Wet race solution
Discussion
Is there one? With it seemingly being too much spray and too wet and then straight to inters what can be done?
I would look at effectively some sort of fia mudguards universal spec that gets bolted ontop of the wheelnut fixing.
Or is it unsolvable with modern knowledge of aero over old school slower cars that had more mechanical grip?
I would look at effectively some sort of fia mudguards universal spec that gets bolted ontop of the wheelnut fixing.
Or is it unsolvable with modern knowledge of aero over old school slower cars that had more mechanical grip?
The MotoGp from Thailand last week saw the Moto2 bikes racing in atrocious conditions...... They did stop the race 2/3rds of the way through, but the amount of standing water was terrible.
There was no waiting for the rain to stop, or waiting for the track to dry. They whacked some rain tyres on and got on with it.
I know a bike cuts through the water better, but they also only have two wheels so can crash more easily and it's a much higher risk of the rider actually being hurt, but what happened was that the riders rode to the conditions until the bikes were aqua-planning...
F1 has ultra-wet tyres, just let them run and race on them. Sort the men out from the boys....
There was no waiting for the rain to stop, or waiting for the track to dry. They whacked some rain tyres on and got on with it.
I know a bike cuts through the water better, but they also only have two wheels so can crash more easily and it's a much higher risk of the rider actually being hurt, but what happened was that the riders rode to the conditions until the bikes were aqua-planning...
F1 has ultra-wet tyres, just let them run and race on them. Sort the men out from the boys....
It was touched on last week by one of the analysts that one of the reasons we don’t see much racing in the wet is because the full wet is a bit of a crap tyre. It is basically only suitable for following the safety car until conditions are good enough for inters.
Also, I’m guessing the wider tyres introduced in 2017 create more spray, and perhaps the ground effect cars make this even worse.
Also, I’m guessing the wider tyres introduced in 2017 create more spray, and perhaps the ground effect cars make this even worse.
HustleRussell said:
TheDeuce said:
These days that makes that person culpable if there were a nasty incident.
Does it? That seems like a guess. One can see it now
"Driver killed in wet race because incompetent race control didn't wave red flag"
I think you have stumbled onto something there...So many ill-informed posts on this thread.
The capability of the wet tyres is not the problem.
The blame game is not the problem.
Comparing it to bikes is loony.
The problem is that it's impossible to see through the spray and no-one wants to see an F1 driver die on live TV.
How is that so hard to understand?
It's a sport, not a gladiator contest.
And it's 2022, not 1962.
The capability of the wet tyres is not the problem.
The blame game is not the problem.
Comparing it to bikes is loony.
The problem is that it's impossible to see through the spray and no-one wants to see an F1 driver die on live TV.
How is that so hard to understand?
It's a sport, not a gladiator contest.
And it's 2022, not 1962.
HustleRussell said:
TheDeuce said:
These days that makes that person culpable if there were a nasty incident.
Does it? That seems like a guess. In my view the primary reason rain is more likely to cause delays these days is risk aversion. There appeared to be a step change when Charlie passed away - I suppose that's natural though.
oyster said:
The problem is that it's impossible to see through the spray and no-one wants to see an F1 driver die on live TV.
How is that so hard to understand?
It's a sport, not a gladiator contest.
And it's 2022, not 1962.
I do love a wet race, the unpredictability of it adds to the excitement, but (reluctantly) I would have to agree:How is that so hard to understand?
It's a sport, not a gladiator contest.
And it's 2022, not 1962.
Zetec-S said:
oyster said:
The problem is that it's impossible to see through the spray and no-one wants to see an F1 driver die on live TV.
How is that so hard to understand?
It's a sport, not a gladiator contest.
And it's 2022, not 1962.
I do love a wet race, the unpredictability of it adds to the excitement, but (reluctantly) I would have to agree:How is that so hard to understand?
It's a sport, not a gladiator contest.
And it's 2022, not 1962.
TheDeuce said:
None of the new guard at race control want to be the one that says 'its fine, let's race'. These days that makes that person culpable if there were a nasty incident.
Blame blame culture.
This!Blame blame culture.
The savagery of the pitch forks that were waved at the FIA and race director in 2021 has given rise to a massively risk averse leadership of the sport.
No one seems to be volunteering to take tough calls, and get the racing going.
On a tangent, I do miss not being able to hear the chatter between principles and race directors that we enjoyed last year. It's a valuable insight into an aspect of the sport that fans could benefit from
oyster said:
So many ill-informed posts on this thread.
The capability of the wet tyres is not the problem.
The blame game is not the problem.
Comparing it to bikes is loony.
The problem is that it's impossible to see through the spray and no-one wants to see an F1 driver die on live TV.
How is that so hard to understand?
It's a sport, not a gladiator contest.
And it's 2022, not 1962.
It IS a sport contested between Gladiators!!! That's why we watch it. We want to see the best car control, the best skill and the best machines. Spray has ALWAYS been a problem. It always will, but it never stopped anyone before... seems to just be a new thing to moan about. The capability of the wet tyres is not the problem.
The blame game is not the problem.
Comparing it to bikes is loony.
The problem is that it's impossible to see through the spray and no-one wants to see an F1 driver die on live TV.
How is that so hard to understand?
It's a sport, not a gladiator contest.
And it's 2022, not 1962.
And most deaths in F1(not that there's been many), even before this new fear of the rain, i'd hazard at guess, occurred in the dry!
JmatthewB said:
It was touched on last week by one of the analysts that one of the reasons we don’t see much racing in the wet is because the full wet is a bit of a crap tyre. It is basically only suitable for following the safety car until conditions are good enough for inters.
Also, I’m guessing the wider tyres introduced in 2017 create more spray, and perhaps the ground effect cars make this even worse.
Is it not more like, they don't let them race until the track is ready for inters?Also, I’m guessing the wider tyres introduced in 2017 create more spray, and perhaps the ground effect cars make this even worse.
super7 said:
oyster said:
So many ill-informed posts on this thread.
The capability of the wet tyres is not the problem.
The blame game is not the problem.
Comparing it to bikes is loony.
The problem is that it's impossible to see through the spray and no-one wants to see an F1 driver die on live TV.
How is that so hard to understand?
It's a sport, not a gladiator contest.
And it's 2022, not 1962.
It IS a sport contested between Gladiators!!! That's why we watch it. We want to see the best car control, the best skill and the best machines. Spray has ALWAYS been a problem. It always will, but it never stopped anyone before... seems to just be a new thing to moan about. The capability of the wet tyres is not the problem.
The blame game is not the problem.
Comparing it to bikes is loony.
The problem is that it's impossible to see through the spray and no-one wants to see an F1 driver die on live TV.
How is that so hard to understand?
It's a sport, not a gladiator contest.
And it's 2022, not 1962.
And most deaths in F1(not that there's been many), even before this new fear of the rain, i'd hazard at guess, occurred in the dry!
Of course there were occasional ballsy moves made too.. It might have been the case that for most drivers the sensible option was caution and to hope the track dried, but if a driver in contention for a title or who knew they could be if they get one over on a rival was feeling brave, they could risk a short 'driving blind' (they know the track layout and can see the barriers either side still) blast down a straight and get a pass made that their opponent would never see coming.
So really very heavy rain caused more uneventful running than excitement, although now of course the clips we re-watch are only the exciting ones. I'm not sure if they could realistically get away with allowing it these days, sooner or later there would be a nasty incident and the finger of blame would be pointed, it always is - at least indirectly by the press. I'm also fairly certain most teams, most of the time, are OK with the risk aversion now they're cost cap limited. It's the same for everyone so they're probably pretty happy to sit and wait it out, the race director will be aware of their preferences too.
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