Secondhand car price crash? (Vol. 2)

Secondhand car price crash? (Vol. 2)

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Discussion

Scrump

Original Poster:

22,936 posts

165 months

macron

10,777 posts

173 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
In!

Vauxhall this morning, no crash, just dumbass list prices no one pays.







Edited by macron on Sunday 24th March 10:49

clockworks

6,134 posts

152 months

Sunday 24th March
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I was looking at used XC40s 5/6 months ago. BEV versions were advertised on Autotrader at £5k+ more than PHEV models. I bought a 21 plate T5 plug-in for £30k.

I was looking a couple of days ago, and the PHEV versions have dropped by a grand or two for the same reg date - pretty much normal depreciation.
The BEV models are now priced very close to the plug-in hybrids - a big drop.

Moorlandman

22 posts

58 months

Sunday 24th March
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I have seen no evidence of any sort of 2nd hand price crash if we exclude electric cars. My VW's have seen next to no depreciation in the last 12 months - I have a VW Tiguan,VW Golf & a VW UP!

My neighbour says he has lost a fortune on his 2022 Tesla M3 - said he paid £50k but its only worth £25k now but he has saved a fair bit on fuel and tax.

Auto810graphy

1,525 posts

99 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
Moorlandman said:
I have seen no evidence of any sort of 2nd hand price crash if we exclude electric cars. My VW's have seen next to no depreciation in the last 12 months - I have a VW Tiguan,VW Golf & a VW UP!

My neighbour says he has lost a fortune on his 2022 Tesla M3 - said he paid £50k but its only worth £25k now but he has saved a fair bit on fuel and tax.
Most VW product is dropping off in the trade, Golf Mk8 is loosing the most, they just seem overpriced on the used market.

AlexNJ89

2,833 posts

86 months

Sunday 24th March
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Has the prestige and sports car market stabilised yet?

AlexNJ89

2,833 posts

86 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
A question for the dealers. Is WBAC a good indication of what a car will sell for at a BCA auction?

SFTWend

1,036 posts

82 months

Sunday 24th March
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AlexNJ89 said:
Has the prestige and sports car market stabilised yet?
I can tell you that, after taking a tumble in Q4, facelift F Type 575 Jags are, unfortunately, recovering nicely. Maybe because they have stopped making them and nearly new looked amazing value compared to list.

Auto810graphy

1,525 posts

99 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
AlexNJ89 said:
A question for the dealers. Is WBAC a good indication of what a car will sell for at a BCA auction?
Not really, WBAC present their bid, when it hits the auction there are multiple bidders. Some oddball stuff makes thousands over CAP clean where are WBAC tend to start their offers around this number.

Auto810graphy

1,525 posts

99 months

Sunday 24th March
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We valued a 2019 Vantage for a customer a few months back, somehow it’s gone up £3k since then. He has actually lost less than £20k in value since buying it new on a supported PCP

ACCYSTAN

1,030 posts

128 months

Sunday 24th March
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AlexNJ89 said:
A question for the dealers. Is WBAC a good indication of what a car will sell for at a BCA auction?
It depends but in theory every price WBAC offer will be lower than the auction price.

But there are markets within markets,
For example if WBAC offer to pay £3k for a fiesta, it will likely make more at auction
Why? Because the desirable run of the mill cars under £5k are in high demand.

Compared to say £30 grand for a Porsche 911, which may struggle to go much above £30k
Why? Because the sports car demand has not returned to post covid levels at current prices.

AlexNJ89

2,833 posts

86 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
ACCYSTAN said:
It depends but in theory every price WBAC offer will be lower than the auction price.

But there are markets within markets,
For example if WBAC offer to pay £3k for a fiesta, it will likely make more at auction
Why? Because the desirable run of the mill cars under £5k are in high demand.

Compared to say £30 grand for a Porsche 911, which may struggle to go much above £30k
Why? Because the sports car demand has not returned to post covid levels at current prices.
This makes perfect sense, thank you!

Sheepshanks

35,014 posts

126 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
macron said:
Vauxhall this morning, no crash, just dumbass list prices no one pays.

...by no means unusual, but note the Motability offer. There's loads of nominally £40K, nudging £50K EVs now available on Motability for no, or negligible, upfront payment. I know there's no VAT, but bearing in mind the deal includes 20K/miles per year, full insurance (getting expensive now on EVs) and maintenance, you've got to think manufacturers are selling these cars to Motability for absolutely buttons.

ACCYSTAN

1,030 posts

128 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
Disagree, manufacturers have a big mark up on EVs, but that was when supply was limited and demand was healthy.

Now there are lots of EV offerings and moderate demand, and EV list price correction has been underway for the past 6 months and will continue.

When one of the new Chinese manufacturers (not including MG) sets down a proper dealer network and car support in the UK, then we will really see some competition.

I expect it will be BYD , if they are serious about the UK they could be a real force and push the other manufacturers to continue to compete on price.

OutInTheShed

9,352 posts

33 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
ACCYSTAN said:
Disagree, manufacturers have a big mark up on EVs, but that was when supply was limited and demand was healthy.

Now there are lots of EV offerings and moderate demand, and EV list price correction has been underway for the past 6 months and will continue.

When one of the new Chinese manufacturers (not including MG) sets down a proper dealer network and car support in the UK, then we will really see some competition.

I expect it will be BYD , if they are serious about the UK they could be a real force and push the other manufacturers to continue to compete on price.
Nope, it's Honda, making the en-wotsit in Wuhan.

highway

2,052 posts

267 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
I came close to buying a 991.2 cab recently. Seller sold to WBAC. Car then appeared at BCA Walsall where it made less than they paid him for it. 66 plate car 11k miles. Had paint on the bonnet and rear.

irish boy

3,663 posts

243 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
In for another 1000 pages.

Theoldguard

858 posts

65 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
macron said:
In!

Vauxhall this morning, no crash, just dumbass list prices no one pays.







Edited by macron on Sunday 24th March 10:49
Doesn't feel that long ago we were being told discounts were a thing of the past and the new normal is you pay the ever increasing retail price, remember the £40k Astra. Manufacturers no longer needed to discount as they were all looking to reduce supply and increase the margins on the lower volume they produce.They suddenly all woke up and realised that all those years of expanding factories and range of vehicles was the wrong way to approach things and they should have stuck to a single small factory and sold those limited run of cars to the highest bidder.

Thing is now there are few manufacter who are not discounting , and some quite heavily. Even ditching their smaller cars in favour higher margin models seems to have been a mistake with it likely some will reverse that decision now the Chinese are bringing to market small, cheap EVs to fill that gap manufacturers have created and they kick off the Chinese are undercutting. You can't make it up.



Edited by Theoldguard on Sunday 24th March 22:00

Deep Thought

36,736 posts

204 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
Theoldguard said:
Doesn't feel that long ago we were being told discounts were a thing of the past and the new normal is you pay the ever increasing retail price, remember the £40k Astra. Manufacturers no longer needed to discount as they were all looking to reduce supply and increase the margins on the lower volume they produce.They suddenly all woke up and realised that all those years of expanding factories and range of vehicles was the wrong way to approach things and they should have stuck to a single small factory and sold those limited run of cars to the highest bidder.

Thing is now there are few manufacter who are not discounting , and some quite heavily. Even ditching their smaller cars in favour higher margin models seems to have been a mistake with it likely some will reverse that decision now the Chinese are bringing to market small, cheap EVs to fill that gap manufacturers have created and they kick off the Chinese are undercutting. You can't make it up.



Edited by Theoldguard on Sunday 24th March 22:00
Your memory appears somewhat hazy.

No one said discounts on all cars were going to be a thing of the past for ever.

No one said all manufacturers were going to stop chasing volume and concentrate on profit.

However -

Mercedes openly said they were stopping chasing volume and moving to selling less cars for more. They have done so.

BMW also openly said they were making less cars and making more profit. They have done so.

Ford said they were going to stop making the Fiesta because it wasnt profitable. They have done so.

Manufacturers ditching selling small cars did so precisely because they no longer wanted to compete in a market where they couldnt make money on cars. That is not going to change.

Manufacturers are abandoning the small car market precisely because the chinese are bringing cheap cars to it. They didnt abandon it and then the chinese decided to fill it. rolleyes

The volume sellers have continued to do what their name suggests - attempt to sell in volume.




Edited by Deep Thought on Sunday 24th March 22:20


Edited by Deep Thought on Sunday 24th March 22:20

Deep Thought

36,736 posts

204 months

Sunday 24th March
quotequote all
I wasnt going to bring it up but saying as some peoples memories seem to be getting somewhat hazy already - some of us have been saying for several years now that once the effects of Covid on the market had passed and we had supply returned on new cars we would see reasonably normal depreciation return, from the high of Covid prices.

On the last page of the previous thread someone asked "Can someone summarise the view of the current market please"

This was the last summary on the last page

ChrisH72 said:
There hasn't been a crash.

For mainstream cars, both ICE and EV, normal depreciation has returned which you'd expect now that supply of new cars is back to normal.

ICE performance cars at sensible money are holding firm on price. Many have been or are being discontinued and remain very desirable.

In general used car prices are much higher than they were before the madness.
Edited by Deep Thought on Sunday 24th March 22:29