FIA - No poltical/personal/religious comments from drivers
Discussion
Seems like good ole Ben's had enough of drivers having opinions on stuff.
New rules prohibit "the general making and display of political, religious and personal statements or comments notably in violation of the general principle of neutrality promoted by the FIA under its Statutes” without prior permission. While it remains to be seen how stringently this gets enforced it feels like, as-worded, it could be used to basically prohibit anything and everything the FIA hasn't pre-approved, while I'm sure it won't go quite that far it's absurdly broad IMO.
So the obvious stuff is Lewis can't talk about racism any more, but what about his tattoos? I mean they rather obviously make clear religious statements no? Presumably those rainbow helmets that various drivers have used for LGBT+ support will be banned etc.
This brings us back full circle to Ben's original comments in that Monaco interview where he complained about drivers "imposing their beliefs" - I don't think drivers should be expected to speak out on issues, for those like Max who just want to turn up and drive that's fine and dandy but for those that do I'd vigorously defend their right to do so. Their human beings not FIA puppets and I think people can understand that when they express their views they're expressing their views, people might liken it to having your freedom to express views limited when you're representing your employer - but the FIA doesn't employ these guys, the teams do. If Mercedes is happy to have Lewis talk about racism etc or Aston was happy to have Vettel talk about queer issues while they were wearing the team's gear what business is it of the FIA's?
New rules prohibit "the general making and display of political, religious and personal statements or comments notably in violation of the general principle of neutrality promoted by the FIA under its Statutes” without prior permission. While it remains to be seen how stringently this gets enforced it feels like, as-worded, it could be used to basically prohibit anything and everything the FIA hasn't pre-approved, while I'm sure it won't go quite that far it's absurdly broad IMO.
So the obvious stuff is Lewis can't talk about racism any more, but what about his tattoos? I mean they rather obviously make clear religious statements no? Presumably those rainbow helmets that various drivers have used for LGBT+ support will be banned etc.
This brings us back full circle to Ben's original comments in that Monaco interview where he complained about drivers "imposing their beliefs" - I don't think drivers should be expected to speak out on issues, for those like Max who just want to turn up and drive that's fine and dandy but for those that do I'd vigorously defend their right to do so. Their human beings not FIA puppets and I think people can understand that when they express their views they're expressing their views, people might liken it to having your freedom to express views limited when you're representing your employer - but the FIA doesn't employ these guys, the teams do. If Mercedes is happy to have Lewis talk about racism etc or Aston was happy to have Vettel talk about queer issues while they were wearing the team's gear what business is it of the FIA's?
I'm all for it myself. I want to watch motor racing, not some lecture from whatever it's fashionable for celeb drivers to push at the moment.
If you are doing your duties on race weekend then keep it neutral or on topic of racing. If you're doing one of the many press interviews out side the race weekend, then fill your boots.
If you are doing your duties on race weekend then keep it neutral or on topic of racing. If you're doing one of the many press interviews out side the race weekend, then fill your boots.
KaraK said:
If Mercedes is happy to have Lewis talk about racism etc or Aston was happy to have Vettel talk about queer issues while they were wearing the team's gear what business is it of the FIA's?
AIUI, the FIA's rules apply to FIA sanctioned events. Grand Prix press conferences, podium, post-race/qualifying interviews, etc.
If a driver were to speak at a team event away from track, they can say what they like.
eccles said:
I'm all for it myself. I want to watch motor racing, not some lecture from whatever it's fashionable for celeb drivers to push at the moment.
If you are doing your duties on race weekend then keep it neutral or on topic of racing. If you're doing one of the many press interviews out side the race weekend, then fill your boots.
I see this line (or a variation on it) trotted out a lot - but really how many "lectures" were you getting from the drivers during race weekends? How much does it actually impact the neutral "I'm just watching racing" viewer if a driver turns up at the paddock on a rainbow bike or has a BLM t-shirt on in the paddock?If you are doing your duties on race weekend then keep it neutral or on topic of racing. If you're doing one of the many press interviews out side the race weekend, then fill your boots.
Like you I tune in for the racing, so I essentially ignore all the other stuff and, at least in my experience, that's not been particularly difficult to do. So I guess I don't really understand when fans complain about it. I get why the FIA can get their knickers in a twist - after all having drivers speak out on things like human rights in Qatar or Saudi etc is inconvenient when you're having a GP there but is it really a problem for the viewer?
Muzzer79 said:
Terminator X said:
All sounds very Big Brother, doubt it can be enforced.
TX.
The FIA run Grand Prixs in the same way that FIFA run football.TX.
Look at how football teams were prevented from wearing rainbow armbands at the World Cup.
It very much can be enforced.
TX.
I can understand why the FIA would want to restrict what is said / done during their events, as they are trying to sell their product to various countries and want control over how it is perceived and all that business fluff.
Do I agree with it? Not one bit. I felt some pride in F1 as a sport with some of the actions taken by the drivers in places like Qatar and Saudi etc.
I'm of the mind that if "the West" (as self-designated world police) want to change the way "the Middle East" (for want of a better collective noun) operates to bring it in line with their "correct" viewpoint, then it's far better to go there and represent their way of doing things, to organise races for women, show support for LGBTQ+, have multi-cultural / multi-gendered teams and show these countries what is possible and what exists outside of their regime, as opposed to just blocking them out of everything and leaving them to get on with it because they're "wrong".
Do I understand the mentality behind insisting that during event coverage sportspeople only talk about the sport and event in question? Sort of, from a cold logical standpoint, but I really struggle to see how it can be infuriating enough to merit going off on one about it on the internet / down the pub. I keep coming back to the interpretation that it's something the viewer doesn't agree with and so their response is to get angry about it, at which point I really lose a lot of respect / sympathy for their viewpoint.
Do I agree with it? Not one bit. I felt some pride in F1 as a sport with some of the actions taken by the drivers in places like Qatar and Saudi etc.
I'm of the mind that if "the West" (as self-designated world police) want to change the way "the Middle East" (for want of a better collective noun) operates to bring it in line with their "correct" viewpoint, then it's far better to go there and represent their way of doing things, to organise races for women, show support for LGBTQ+, have multi-cultural / multi-gendered teams and show these countries what is possible and what exists outside of their regime, as opposed to just blocking them out of everything and leaving them to get on with it because they're "wrong".
Do I understand the mentality behind insisting that during event coverage sportspeople only talk about the sport and event in question? Sort of, from a cold logical standpoint, but I really struggle to see how it can be infuriating enough to merit going off on one about it on the internet / down the pub. I keep coming back to the interpretation that it's something the viewer doesn't agree with and so their response is to get angry about it, at which point I really lose a lot of respect / sympathy for their viewpoint.
So it is perfectly fine for F1 to go to places like Bahrain, China, Saudi countries with very questionable human rights, yet if a driver wears an armband without telling someone he gets into trouble! Are you kidding?
This is what happens when you allow countries with questionable rights to sportwash, they eventually start to make their own sets of rules that have to be listened to., as they are paying top dollar to sportwash.
Within reason drivers should be allowed to do whatever they want, most if it makes little difference as people do not listen to petulant multi millionaire sports people, I certainly do not about things like this.
But it sets a more worrying precedent, about how these countries can eventually start to run sport and makes it's own rules, it is no real shock that the man running the FIA is at the controls, and this happens.
This is what happens when you allow countries with questionable rights to sportwash, they eventually start to make their own sets of rules that have to be listened to., as they are paying top dollar to sportwash.
Within reason drivers should be allowed to do whatever they want, most if it makes little difference as people do not listen to petulant multi millionaire sports people, I certainly do not about things like this.
But it sets a more worrying precedent, about how these countries can eventually start to run sport and makes it's own rules, it is no real shock that the man running the FIA is at the controls, and this happens.
LukeBrown66 said:
So it is perfectly fine for F1 to go to places like Bahrain, China, Saudi countries with very questionable human rights, yet if a driver wears an armband without telling someone he gets into trouble! Are you kidding?
This is what happens when you allow countries with questionable rights to sportwash, they eventually start to make their own sets of rules that have to be listened to., as they are paying top dollar to sportwash.
Within reason drivers should be allowed to do whatever they want, most if it makes little difference as people do not listen to petulant multi millionaire sports people, I certainly do not about things like this.
But it sets a more worrying precedent, about how these countries can eventually start to run sport and makes it's own rules, it is no real shock that the man running the FIA is at the controls, and this happens.
I don't often agree with what you post, and possibly we've reached a similar conclusion for different reasons and in a different spirit, but fundamentally, I agree with you, so thought it worth saying as much This is what happens when you allow countries with questionable rights to sportwash, they eventually start to make their own sets of rules that have to be listened to., as they are paying top dollar to sportwash.
Within reason drivers should be allowed to do whatever they want, most if it makes little difference as people do not listen to petulant multi millionaire sports people, I certainly do not about things like this.
But it sets a more worrying precedent, about how these countries can eventually start to run sport and makes it's own rules, it is no real shock that the man running the FIA is at the controls, and this happens.
It should be a case of F1 is X, and if you want to host a race, you have to accept X as it is. Just because your country's leadership insists on Y, does not mean F1 incorporates enough of Y to be acceptable to you, it means you accept X as part of hosting an F1 race, or you can FRO.
This sort of compromise to me reduces the justification for going to countries with poor human rights records, as an integral part of the justification is to demonstrate the benefits of good human rights.
To go full straw man argument, are they next going to ban women from working in the teams to keep all the hosts happy?
Terminator X said:
Muzzer79 said:
Terminator X said:
All sounds very Big Brother, doubt it can be enforced.
TX.
The FIA run Grand Prixs in the same way that FIFA run football.TX.
Look at how football teams were prevented from wearing rainbow armbands at the World Cup.
It very much can be enforced.
TX.
MCBrowncoat said:
Liberty have already expressed they are worried the FIA is damaging F1's reputation, so why don't they just f
k the FIA off?
The FIA own Formula One.k the FIA off? They lease the commercial rights to Liberty, but they do own it.
Liberty could set up their own championship which, provided FIA safety standards are adhered to, the FIA would have to approve. But it couldn't be called F1. Which would mean they spent a lot of money for a brand they can't use.
I think it’s very regrettable.
Only fearful or weak institutions seek to restrict what people can say. It’s the move of people who are insecure - they don’t want to hear criticism or things that make them uncomfortable. It’s the nice of weak leaders - who think they cannot improve.
If I were a driver, I think I’d be wearing a blank ‘factory’ white helmet instead of the rainbow ones at all the Middle East events.
Not painting a helmet isn’t political, after all, is it?
Only fearful or weak institutions seek to restrict what people can say. It’s the move of people who are insecure - they don’t want to hear criticism or things that make them uncomfortable. It’s the nice of weak leaders - who think they cannot improve.
If I were a driver, I think I’d be wearing a blank ‘factory’ white helmet instead of the rainbow ones at all the Middle East events.
Not painting a helmet isn’t political, after all, is it?
eccles said:
I'm all for it myself. I want to watch motor racing, not some lecture from whatever it's fashionable for celeb drivers to push at the moment.
If you are doing your duties on race weekend then keep it neutral or on topic of racing. If you're doing one of the many press interviews out side the race weekend, then fill your boots.
Is it reasonable to impose your beliefs - that you don’t want to hear the views of sportspeople on x, y or z - on those people? If you are doing your duties on race weekend then keep it neutral or on topic of racing. If you're doing one of the many press interviews out side the race weekend, then fill your boots.
Why is your right not to have them speak about whatever they want to speak about more important than their right to say whatever they want? What are the grounds for restricting their freedom like this?
In this situation, if you don’t want to hear the views of people on telly, the proportionate response is to switch off the television. Not to support the prevention of people from being able to talk about their beliefs.
Edited by GiantCardboardPlato on Tuesday 20th December 14:52
eccles said:
I'm all for it myself. I want to watch motor racing, not some lecture from whatever it's fashionable for celeb drivers to push at the moment.
If you are doing your duties on race weekend then keep it neutral or on topic of racing. If you're doing one of the many press interviews out side the race weekend, then fill your boots.
Is it reasonable to impose your beliefs - that you don’t want to hear the views of sportspeople on x, y or z - on those people? If you are doing your duties on race weekend then keep it neutral or on topic of racing. If you're doing one of the many press interviews out side the race weekend, then fill your boots.
Why is your right not to have them speak about whatever they want to speak about more important than their right to say whatever they want? What are the grounds for restricting their freedom like this?
In this situation, if you don’t want to hear the views of people on telly, the proportionate response is to switch off the television. Not to support the prevention of people from being able to talk about their beliefs.
Edited by GiantCardboardPlato on Tuesday 20th December 15:24
I don't necessarily agree with how it's being handled and I'm not one of these "drivers should stick to driving" types.
But I can see the logic in not giving people free rein to promote whatever causes they want on the FIA's forum.
After all; one man's freedom statement is another man's tirade.
You need to remember aswell that if you allow one to do it, you allow everyone to do it.
What if we had a Qatari driver who chose to promote his country's views on homosexuality? Or a Russian driver who wore a shirt thanking the invading army in Ukraine?
As a sport, you can't pick and choose which politics are allowed and which aren't, so it can be best to just not talk about any of them and stay neutral.
But I can see the logic in not giving people free rein to promote whatever causes they want on the FIA's forum.
After all; one man's freedom statement is another man's tirade.
You need to remember aswell that if you allow one to do it, you allow everyone to do it.
What if we had a Qatari driver who chose to promote his country's views on homosexuality? Or a Russian driver who wore a shirt thanking the invading army in Ukraine?
As a sport, you can't pick and choose which politics are allowed and which aren't, so it can be best to just not talk about any of them and stay neutral.
KaraK said:
eccles said:
I'm all for it myself. I want to watch motor racing, not some lecture from whatever it's fashionable for celeb drivers to push at the moment.
If you are doing your duties on race weekend then keep it neutral or on topic of racing. If you're doing one of the many press interviews out side the race weekend, then fill your boots.
I see this line (or a variation on it) trotted out a lot - but really how many "lectures" were you getting from the drivers during race weekends? How much does it actually impact the neutral "I'm just watching racing" viewer if a driver turns up at the paddock on a rainbow bike or has a BLM t-shirt on in the paddock?If you are doing your duties on race weekend then keep it neutral or on topic of racing. If you're doing one of the many press interviews out side the race weekend, then fill your boots.
Like you I tune in for the racing, so I essentially ignore all the other stuff and, at least in my experience, that's not been particularly difficult to do. So I guess I don't really understand when fans complain about it. I get why the FIA can get their knickers in a twist - after all having drivers speak out on things like human rights in Qatar or Saudi etc is inconvenient when you're having a GP there but is it really a problem for the viewer?
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