Chimaera 450 vs 500
Discussion
Im in the market for a good example of a 450 or 500.
Apart from the obvious displacement difference, does anyone know what the other mechanical differences are between the two engines?
Does the 500 have racier cams than the 450?
Is the 500 harder to fettle in terms of ignition, fuelling, mapping etc?
I am obviously aware of the claimed bhp and torque differences claimed by TVR from new, but more interested in drivability differences. Ive heard that the 450 is the sweet spot in the 400/450/500 range - are people referring to the trade off between outright performance and smoothness/ drivability/ reliability?
Is the 450 noticeably smoother on light throttle, low revs town driving situations?
Is the 500’s performance margin over the 450s that noticeable when hard on the throttle?
Apart from the obvious displacement difference, does anyone know what the other mechanical differences are between the two engines?
Does the 500 have racier cams than the 450?
Is the 500 harder to fettle in terms of ignition, fuelling, mapping etc?
I am obviously aware of the claimed bhp and torque differences claimed by TVR from new, but more interested in drivability differences. Ive heard that the 450 is the sweet spot in the 400/450/500 range - are people referring to the trade off between outright performance and smoothness/ drivability/ reliability?
Is the 450 noticeably smoother on light throttle, low revs town driving situations?
Is the 500’s performance margin over the 450s that noticeable when hard on the throttle?
Edited by dg73 on Friday 1st December 12:15
I've had a 400 and now have a 450. I've driven a 500 and I didn't think there was much difference.
Ultimately, and I'm prepared to be corrected, the only difference is displacement.
I would suggest you drive all three variants, the 450 definitely has more 'go' than the 400 I had, and I don't think a 500 is worth the seemingly extra premium asked. But always, always buy on condition and history. A low mileage car may well have more niggles and issues than a higher mileage one. They like to be driven regularly. I would shy away from any car that hasn't had it's outriggers replaced by now. It's either a garage queen or it's rotten and about to need lots of money spent on it.
Ultimately, and I'm prepared to be corrected, the only difference is displacement.
I would suggest you drive all three variants, the 450 definitely has more 'go' than the 400 I had, and I don't think a 500 is worth the seemingly extra premium asked. But always, always buy on condition and history. A low mileage car may well have more niggles and issues than a higher mileage one. They like to be driven regularly. I would shy away from any car that hasn't had it's outriggers replaced by now. It's either a garage queen or it's rotten and about to need lots of money spent on it.
I've had 400, 450 & 500 (but mostly 500)
They are all old cars now, so it will all depend on the individual car.
When new, or in decent fettle, the 500 is a significantly faster car. The common knowledge says it's more fragile, but I've never had an issue with any. (But, other than my last one they were all newish).
All mine struggled with idling at some time or other, but I just ignored it. (Foot on brake & throttle when stopped).
Never modded any of mine, so can't comment. I think only 600 500s were ever made, so they are quite a rare beastie.
Which ever way you look at it they are all fun!
They are all old cars now, so it will all depend on the individual car.
When new, or in decent fettle, the 500 is a significantly faster car. The common knowledge says it's more fragile, but I've never had an issue with any. (But, other than my last one they were all newish).
All mine struggled with idling at some time or other, but I just ignored it. (Foot on brake & throttle when stopped).
Never modded any of mine, so can't comment. I think only 600 500s were ever made, so they are quite a rare beastie.
Which ever way you look at it they are all fun!
2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
I've had 400, 450 & 500 (but mostly 500)
They are all old cars now, so it will all depend on the individual car.
When new, or in decent fettle, the 500 is a significantly faster car. The common knowledge says it's more fragile, but I've never had an issue with any. (But, other than my last one they were all newish).
All mine struggled with idling at some time or other, but I just ignored it. (Foot on brake & throttle when stopped).
Never modded any of mine, so can't comment. I think only 600 500s were ever made, so they are quite a rare beastie.
Which ever way you look at it they are all fun!
So having had both, which would you choose again between 450 and 500? They are all old cars now, so it will all depend on the individual car.
When new, or in decent fettle, the 500 is a significantly faster car. The common knowledge says it's more fragile, but I've never had an issue with any. (But, other than my last one they were all newish).
All mine struggled with idling at some time or other, but I just ignored it. (Foot on brake & throttle when stopped).
Never modded any of mine, so can't comment. I think only 600 500s were ever made, so they are quite a rare beastie.
Which ever way you look at it they are all fun!
(Assume both cars in decent fettle/condition and disregarding price differences)
.ie does the 450 have better manners/ smoothness that more than makes up for the performance deficit vs the 500?
dg73 said:
2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
I've had 400, 450 & 500 (but mostly 500)
They are all old cars now, so it will all depend on the individual car.
When new, or in decent fettle, the 500 is a significantly faster car. The common knowledge says it's more fragile, but I've never had an issue with any. (But, other than my last one they were all newish).
All mine struggled with idling at some time or other, but I just ignored it. (Foot on brake & throttle when stopped).
Never modded any of mine, so can't comment. I think only 600 500s were ever made, so they are quite a rare beastie.
Which ever way you look at it they are all fun!
So having had both, which would you choose again between 450 and 500? They are all old cars now, so it will all depend on the individual car.
When new, or in decent fettle, the 500 is a significantly faster car. The common knowledge says it's more fragile, but I've never had an issue with any. (But, other than my last one they were all newish).
All mine struggled with idling at some time or other, but I just ignored it. (Foot on brake & throttle when stopped).
Never modded any of mine, so can't comment. I think only 600 500s were ever made, so they are quite a rare beastie.
Which ever way you look at it they are all fun!
(Assume both cars in decent fettle/condition and disregarding price differences)
.ie does the 450 have better manners/ smoothness that more than makes up for the performance deficit vs the 500?
Just gotta get out there and try as many as you fancy.
That's part of the fun of it.
I've got a 400, because I was trying to do it without spending a fortune, and bought a well restored car, though have still spent around £2k on it in a year or so of ownership. Some of it is my choice of upgrades on older consumables like HT leads, some of it on bits that would have lasted longer but I decided to change as they were starting to show proper wear (brake hydraulics).
I tried a 450, but it was Cat D, had the twin headlamp nose (not a fan) and was generally in poor condition. I couldn't tell a big enough difference to justify taking it on.
Also the first 400 I tried was an abomination, I very nearly packed up my teenage dream of owning one after that test drive.
Definitely down to the individual car and what state it's in.
That's part of the fun of it.
I've got a 400, because I was trying to do it without spending a fortune, and bought a well restored car, though have still spent around £2k on it in a year or so of ownership. Some of it is my choice of upgrades on older consumables like HT leads, some of it on bits that would have lasted longer but I decided to change as they were starting to show proper wear (brake hydraulics).
I tried a 450, but it was Cat D, had the twin headlamp nose (not a fan) and was generally in poor condition. I couldn't tell a big enough difference to justify taking it on.
Also the first 400 I tried was an abomination, I very nearly packed up my teenage dream of owning one after that test drive.
Definitely down to the individual car and what state it's in.
Belle427 said:
Depends how you like to drive too, they all command respect but the 500 with its extra torque can be a bit unruly in the wrong hands.
The 450 is seen as the strongest of the engines but harder to find.
Interesting. I'd say the 400 was the most common, then the 450 with 500s extremely rare?The 450 is seen as the strongest of the engines but harder to find.
2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
Belle427 said:
Depends how you like to drive too, they all command respect but the 500 with its extra torque can be a bit unruly in the wrong hands.
The 450 is seen as the strongest of the engines but harder to find.
Interesting. I'd say the 400 was the most common, then the 450 with 500s extremely rare?The 450 is seen as the strongest of the engines but harder to find.
I suppose the 500 is seen as the holy grail so most hold on to them.
2 sMoKiN bArReLs said:
Belle427 said:
Depends how you like to drive too, they all command respect but the 500 with its extra torque can be a bit unruly in the wrong hands.
The 450 is seen as the strongest of the engines but harder to find.
Interesting. I'd say the 400 was the most common, then the 450 with 500s extremely rare?The 450 is seen as the strongest of the engines but harder to find.
I love these cars...shame my body doesn't allow me to own one any more!
A good 500 is quicker, but how often can you use the preformace on todays Pot holed, Traffic ridden, Speed camera roads.
I currently own a late MK2 450 , that been fitted with Powers Performance MBE engine managment system. It runs like a dream and pulls from low revs with no issues even after 5 years.
Condition and history is key when you eventually find the car of your dreams.
I currently own a late MK2 450 , that been fitted with Powers Performance MBE engine managment system. It runs like a dream and pulls from low revs with no issues even after 5 years.
Condition and history is key when you eventually find the car of your dreams.
The difficulty is that the newest car will be over 20-years of age and how it drives will depend on how it's been used /abused / maintained.
I can't comment on which is smoother or whether there's any difference as I haven't driven a 450, but the consensus when they were current was that the 450 was a little 'smoother' and, in real-world driving, little different in overall performance. I've driven both smooth and 'rough/shunty' 500s over the years.
The previously quoted figure of c600 500s produced is the figure I've seen, no idea of the number of 450s, though the final 100 cars were all 450s.
You might have discounted it but there are far more Griff 500s about than Chimaera 500s, though a big gold neckchain is mandatory wear for the Griff and a lot of people don't like wearing them now they're 'more mature'. That's a matter for you
I can't comment on which is smoother or whether there's any difference as I haven't driven a 450, but the consensus when they were current was that the 450 was a little 'smoother' and, in real-world driving, little different in overall performance. I've driven both smooth and 'rough/shunty' 500s over the years.
The previously quoted figure of c600 500s produced is the figure I've seen, no idea of the number of 450s, though the final 100 cars were all 450s.
You might have discounted it but there are far more Griff 500s about than Chimaera 500s, though a big gold neckchain is mandatory wear for the Griff and a lot of people don't like wearing them now they're 'more mature'. That's a matter for you
A well known saleman form HHC i first met in 1984 said. On normal roads you wont notice the difference. You need a good open road or track & be a very good driver to notice the difference. So buy on condition & the feel from the seat of your pants. The final choice is colour.
With riding motorbikes i knew what he meant & went for the one my bum fealt better in. Oh & i did like the colour.
It was a 400 & i let Joolz ring its neck & he was a happy bunny. So my bum did not lie.
With riding motorbikes i knew what he meant & went for the one my bum fealt better in. Oh & i did like the colour.
It was a 400 & i let Joolz ring its neck & he was a happy bunny. So my bum did not lie.
fieryfred said:
A well known saleman form HHC i first met in 1984 said. On normal roads you wont notice the difference. You need a good open road or track & be a very good driver to notice the difference. So buy on condition & the feel from the seat of your pants. The final choice is colour.
With riding motorbikes i knew what he meant & went for the one my bum fealt better in. Oh & i did like the colour.
It was a 400 & i let Joolz ring its neck & he was a happy bunny. So my bum did not lie.
You can definitely notice the difference in acceleration. But, as you say, it depends how you like to drive. With riding motorbikes i knew what he meant & went for the one my bum fealt better in. Oh & i did like the colour.
It was a 400 & i let Joolz ring its neck & he was a happy bunny. So my bum did not lie.
100% condition is king all these years later.
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