Bought something boring - E87 120d
Discussion
"Buy a BMW” they said, “it'll be reliable”, they said…
This was in response to me having a whinge about always being under a car in the rain (and snow on occasion)... Probably.
After I sold the 159 TBI;
https://www.pistonheads.com/news/ph-italian-cars/a...
no, not that one, this one...
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
I bought a GT 1.9 diesel Cloverleaf - 170bhp with a Q2 or torsen differential:
1 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_6150 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_6177 by Chris, on Flickr
I liked the 159, it was quiet, good looking and had a big boot with useable rear seats. But, for everyday use it was too big and cumbersome. More fundamentally, it was not great on fuel - 24mpg on the short trips I was doing. I needed something that was cheaper to run.
A GT seemed like the logical choice. Especially with the Q2 diff. But, I paid too much for it which I found aggravating and it was a pain in the arse. My Dad and I did our usual trick of fixing everything, the kind of things most people wouldn't think twice about and I got fed up with it.
I did take pics as I was going with the intention posting another one of these threads but I didn't find the enthusiasm for it.
I hadn't decided to get rid of the GT but when I met up with a friend over christmas (2022) I mentioned, in conversation, that I'd be interested in his 1 series should he decide to sell it. Technically it was his daughter's car as he'd dropped down to one car and given the BM to her during lockdown.
It was almost a flippant comment but I had a phone call in January asking if I'd be interested in buying it for the we buy any car price...
I picked it up on a Friday, Put the GT up for sale on the Sunday and that went on the Monday to someone who looked at it in the dark, whilst it was snowing.
So here it is as I picked it up mid Jan 2023. A boring, red hatchback with a diesel engine. At least it'll be reliable.
Right?...
(There's a few updates to come, for some reason.
)
IMG_9783 by Chris, on Flickr
This was in response to me having a whinge about always being under a car in the rain (and snow on occasion)... Probably.
After I sold the 159 TBI;
https://www.pistonheads.com/news/ph-italian-cars/a...
no, not that one, this one...
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
I bought a GT 1.9 diesel Cloverleaf - 170bhp with a Q2 or torsen differential:
1 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_6150 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_6177 by Chris, on FlickrI liked the 159, it was quiet, good looking and had a big boot with useable rear seats. But, for everyday use it was too big and cumbersome. More fundamentally, it was not great on fuel - 24mpg on the short trips I was doing. I needed something that was cheaper to run.
A GT seemed like the logical choice. Especially with the Q2 diff. But, I paid too much for it which I found aggravating and it was a pain in the arse. My Dad and I did our usual trick of fixing everything, the kind of things most people wouldn't think twice about and I got fed up with it.
I did take pics as I was going with the intention posting another one of these threads but I didn't find the enthusiasm for it.
I hadn't decided to get rid of the GT but when I met up with a friend over christmas (2022) I mentioned, in conversation, that I'd be interested in his 1 series should he decide to sell it. Technically it was his daughter's car as he'd dropped down to one car and given the BM to her during lockdown.
It was almost a flippant comment but I had a phone call in January asking if I'd be interested in buying it for the we buy any car price...
I picked it up on a Friday, Put the GT up for sale on the Sunday and that went on the Monday to someone who looked at it in the dark, whilst it was snowing.
So here it is as I picked it up mid Jan 2023. A boring, red hatchback with a diesel engine. At least it'll be reliable.
Right?...
(There's a few updates to come, for some reason.
)IMG_9783 by Chris, on FlickrEdited by Zombie on Monday 10th April 22:14
B'stard Child said:
N47?
yup...
69685252365__AD9B0D3A-9935-4091-B277-05161321FC25 by Chris, on FlickrEdited by Zombie on Friday 31st March 00:24
Zombie said:
B'stard Child said:
N47?
yup...69685252365__AD9B0D3A-9935-4091-B277-05161321FC25 by Chris, on FlickrEdited by Zombie on Friday 31st March 00:24
In for a penny and all that.
I know they’re largely derided on here, but I like the E8x cars. My other half had a cheapy 116i which was so as st but fundamentally a good car. My 130i was brilliant; I loved that car and still miss it. Her current 125i cab has been a good car and one that I still enjoy driving.
I think these look good in red.
I know they’re largely derided on here, but I like the E8x cars. My other half had a cheapy 116i which was so as s
t but fundamentally a good car. My 130i was brilliant; I loved that car and still miss it. Her current 125i cab has been a good car and one that I still enjoy driving. I think these look good in red.
As I've already given the game away, I'll start with this as the 1st problem.
The timing chain.
I knew what I was getting into when I bought the car in that it was unlikely that the chain had been changed and that it had done 145k miles. Meaning if it wasn't due, it would be soon.
However, the car does have full service history, it's always had shall helix full synthetic in it and, amongst other things, it's recently had a new clutch and DMF. It's also had 3 registered keepers before me - the person who bought it new, my friend and then his daughter. Meaning, despite all that follows, it should be a decent car.
I'd researched common E87 problems before I committed to buy the car, so I knew that replacing the chain, which is on the back of the engine, requires removal of the engine and a bunch of other things, like the sump. I also knew that they tend to need doing at 100k ish, so when I heard the tell tale noises everyone says to look for, on the way home after buying it, this was neither a surprise or a particular disappointment.
I had fully intended to change the chain myself - I am perfectly capable of doing this, but, we found a garage within 20 miles that would do the job for £750. That included all the parts, oil / filter and an air-con re-gas.
As a rough estimate, to do the job myself;
Oil and filter - £50
Chain kit - £135
Timing tools - £125
Re-Gas - £100
Engine Coolant £20
= £430
Meaning I'd save myself (probably less than) £320 doing the job myself, but I'd be doing it on the drive, in the rain, in the middle of winter and I'd get sidetracked with other bits. It would've taken 4 days knowing how fastidious both my Dad and I are - We'd have spent a day cleaning the engine and the engine bay whilst it was out...
On balance it made sense just to pay the garage to do it, particularly given that they know the job inside out. Apparently, they pretty much only do this one job on N47 and N57 engined BMW's.
Plus, it took them less than 24 hours. I dropped it off at 5pm the night before and it was done by 4pm the next day.
69685601053__7BC81FDF-F225-4D33-8842-03AFBADBA485 by Chris, on Flickr
69685563527__A254FC77-0D48-4378-9A4F-729D2ECD6741 by Chris, on Flickr
69685601950__118F08A6-DDF3-4E3F-8C46-116E01CDCDD9 by Chris, on Flickr
69685688034__8256328C-92AB-4F2B-AD68-A43372981625 by Chris, on Flickr
The timing chain.
I knew what I was getting into when I bought the car in that it was unlikely that the chain had been changed and that it had done 145k miles. Meaning if it wasn't due, it would be soon.
However, the car does have full service history, it's always had shall helix full synthetic in it and, amongst other things, it's recently had a new clutch and DMF. It's also had 3 registered keepers before me - the person who bought it new, my friend and then his daughter. Meaning, despite all that follows, it should be a decent car.
I'd researched common E87 problems before I committed to buy the car, so I knew that replacing the chain, which is on the back of the engine, requires removal of the engine and a bunch of other things, like the sump. I also knew that they tend to need doing at 100k ish, so when I heard the tell tale noises everyone says to look for, on the way home after buying it, this was neither a surprise or a particular disappointment.
I had fully intended to change the chain myself - I am perfectly capable of doing this, but, we found a garage within 20 miles that would do the job for £750. That included all the parts, oil / filter and an air-con re-gas.
As a rough estimate, to do the job myself;
Oil and filter - £50
Chain kit - £135
Timing tools - £125
Re-Gas - £100
Engine Coolant £20
= £430
Meaning I'd save myself (probably less than) £320 doing the job myself, but I'd be doing it on the drive, in the rain, in the middle of winter and I'd get sidetracked with other bits. It would've taken 4 days knowing how fastidious both my Dad and I are - We'd have spent a day cleaning the engine and the engine bay whilst it was out...
On balance it made sense just to pay the garage to do it, particularly given that they know the job inside out. Apparently, they pretty much only do this one job on N47 and N57 engined BMW's.
Plus, it took them less than 24 hours. I dropped it off at 5pm the night before and it was done by 4pm the next day.
69685601053__7BC81FDF-F225-4D33-8842-03AFBADBA485 by Chris, on Flickr69685563527__A254FC77-0D48-4378-9A4F-729D2ECD6741 by Chris, on Flickr69685601950__118F08A6-DDF3-4E3F-8C46-116E01CDCDD9 by Chris, on Flickr69685688034__8256328C-92AB-4F2B-AD68-A43372981625 by Chris, on Flickr Edited by Zombie on Saturday 1st April 00:28
Jhonno said:
The old chain didn't look that bad? Was it noisy?
£750 is dirt cheap btw.. It's 1k at my 2 local ones. They will get it done in an afternoon too. Is that the updated chain and guides?
Very good engine when you know the chain is safe!
It wasn't particularly noisy but given the horror stories I've hear about about them failing and causing other issues - fuel pumps / fuel contamination, I didn't want to risk it. I had another Specialist look at it before having the chains etc changed. They also thought it was the chain causing the noise I could hear, which has gone since the work was done.£750 is dirt cheap btw.. It's 1k at my 2 local ones. They will get it done in an afternoon too. Is that the updated chain and guides?
Very good engine when you know the chain is safe!
Yup, AFAIK, updated parts were used. Wouldn't matter if they were't though - I can't imagine they'll need doing again within the remaining lifespan of the car.
Good cars I like them, utter bargain's as the N47 scared people off I think, even if you didn't do the chain it would probably still soldier on, got some good rims on this one too.
Had a 2008(58) E81 118d, as mentioned before, got it up.to 180,000 miles, still going with 220,000 on it...not had chain done with new owner yet.
Have a E91 318d 2012 currently (3 series), climbing up to 150,000 miles - still a good solid car.
Maybe look at the swirl flaps, as they are on the 120d's, they were not included on the lower power 118d's and are another weak spot but not as much on the N47's.
Good 'M badge' too waiting for the backlash...not my thing, but each to their own.
Had a 2008(58) E81 118d, as mentioned before, got it up.to 180,000 miles, still going with 220,000 on it...not had chain done with new owner yet.
Have a E91 318d 2012 currently (3 series), climbing up to 150,000 miles - still a good solid car.
Maybe look at the swirl flaps, as they are on the 120d's, they were not included on the lower power 118d's and are another weak spot but not as much on the N47's.
Good 'M badge' too
waiting for the backlash...not my thing, but each to their own.I have to admit, i do tend to entirely skip anything BMW related post E36/9s. However after reading through both your GTA and 159 threads i will be sticking around and reading this one. I absolutely admire your attention to detail. Makes me want to redo some things i've done already.
I hope the car as a whole doesn't give you too much grief.
I hope the car as a whole doesn't give you too much grief.
I think they are great little cars, I recently bought the lesser 118d for the wife to run around in but I have to admit I do rather enjoy driving it around myself. With all the internet horror stories regarding the N47 these have become an absolute bargain.
I'm sure once you have treated it to all the preventative maintenance it will treat you well. All the best with it.
I'm sure once you have treated it to all the preventative maintenance it will treat you well. All the best with it.
7 5 7 said:
Good cars I like them, utter bargain's as the N47 scared people off I think, even if you didn't do the chain it would probably still soldier on, got some good rims on this one too.
Had a 2008(58) E81 118d, as mentioned before, got it up.to 180,000 miles, still going with 220,000 on it...not had chain done with new owner yet.
Have a E91 318d 2012 currently (3 series), climbing up to 150,000 miles - still a good solid car.
Maybe look at the swirl flaps, as they are on the 120d's, they were not included on the lower power 118d's and are another weak spot but not as much on the N47's.
Good 'M badge' too waiting for the backlash...not my thing, but each to their own.
The colour and the wheels certainly played a part in my interest in buying it.Had a 2008(58) E81 118d, as mentioned before, got it up.to 180,000 miles, still going with 220,000 on it...not had chain done with new owner yet.
Have a E91 318d 2012 currently (3 series), climbing up to 150,000 miles - still a good solid car.
Maybe look at the swirl flaps, as they are on the 120d's, they were not included on the lower power 118d's and are another weak spot but not as much on the N47's.
Good 'M badge' too
waiting for the backlash...not my thing, but each to their own.The number of m badges is silly, I'd remove the one on the boot but, being red, I expect the paint will be a different colour behind it. There's a new on in the garage instead as the badge itself is looking a bit tatty.
Rear wiper was working intermittently and the washer wasn't working at all...
Which meant taking all boot trim off to start, exposing the rear brake light
IMG_9845 by Chris, on Flickr
Which was broken;
IMG_9847 by Chris, on Flickr
Fixed this with a custom formed annular type retention device;
IMG_9881 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_9850 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_9857 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_9858 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_9861 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_9862 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_9864 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_9866 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_9867 by Chris, on Flickr
The inside of the wiper mechanism was gunged up with corrosion which is why that wasn't working. And it appears that the washer jet was blocked, meaning that the fluid ended up inside the mechanism, causing the corriosion.
IMG_9872 by Chris, on Flickr
We stripped the mechanism into and dunked it into an ultra sonic cleaner;
IMG_9880 by Chris, on Flickr
refitted everything, spent 40 mins re-aligning the wiper and the washer and that's another job ticked off the list.
As was the shield around the prop shaft;
IMG_9918 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_9919 by Chris, on Flickr
Which meant taking all boot trim off to start, exposing the rear brake light
IMG_9845 by Chris, on FlickrWhich was broken;
IMG_9847 by Chris, on FlickrFixed this with a custom formed annular type retention device;
IMG_9881 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_9850 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_9857 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_9858 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_9861 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_9862 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_9864 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_9866 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_9867 by Chris, on FlickrThe inside of the wiper mechanism was gunged up with corrosion which is why that wasn't working. And it appears that the washer jet was blocked, meaning that the fluid ended up inside the mechanism, causing the corriosion.
IMG_9872 by Chris, on FlickrWe stripped the mechanism into and dunked it into an ultra sonic cleaner;
IMG_9880 by Chris, on Flickrrefitted everything, spent 40 mins re-aligning the wiper and the washer and that's another job ticked off the list.
As was the shield around the prop shaft;
IMG_9918 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_9919 by Chris, on FlickrEdited by Zombie on Thursday 6th April 00:21
Another problem that was readily apparent when I collected it was a vibration from the rear of the car that worsened at motorway speeds then curiously disappeared after 10min.
It wasn't hard to narrow this down to a sticking brake on the n/s rear wheel as the wheel (and brake) was notably hotter than the other 3 wheels.
At this point, the disc wasn't showing any signs of overheating and the rear pads weren't wearing abnormally:
IMG_0042 by Chris, on Flickr
The handbrake did feel like it wasn't working properly nor was it very effective so we thought this might be the problem.
I removed the caliper and rear disc and had a look at the handbrake mechanism. Not finding anything obvious, I cleaned up the adjustment mechanism and re-adjusted the handbrake on both sides.
This solved the handbrake issue in that it now works but the over heating problem remained.
Which suggested that the pad may have been sticking in the hanger. I stripped it down again and cleaned this up - The brake pad was stuck in the hanger due to corrosion build up.
IMG_9833 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_9836 by Chris, on Flickr
Thinking I'd found the problem I put it back together again and over the working week found that it was still overheating.
At this point we decided that the caliper piston must be sticking and that new calipers were required.
Which meant taking the wheel off year again to confirm the type of brakes fitted. They weren't what we were expecting so I took the wheel off again to reconfirm the caliper type and the disc size...
After ordering then, the calipers (and new pads) turned up a week later.
I was unable to use the car for a week as the overheating issue was becoming worse by this point.
IMG_0409 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_0411 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_0412 by Chris, on Flickr
IMG_0419-2 by Chris, on Flickr
After fitting the new brake calipers on both sides I decided to treat the car to a quick clean. Noticing the potential for a decent sunset;
IMG_0130 by Chris, on Flickr
I thought I'd take it up to the road I use for taking pics of cars, which is about a mile away...
Set off from my parent's house turned on to the main road and there was a loud bang when I ran over the first speed cushion. Followed by a scraping noise. I limped the car back to my parents and left it there as it was going dark, not knowing what the problem was, only that it was un-useable.
It wasn't hard to narrow this down to a sticking brake on the n/s rear wheel as the wheel (and brake) was notably hotter than the other 3 wheels.
At this point, the disc wasn't showing any signs of overheating and the rear pads weren't wearing abnormally:
IMG_0042 by Chris, on FlickrThe handbrake did feel like it wasn't working properly nor was it very effective so we thought this might be the problem.
I removed the caliper and rear disc and had a look at the handbrake mechanism. Not finding anything obvious, I cleaned up the adjustment mechanism and re-adjusted the handbrake on both sides.
This solved the handbrake issue in that it now works but the over heating problem remained.
Which suggested that the pad may have been sticking in the hanger. I stripped it down again and cleaned this up - The brake pad was stuck in the hanger due to corrosion build up.
IMG_9833 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_9836 by Chris, on FlickrThinking I'd found the problem I put it back together again and over the working week found that it was still overheating.
At this point we decided that the caliper piston must be sticking and that new calipers were required.
Which meant taking the wheel off year again to confirm the type of brakes fitted. They weren't what we were expecting so I took the wheel off again to reconfirm the caliper type and the disc size...
After ordering then, the calipers (and new pads) turned up a week later.
I was unable to use the car for a week as the overheating issue was becoming worse by this point.
IMG_0409 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_0411 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_0412 by Chris, on FlickrIMG_0419-2 by Chris, on FlickrAfter fitting the new brake calipers on both sides I decided to treat the car to a quick clean. Noticing the potential for a decent sunset;
IMG_0130 by Chris, on FlickrI thought I'd take it up to the road I use for taking pics of cars, which is about a mile away...
Set off from my parent's house turned on to the main road and there was a loud bang when I ran over the first speed cushion. Followed by a scraping noise. I limped the car back to my parents and left it there as it was going dark, not knowing what the problem was, only that it was un-useable.
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