Running rich

[KugaWestie]

I got the car MOT’d yesterday but needed some “help” to get through emissions.

It smells rich and the testing equipment confirmed it.

Where would you start looking? Lambdas? MAF? ECU coolant temp sensor?

I have got rover gauge so can plug this on and have a look to check ECU is seeing correct engine temps. What should I see on the lambdas on rover gauge?

Edited by KugaWestie on Saturday 22 July 08:43

[Belle427]

Maybe contact the very helpful blaze away from this thread and ask could he look at the logs for you and spot anything unusual.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

[blaze_away]

Willing to help but will need a Rovergauge log file from you

If you can run a logfile of data I will check all the Inputs/outputs and make an assessment of each of them for you.

Logfile has to be done as followd.

From cold
Run RoverGauge (RG)
Turn on ignition position 1.
Connect RG
Set RG to record all data values but not road speed and not gear selection.
Set MAF DIRECT, THROTTLE ABSOLUTE, TRIM SHORT.
Start the logfile
Start the engine.
Allow the car to run like that at idle for about 20 minutes.
Stop the log file and send it to me.

PS have done this now for 20+ cars and have data that I can compare to to establish condition of the inputs and outputs.

[blitzracing]

KugaWestie said:

I got the car MOT’d yesterday but needed some “help” to get through emissions.

It smells rich and the testing equipment confirmed it.

Where would you start looking? Lambdas? MAF? ECU coolant temp sensor?

I have got rover gauge so can plug this on and have a look to check ECU is seeing correct engine temps. What should I see on the lambdas on rover gauge?

Edited by KugaWestie on Saturday 22 July 08:43

Check the AFM standby voltage- Peel back the rubber boot on the airflow meter connector and leave it plugged in to the airflow meter. Set up the digital multimeter to read voltage. Insert the negative probe into the Red/Black wire (sensor ground), and the positive into the Blue/Green wire (Airflow signal).

Turn on the ignition on but don't start. It should be in the region of approximately 0.3-0.34 Volts after the initial "warm up" spike. Most defective airflow meters will overshoot to 0.8 Volts or higher, and take at least 2 seconds to come down to the correct voltage.

If this voltage is wrong the whole airflow to voltage scaling will be wrong across the whole range

You can check the temp sensors by comparing the resistance of the fuel rail sensor and the coolant sensor on a cold engine. They are the same thermistor so should give the same reading.

You do need Rovergauge for trim values.

[KugaWestie]

Thanks blaze and blitz.

I am away from the car until this weekend, will have a look at the AFM and also try and run a RoverGauge log

[KugaWestie]

blaze_away said:

Willing to help but will need a Rovergauge log file from you

If you can run a logfile of data I will check all the Inputs/outputs and make an assessment of each of them for you.

Logfile has to be done as followd.

From cold
Run RoverGauge (RG)
Turn on ignition position 1.
Connect RG
Set RG to record all data values but not road speed and not gear selection.
Set MAF DIRECT, THROTTLE ABSOLUTE, TRIM SHORT.
Start the logfile
Start the engine.
Allow the car to run like that at idle for about 20 minutes.
Stop the log file and send it to me.

PS have done this now for 20+ cars and have data that I can compare to to establish condition of the inputs and outputs.

I have run a log file this afternoon. Where do you want me to send it to?

Edited by KugaWestie on Saturday 29th July 18:28

Edited by KugaWestie on Saturday 29th July 18:28

[KugaWestie]

Ok whilst waiting for blaze_away, I have discovered that the lambda on the odd bank is running at +100% on short trim.

[KugaWestie]

The same Odd bank lambda is showing an error code.

[KugaWestie]

I have checked the red wire on both lambda connector plugs and am seeing over 13v with the engine running on both banks

Edited by KugaWestie on Saturday 29th July 18:28

[KugaWestie]

The MAF spikes upon ignition on and then settles at 0.302V. It does take more like 10 seconds to come down and settle though

[Belle427]

How is the ignition system plugs, leads etc?
Does it idle ok?

[KugaWestie]

Belle427 said:

How is the ignition system plugs, leads etc?
Does it idle ok?

New plugs, new leads, new amplifier, new coil.

Idles lovely, runs well too, just rich

[Belle427]

You could try switching the lambdas over and see if the fault moves to the other bank.
Always worth checking the connectors too that live under the plenum, there are 2 on each sensor.
I did read the coolant temp needs to be about 90 degrees for them to cycle correctly.
Loads of good info for checks here if your at a loose end!
http://g33.co.uk/pages/technical-fuel-injection.ht...

Edited by Belle427 on Sunday 30th July 07:15

[KugaWestie]

This morning I removed both sensors from the manifolds and swapped them to the other banks.

I ran RG and cleared the error code from yesterday on the odd bank sensor.

Then started the engine with everything set the same as yesterday.

See below photo, yesterday is the top image, today is the bottom image.





So the problem has moved from the odd bank to the even bank.


Time for a replacement lambda sensor do we think?

[Classic Chim]

I think Frank ( Blaze away) is actually on a motoring holiday in his Chim. I also think he’s trying to clock up 300,000 miles or something like that

Looks like you’ve isolated the issue to a duff lambda

[Belle427]

I would agree, I'd probably change the pair personally but I don't think they are cheap or readily available.

[KugaWestie]

I have ordered a new lambda from Motaclan, hopefully that sorts it out

[blaze_away]

Classic Chim said:

I think Frank ( Blaze away) is actually on a motoring holiday in his Chim. I also think he’s trying to clock up 300,000 miles or something like that

Looks like you’ve isolated the issue to a duff lambda

Thanks Alun....now on 248k !!

New lambda should sort it. If op runs new idle logfile I will chart it to confirm.

[KugaWestie]

blaze_away said:

Thanks Alun....now on 248k !!

New lambda should sort it. If op runs new idle logfile I will chart it to confirm.

Thanks for the offer. I will run a new log file once the lambda has been replaced.
You still need to let me know where to send the file to though?

[blaze_away]

KugaWestie said:

blaze_away said:

Thanks Alun....now on 248k !!

New lambda should sort it. If op runs new idle logfile I will chart it to confirm.

Thanks for the offer. I will run a new log file once the lambda has been replaced.
You still need to let me know where to send the file to though?

Will pm you my email