potential mileage discrepancy on approved used BMW M car
Discussion
I was at my local BMW dealership the other week having a look at used M cars. Unfortunately, this particular showroom didn't have the model I was looking for within my budget. Before leaving the showroom, the salesman sat me down at his desk and said let me check our stock across other sites as they may have something. It turned out that a different site of theirs did have the ideal car, both spec and budget. The car was registered in Sept 2022 and the advertisement stated that the car had 7,721 miles on the clock (photo of odometer shows this too). I asked for more information on the car, the service history, number of previous owners, ex-demo/private owner etc. He was more than happy to oblige. Before sharing with me the service history on screen, the salesman advised that given a) the car has covered only 7,721 miles and b) it is still under 2 years old, this model of M car should have only 2 entries on it's service history: 1) the delivery inspection (or something to that effect) and 2) the running-in service at approx. 1,200 miles. When he shared the service history on screen, the aforementioned entries were indeed showing however there appeared to be an additional entry at 23,789 miles. Both the running-in service and the additional one at 23,789 were carried out at the dealership advertising the car. I immediately pointed this out to the salesman as the advertisement stated a mileage of 7,721 miles. His response was that the service entry at 23,789 miles was definitely a typo as a BMW main dealer would never advertise a car with false mileage history let alone attempt to sell it - a guarantee when buying an 'Approved Used' BMW he advised. Since it was the weekend, he couldn't call the service department at this other showroom to query the spurious service entry at 23,789 miles. However, he did offer to call them the next working day and get back to me with the information. I then asked if he could check for me when the car was first advertised by the other showroom. His records showed that the car was first advertised on 30/05/23, i.e., it's been on sale for just over 4 months. To me, the (potential) mileage discrepancy and length of time the car has been on sale were concerning so I asked the salesman to close down my query.
Since leaving the showroom that day, I've had a slight change of heart. I think the mileage discrepancy may be genuine. However, I haven't yet contacted the other dealership to verify this information. Also, I think it having not sold in 4 months may be genuine too - it's a circa £70K car and in current times most people can't afford this.
MY QUESTION: is it possible, by looking at the condition of the certain parts of interior/exterior of the car, to tell the difference between a ~8K miles car and a ~24K miles car? The car is decently priced and, given the fact that they've not been able to sell it for 4 months, I may be able to negotiate a good deal. However, I want to be sure about the mileage first - I don't want to rely on the dealership's word.
Apologies for the long post - any advice would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks in advance.
Since leaving the showroom that day, I've had a slight change of heart. I think the mileage discrepancy may be genuine. However, I haven't yet contacted the other dealership to verify this information. Also, I think it having not sold in 4 months may be genuine too - it's a circa £70K car and in current times most people can't afford this.
MY QUESTION: is it possible, by looking at the condition of the certain parts of interior/exterior of the car, to tell the difference between a ~8K miles car and a ~24K miles car? The car is decently priced and, given the fact that they've not been able to sell it for 4 months, I may be able to negotiate a good deal. However, I want to be sure about the mileage first - I don't want to rely on the dealership's word.
Apologies for the long post - any advice would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks in advance.
The big yin said:
Why don't you call the other dealer and ask the questions , or even go for a run and turn up and see what you think.
What garage was the car at /
Hi thanks for the reply!What garage was the car at /
I fully intend to go and see the car in person to do my own inspection as well as ask the dealer the relevant questions. To help with the former, I'm seeking advice from others on here to get an idea of what specifically (if anything) I should be looking for whe trying to decipher the difference between a ~8K miles car and ~24K miles car. I've come across posts on here where people claim they've been sold Approved Used BMW's with mileage discrepancies, hence why I am asking the question.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Apart from asking the dealer to read the various places the car stores it's mileage to confirm it is indeed sub-10k the only other thing I would expect at that mileage would be all the tyres to still be the original OEM ones. If they are different then I'd be asking why. Everything else would be down to how the car was treated.
You might be able to tell from the history (from what was done and possibly tyre tread depths) whether the 23789 service was actually at 2378 miles. Also, is there sufficient for someone doing fairly average mileage to go from 2378 miles on the date of the 23789 mile service to when it was put for sale?
Realistically though, is it worth the hassle/risk, unless the car is noticeably cheaper. Unless BMW can correct the service record, you'll have a problem when it comes to selling it later.
Realistically though, is it worth the hassle/risk, unless the car is noticeably cheaper. Unless BMW can correct the service record, you'll have a problem when it comes to selling it later.
Ring BMW U.K.
They will tell you all it’s visits, when where and at what mileage
All are saved in the car and on BMW’s global service computer records
They won’t tell what it had done but once you know what dealers it’s been into and on what dates then you can ring the individual dealers and confirm whether it was a warranty or service visit
They will tell you all it’s visits, when where and at what mileage
All are saved in the car and on BMW’s global service computer records
They won’t tell what it had done but once you know what dealers it’s been into and on what dates then you can ring the individual dealers and confirm whether it was a warranty or service visit
ravippatra said:
Hi thanks for the reply!
I fully intend to go and see the car in person to do my own inspection as well as ask the dealer the relevant questions. To help with the former, I'm seeking advice from others on here to get an idea of what specifically (if anything) I should be looking for whe trying to decipher the difference between a ~8K miles car and ~24K miles car. I've come across posts on here where people claim they've been sold Approved Used BMW's with mileage discrepancies, hence why I am asking the question.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Realistically it is going to be hard to tell....some 8000 mile cars will look like they have done 50000 and some 24000 mile cars will look like they have done 3000 it all depends on the previous owner and how they looked after the car.I fully intend to go and see the car in person to do my own inspection as well as ask the dealer the relevant questions. To help with the former, I'm seeking advice from others on here to get an idea of what specifically (if anything) I should be looking for whe trying to decipher the difference between a ~8K miles car and ~24K miles car. I've come across posts on here where people claim they've been sold Approved Used BMW's with mileage discrepancies, hence why I am asking the question.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Tyres might be a good clue. if they have done 23000 miles they will be showing some wear, do they all have the same date of manufacturer ?
Lift the bonnet - is the engine and bay clean ?
Stone chips an 8000 mile car should have very view
Sat nav destination history- if a lot of places are listed spread over a wide area might indicate its travelled plenty of miles
Service history on i drive - will tell you what work its had done sand mileage
Vehicle status on i drive will tell you when each of the next services have are due and at what mileage
ravippatra said:
I was at my local BMW dealership the other week having a look at used M cars. Unfortunately, this particular showroom didn't have the model I was looking for within my budget. Before leaving the showroom, the salesman sat me down at his desk and said let me check our stock across other sites as they may have something. It turned out that a different site of theirs did have the ideal car, both spec and budget. The car was registered in Sept 2022 and the advertisement stated that the car had 7,721 miles on the clock (photo of odometer shows this too). I asked for more information on the car, the service history, number of previous owners, ex-demo/private owner etc. He was more than happy to oblige. Before sharing with me the service history on screen, the salesman advised that given a) the car has covered only 7,721 miles and b) it is still under 2 years old, this model of M car should have only 2 entries on it's service history: 1) the delivery inspection (or something to that effect) and 2) the running-in service at approx. 1,200 miles. When he shared the service history on screen, the aforementioned entries were indeed showing however there appeared to be an additional entry at 23,789 miles. Both the running-in service and the additional one at 23,789 were carried out at the dealership advertising the car. I immediately pointed this out to the salesman as the advertisement stated a mileage of 7,721 miles. His response was that the service entry at 23,789 miles was definitely a typo as a BMW main dealer would never advertise a car with false mileage history let alone attempt to sell it - a guarantee when buying an 'Approved Used' BMW he advised. Since it was the weekend, he couldn't call the service department at this other showroom to query the spurious service entry at 23,789 miles. However, he did offer to call them the next working day and get back to me with the information. I then asked if he could check for me when the car was first advertised by the other showroom. His records showed that the car was first advertised on 30/05/23, i.e., it's been on sale for just over 4 months. To me, the (potential) mileage discrepancy and length of time the car has been on sale were concerning so I asked the salesman to close down my query.
Since leaving the showroom that day, I've had a slight change of heart. I think the mileage discrepancy may be genuine. However, I haven't yet contacted the other dealership to verify this information. Also, I think it having not sold in 4 months may be genuine too - it's a circa £70K car and in current times most people can't afford this.
MY QUESTION: is it possible, by looking at the condition of the certain parts of interior/exterior of the car, to tell the difference between a ~8K miles car and a ~24K miles car? The car is decently priced and, given the fact that they've not been able to sell it for 4 months, I may be able to negotiate a good deal. However, I want to be sure about the mileage first - I don't want to rely on the dealership's word.
Apologies for the long post - any advice would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks in advance.
It's either had a second running in service at 2,378 (which I don't think is normal unless it's a track weapon so that's another question) and someone's got fat fingers, _and_ the previous owner hasn't spotted it _and_ BMW haven't corrected it or it's done at least 23,789 miles & been clocked. Since leaving the showroom that day, I've had a slight change of heart. I think the mileage discrepancy may be genuine. However, I haven't yet contacted the other dealership to verify this information. Also, I think it having not sold in 4 months may be genuine too - it's a circa £70K car and in current times most people can't afford this.
MY QUESTION: is it possible, by looking at the condition of the certain parts of interior/exterior of the car, to tell the difference between a ~8K miles car and a ~24K miles car? The car is decently priced and, given the fact that they've not been able to sell it for 4 months, I may be able to negotiate a good deal. However, I want to be sure about the mileage first - I don't want to rely on the dealership's word.
Apologies for the long post - any advice would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks in advance.
Whatever the answer
(a) you'll have to explain it when you sell it unless BMW correct it now
(b) you'll always wonder
If you were able to see the car in person and get a Carly code reader on it you can check the mileage in every location it's stored in for yourself, but I wouldn't be buying this at a distance regardless of it being Approved Used. There are plenty more fish in the sea, find one that doesn't leave you asking questions.
Earthdweller said:
Ring BMW U.K.
They will tell you all it’s visits, when where and at what mileage
All are saved in the car and on BMW’s global service computer records
They won’t tell what it had done but once you know what dealers it’s been into and on what dates then you can ring the individual dealers and confirm whether it was a warranty or service visit
Can confirm have this exact issue with my BMW and trying to sell it. HPI is saying mileage is wrong and is causing red flags/notifications. Have had to go and pull out service documents from BMW over several years to show mileage is correct. They will tell you all it’s visits, when where and at what mileage
All are saved in the car and on BMW’s global service computer records
They won’t tell what it had done but once you know what dealers it’s been into and on what dates then you can ring the individual dealers and confirm whether it was a warranty or service visit
Sadly, and of scant consolation to the OP, this sort of query is becoming all too common. There is good advice on here re tyres, etc but at the end of the day you either walk away or accept the discrepancy and buy. My daughter in law is currently looking for a car and I have to agree with whoever posted on this aspect that it is not worth buying at ( much of) a distance unless the vehicle is a true ‘one off’.
aterribleusername said:
Apart from asking the dealer to read the various places the car stores it's mileage to confirm it is indeed sub-10k the only other thing I would expect at that mileage would be all the tyres to still be the original OEM ones. If they are different then I'd be asking why. Everything else would be down to how the car was treated.
Hi, thank you for the reply.I will take on that advice re asking dealer to read the various places the car stores it's mileage.
Cheers!
SkodaIan said:
You might be able to tell from the history (from what was done and possibly tyre tread depths) whether the 23789 service was actually at 2378 miles. Also, is there sufficient for someone doing fairly average mileage to go from 2378 miles on the date of the 23789 mile service to when it was put for sale?
Realistically though, is it worth the hassle/risk, unless the car is noticeably cheaper. Unless BMW can correct the service record, you'll have a problem when it comes to selling it later.
Hi, thanks for the reply!Realistically though, is it worth the hassle/risk, unless the car is noticeably cheaper. Unless BMW can correct the service record, you'll have a problem when it comes to selling it later.
The car was originally purchsed new from this dealer - let's call them Dealer X - in Sept 22'. It was then sold back to Dealer X in ~May 23'. I.e., the previous owner had it for approximately 8 months. When the service history was shared with me by my local dealer, I noticed that the running-in service was carried out by Dealer X at approx. 1,200 miles. However, I never managed to take a note of where the (spurious) 23,789 miles service was done. So, notwithstanding the erroneous service entry at 23,789, it appears that the car was sold, maintained and then bought back by the same dealership, which can only be a good thing? Also, I doubt that the previous owner managed to cover ~24K miles in the space of 8 months, but then again it's not impossible.
As mentioned above, I absolutely DO NOT intend on purchasing at a distance. I fully intend on going to see the car in person, inspect properly, test drive and then perhaps do a deal. I'm just trying to get others thoughts on here on how to formulate a plan before headng to the dealership and possibly getting carried away!
Thanks again!
Earthdweller said:
Ring BMW U.K.
They will tell you all it’s visits, when where and at what mileage
All are saved in the car and on BMW’s global service computer records
They won’t tell what it had done but once you know what dealers it’s been into and on what dates then you can ring the individual dealers and confirm whether it was a warranty or service visit
Hi, thank you for the advice.They will tell you all it’s visits, when where and at what mileage
All are saved in the car and on BMW’s global service computer records
They won’t tell what it had done but once you know what dealers it’s been into and on what dates then you can ring the individual dealers and confirm whether it was a warranty or service visit
I went on to BMW UK and, just like everything else in this day and age, due to 'technical issues', currently they are contactable only by email. What an absolute joke this country has turned into since the Plandemic. Anyway, I will take your advice on board and send them my query and wait to hear what they come back with.
Thanks again for the advice!
edthefed said:
ravippatra said:
Hi thanks for the reply!
I fully intend to go and see the car in person to do my own inspection as well as ask the dealer the relevant questions. To help with the former, I'm seeking advice from others on here to get an idea of what specifically (if anything) I should be looking for whe trying to decipher the difference between a ~8K miles car and ~24K miles car. I've come across posts on here where people claim they've been sold Approved Used BMW's with mileage discrepancies, hence why I am asking the question.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Realistically it is going to be hard to tell....some 8000 mile cars will look like they have done 50000 and some 24000 mile cars will look like they have done 3000 it all depends on the previous owner and how they looked after the car.I fully intend to go and see the car in person to do my own inspection as well as ask the dealer the relevant questions. To help with the former, I'm seeking advice from others on here to get an idea of what specifically (if anything) I should be looking for whe trying to decipher the difference between a ~8K miles car and ~24K miles car. I've come across posts on here where people claim they've been sold Approved Used BMW's with mileage discrepancies, hence why I am asking the question.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Tyres might be a good clue. if they have done 23000 miles they will be showing some wear, do they all have the same date of manufacturer ?
Lift the bonnet - is the engine and bay clean ?
Stone chips an 8000 mile car should have very view
Sat nav destination history- if a lot of places are listed spread over a wide area might indicate its travelled plenty of miles
Service history on i drive - will tell you what work its had done sand mileage
Vehicle status on i drive will tell you when each of the next services have are due and at what mileage
You've made some very good points above that I've taken a note of: tyre manufactur date (I've recently sold 2nd hand tyres so I'm aware there can be minor discrepancies in the month on manufacture on a given set), engine bay condition, stone chips, I Drive - I will be sure to check these when I see it in person.
Thanks!
t because AFAIK the mileage and servicing is recorded on the keyfob and then transferred to BMW's central system upon taking it to the dealer. The idea that someone manually keys in the mileage is a nonsense.Collectingbrass said:
ravippatra said:
I was at my local BMW dealership the other week having a look at used M cars. Unfortunately, this particular showroom didn't have the model I was looking for within my budget. Before leaving the showroom, the salesman sat me down at his desk and said let me check our stock across other sites as they may have something. It turned out that a different site of theirs did have the ideal car, both spec and budget. The car was registered in Sept 2022 and the advertisement stated that the car had 7,721 miles on the clock (photo of odometer shows this too). I asked for more information on the car, the service history, number of previous owners, ex-demo/private owner etc. He was more than happy to oblige. Before sharing with me the service history on screen, the salesman advised that given a) the car has covered only 7,721 miles and b) it is still under 2 years old, this model of M car should have only 2 entries on it's service history: 1) the delivery inspection (or something to that effect) and 2) the running-in service at approx. 1,200 miles. When he shared the service history on screen, the aforementioned entries were indeed showing however there appeared to be an additional entry at 23,789 miles. Both the running-in service and the additional one at 23,789 were carried out at the dealership advertising the car. I immediately pointed this out to the salesman as the advertisement stated a mileage of 7,721 miles. His response was that the service entry at 23,789 miles was definitely a typo as a BMW main dealer would never advertise a car with false mileage history let alone attempt to sell it - a guarantee when buying an 'Approved Used' BMW he advised. Since it was the weekend, he couldn't call the service department at this other showroom to query the spurious service entry at 23,789 miles. However, he did offer to call them the next working day and get back to me with the information. I then asked if he could check for me when the car was first advertised by the other showroom. His records showed that the car was first advertised on 30/05/23, i.e., it's been on sale for just over 4 months. To me, the (potential) mileage discrepancy and length of time the car has been on sale were concerning so I asked the salesman to close down my query.
Since leaving the showroom that day, I've had a slight change of heart. I think the mileage discrepancy may be genuine. However, I haven't yet contacted the other dealership to verify this information. Also, I think it having not sold in 4 months may be genuine too - it's a circa £70K car and in current times most people can't afford this.
MY QUESTION: is it possible, by looking at the condition of the certain parts of interior/exterior of the car, to tell the difference between a ~8K miles car and a ~24K miles car? The car is decently priced and, given the fact that they've not been able to sell it for 4 months, I may be able to negotiate a good deal. However, I want to be sure about the mileage first - I don't want to rely on the dealership's word.
Apologies for the long post - any advice would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks in advance.
It's either had a second running in service at 2,378 (which I don't think is normal unless it's a track weapon so that's another question) and someone's got fat fingers, _and_ the previous owner hasn't spotted it _and_ BMW haven't corrected it or it's done at least 23,789 miles & been clocked. Since leaving the showroom that day, I've had a slight change of heart. I think the mileage discrepancy may be genuine. However, I haven't yet contacted the other dealership to verify this information. Also, I think it having not sold in 4 months may be genuine too - it's a circa £70K car and in current times most people can't afford this.
MY QUESTION: is it possible, by looking at the condition of the certain parts of interior/exterior of the car, to tell the difference between a ~8K miles car and a ~24K miles car? The car is decently priced and, given the fact that they've not been able to sell it for 4 months, I may be able to negotiate a good deal. However, I want to be sure about the mileage first - I don't want to rely on the dealership's word.
Apologies for the long post - any advice would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks in advance.
Whatever the answer
(a) you'll have to explain it when you sell it unless BMW correct it now
(b) you'll always wonder
If you were able to see the car in person and get a Carly code reader on it you can check the mileage in every location it's stored in for yourself, but I wouldn't be buying this at a distance regardless of it being Approved Used. There are plenty more fish in the sea, find one that doesn't leave you asking questions.
The car has had only one owner, so there can only be 2 possibilities:
1. the previous owner did ~24K miles in the space of ~8 months, clocked it back to 7,721 miles and then sold it back to the same dealer
2. the dealer bought it off the previous owner with 23,789 miles on the clock, they then clocked it back to 7,721 miles
Both of the above possibilities are problematic for the dealer: the first implies that the dealer was careless as they never spotted the discrepancy in the service history, the second implies fraud on the part of the dealer.
You are absolutely correct, it will be problem for me when I come to sell the car on (which is what I intend to do). Therefore, until I don't get to the bottom of the mileage discrepancy, if at all, I wont be buying it!
Thanks for the advice.
BobSaunders said:
Earthdweller said:
Ring BMW U.K.
They will tell you all it’s visits, when where and at what mileage
All are saved in the car and on BMW’s global service computer records
They won’t tell what it had done but once you know what dealers it’s been into and on what dates then you can ring the individual dealers and confirm whether it was a warranty or service visit
Can confirm have this exact issue with my BMW and trying to sell it. HPI is saying mileage is wrong and is causing red flags/notifications. Have had to go and pull out service documents from BMW over several years to show mileage is correct. They will tell you all it’s visits, when where and at what mileage
All are saved in the car and on BMW’s global service computer records
They won’t tell what it had done but once you know what dealers it’s been into and on what dates then you can ring the individual dealers and confirm whether it was a warranty or service visit
Can I ask, did you do a HPI check on the car before you bought it? Would it be worth me doing one? The car I'm looking at is ~13 months old and for ~4 months of that it's been sat in a dealership! I'm wonderng therefore how much history an HPI, or another car check for that matter, will show?
Thanks!
Lester H said:
Sadly, and of scant consolation to the OP, this sort of query is becoming all too common. There is good advice on here re tyres, etc but at the end of the day you either walk away or accept the discrepancy and buy. My daughter in law is currently looking for a car and I have to agree with whoever posted on this aspect that it is not worth buying at ( much of) a distance unless the vehicle is a true ‘one off’.
Thanks for the reply!Yes, I fully intend on buying in person, and only after I've had all doubts cleared regarding the spurious service entry.
Thanks and I hope you get your issue sorted!
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