How would you rate the current drivers against each other

[rich861]

1. Verstappen - Even when he hasn't had the best car he seems to find his way to first place. He's operating on another level and the deltas to his team mate are Senna-esque. Hopefully we'll see him under pressure again soon as historically he has done some weird things.

2. Norris - Proven himself now. Consistently gets the better of very good teammates and seems to be able to pull pace out of the car that shouldn't be there.

3. Leclerc, Piastri, Russell - Seriously quick, but not always. Piastri still has potential to improve even further.

6. Hamilton - It's tight margins but he looks to have degraded pace wise. I don't see him fairing well next year against Leclerc in qualifying or race. I hope he proves me wrong and wins the whole thing. For me he is still the goat.

7. Alonso - I had him top 3 recently, maybe even number 1. He also appears to have lost a bit of speed recently.

8. Sainz - I'm surprised Red Bull and Mercedes haven't gone after him as he looks to be the ideal teammate. Hasn't got a massive ego, fast (sometimes the fastest on track) and experienced.

9. Albon - Great race craft and pace. Hasn't put a foot wrong recently from what I can remember.

10. Tsunoda - Deserves a shot in a better car at this point.

I'm sure I'll get pulled apart for my list, but I'm interested to see what the consensus is on the current drivers.

[SlowWinter]

Agree with this. I do think that Piastri may catch a few of the others quickly. He has been fairly unlucky in a few races and I'm not sure his current league position is a reflection of what he's capable of. Also Max is really starting to come under pressure for wins now, but he is handling it really well. I for one am actually excited to see how this season plays out as the McLaren , Ferrari and maybe even Mercedes start to close the gap to that Red Bull. Hopefully see a few different Grand Prix winners this season

[Paul671]

Fair summary but I would swap Russell and Norris in that list. Russell would beat Norris in the same car, he's much more ruthless and eager for success. Norris too nice a chap to ever be that good.

[Castellet]

Albon is a hard one to judge.
Had a difficult time at RB and is probably pushing the Williams to it and his ability.

[kambites]

Not a bad summary although personally:

I'd put Norris in with Russell and Leclerc in that sort of "joint second place". Norris has been the more consistent the last few races but the Mclaren looks an easier car to extract the best out of across a mix of conditions than the Mercedes or Ferrari at the moment.

Because of the above, I'd put Piastri a half-step further back. He's going to be bloody good with a bit more experience (I think probably better than Norris, ultimately), but right now he doesn't quite have the race pace of the other top drivers.

I'd put Sainz a bit higher up the list, probably on a par with Piastri.

Albon, Tsunoda and Alonso are impossible to judge because they don't have a good benchmark teammate. Hamilton just looks like he's treading water waiting for Ferrari.

[riskyj]

Paul671 said:

Russell would beat Norris in the same car, he's much more ruthless and eager for success.

I don’t see him as ‘ruthless’ or ‘eager’. Reckless and error-prone more like.

[Jimjimhim]

riskyj said:

Paul671 said:

Russell would beat Norris in the same car, he's much more ruthless and eager for success.

I don’t see him as ‘ruthless’ or ‘eager’. Reckless and error-prone more like.

I think he's trying too hard, I also think he would be faster if he put less pressure on himself.

Put them in the same car and I think Norris would win most of the time.

[parabolica]

S Tier: Max, Lewis, Alonso - championships speak for themselves and they each undoubtedly still have what it takes to be competitive

A Tier: Lando, Charles, Carlos, Oscar, George, Alex - each will be with us a while yet and all show signs of potential WDC

B Tier: Yuki, Pierre, Stroll, Bottas, Mag, Hulk - on their best days pretty fast and can handle themselves wheel-to-wheel, but all are error prone (not so much Bottas but now he's not in a competitive car the best he can hope for is a race where he has better pace than these other guys)

C Tier: Ocon (temper) Ricc, Perez (both washed) Zhou (uncompetitive compared to team mate but would be good to see what he could do in a decent car) Logan (uncompetitive in and in a decent car)

[SoulGlo]

I don't rate Albon as highly as most.

He's had some great drives in the Williams over the years but he's yet to be up against a decent teammate. I wanna see him up against a Gasly/Ocon/Bottas over a whole season. They all race winners.

With a bit of luck he could've had at least one win when he was at Red Bull. (weren't they both ruined with collisions with Lewis?)

Can he handle the pressure?

He still bins the car occasionally and he's not a rookie anymore.



I see him more of a strong back up number 2 at the top team.

[NRS]

Jimjimhim said:

riskyj said:

Paul671 said:

Russell would beat Norris in the same car, he's much more ruthless and eager for success.

I don’t see him as ‘ruthless’ or ‘eager’. Reckless and error-prone more like.

I think he's trying too hard, I also think he would be faster if he put less pressure on himself.

Put them in the same car and I think Norris would win most of the time.

Norris has been mistake-prone when it counts too, there's partly a reason why he's not won races until the other month. Mostly for the car, but when he has had the chances mostly they have not worked out - wet Spa for example, last week safety car and so on. He's still a great driver, but someone like Max would almost always take those rare chances.

[SmoothCriminal]

Not sure how Albon is seen as wdc material when he has won nothing of merit in his whole career was binned off by redbull and only brought back because they had no one else then he cracked under the pressure. The only way he will win a wdc is like Button did. "British" blinkers no doubt.

I really rate George even if he is unlikeable but let's see how he gets on next year when he hasn't got access to Lewis data like he did at Canada.

[Bo_apex]

SmoothCriminal said:

Not sure how Albon is seen as wdc material when he has won nothing of merit in his whole career was binned off by redbull and only brought back because they had no one else then he cracked under the pressure. The only way he will win a wdc is like Button did. "British" blinkers no doubt.

I really rate George even if he is unlikeable but let's see how he gets on next year when he hasn't got access to Lewis data like he did at Canada.

Is data sharing not a 2 way street ?

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/why-f1-team-mat...

[SmoothCriminal]

Bo_apex said:

Is data sharing not a 2 way street ?

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/why-f1-team-mat...

Possibly but if it's only one driver gaining from the sharing then it's still one way.


George himself said he delved deep into Lewis data as he was so fast in practice and low and behold in quali George is faster.

[deadslow]

SmoothCriminal said:

Possibly but if it's only one driver gaining from the sharing then it's still one way.


George himself said he delved deep into Lewis data as he was so fast in practice and low and behold in quali George is faster.

Are you saying George is better able to understand Hamilton's data than Hamilton himself?

[kambites]

NRS said:

Norris has been mistake-prone when it counts too, there's partly a reason why he's not won races until the other month. Mostly for the car, but when he has had the chances mostly they have not worked out - wet Spa for example, last week safety car and so on. He's still a great driver, but someone like Max would almost always take those rare chances.

I think there's a natural step (almost) all drivers have to make from performing well in the midfield to the pressure of competing for race wins and championships. Russell and Norris are both making that transition at the moment but Norris has a few races' head-start and, for the moment at least, a better car to do it in.

One thing that's clear in my mind is that F1 currently has a crop of drivers in Verstappen, Norris, Russell, Leclerc, etc. who utterly eclipse anything we've ever seen before in terms of strength in depth from a single generation.

Edited by kambites on Friday 14th June 17:29

[Jimjimhim]

NRS said:

Jimjimhim said:

riskyj said:

Paul671 said:

Russell would beat Norris in the same car, he's much more ruthless and eager for success.

I don’t see him as ‘ruthless’ or ‘eager’. Reckless and error-prone more like.

I think he's trying too hard, I also think he would be faster if he put less pressure on himself.

Put them in the same car and I think Norris would win most of the time.

Norris has been mistake-prone when it counts too, there's partly a reason why he's not won races until the other month. Mostly for the car, but when he has had the chances mostly they have not worked out - wet Spa for example, last week safety car and so on. He's still a great driver, but someone like Max would almost always take those rare chances.

Yes he probably would. It's a shame that Red Bull won't pair him with a fast driver, then we would really know how good he is or isn't.

[Bo_apex]

deadslow said:

SmoothCriminal said:

Possibly but if it's only one driver gaining from the sharing then it's still one way.


George himself said he delved deep into Lewis data as he was so fast in practice and low and behold in quali George is faster.

Are you saying George is better able to understand Hamilton's data than Hamilton himself?

[kambites]

deadslow said:

Are you saying George is better able to understand Hamilton's data than Hamilton himself?

It wouldn't be a surprise if George is better able to learn from Hamilton's data than Hamilton is. The question isn't why Russell can learn from where Hamilton is faster, but why Hamilton can't learn from where Russell is faster... I'm fairly sure the answer at the moment is "Hamilton really can't be arsed". However good he is at his best; and he is very, very good; he's always tended to let his form drop off when he doesn't feel he's fighting for anything worthwhile.

Put Hamilton in a fight for a title and I think he's probably still about the best there is. Put him anywhere else and he can be a bit mediocre.

Edited by kambites on Friday 14th June 18:41