9TvJyk. Standard engine
https://youtu.be/PtX1dfpxxj0 BBR200
(By way of validating my opinion… I have raced sports cars for more than 25 years with some success in various Radical championships )
Anyway we drove it at Bedford with standard engine. Terrific little car, clearly rear wheel drive with a lovely balance, amazing braking, and really rewarding to chase driving improvements… but probably too much grip for the power
He then added BBR200 and we went back to Bedford . Although unofficial lap times would confirm it is quicker, the BBR 200 kit still does not have enough mid range power to make the car any more fun. The data logger showed the vmax for BBR200 was only 3mph higher than standard..
So he took it back to BBR for stage 2 supercharger. And now it’s got enough torque to be steered on the throttle in 2nd and third gear. It’s not a tyre shredding monster but is night and day better than the BBR200.
So while the BBR200 dyno charts all look good, and even the lap times are improved, it still is too underpowered for track day tyres and good suspension. ITBs will not provide big slugs of midrange…which is what the car needs to become truly playful.
Having just bought my own road / track day NC I will not spend any money on tuning it…I will upgrade coilovers pads and leave it.. if you want to transform the way the car drives on track and have the budget then super charging is the way to go…
Don’t have any video of the supercharged car as it was way way too loud for Bedford and we got thrown off after one lap.
https://youtu.be/WDJoZ9TvJyk. Standard engine
https://youtu.be/PtX1dfpxxj0 BBR200
This will sound defensive.., but .. That driver has won a ton of races and championships. The combination rear tyres that were down to 1mm tread and very stiff Meister R coilovers with way too much preload at the rear made it very edgy on the day.
This is the same driver in a different MX5 on another day
https://youtu.be/V8zPsujCDR0
Less grip , more fun
This is the same driver in a different MX5 on another day
https://youtu.be/V8zPsujCDR0
Less grip , more fun
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