Selling House - Part of my rear garden is unregistered land!
Discussion
Has anyone ever had this situation, or any advice?
Currently selling my house, the buyers solicitors have flagged an issue regarding a chunk of unregistered land that is my back garden. I've been here for 10 years, and the house has been in the family for 30+. When I bought, nothing was ever flagged (Not sure why, I assume it wasn't as easy to see the neighbouring outlines back in 2012, but I'm speculating). The fence line has always been the same.
|https://thumbsnap.com/tX76aAP[/url]
Red outlines are the land registry detail, the blue lines are the fence lines between all the properties. The diamond indicates the unregistered land.
As you can see, most of the houses in the road, the fences extend straight from the rear of the houses, it appears that most peoples boundaries are not inline with the land registry. My issue is the chunk of unregistered land in my garden, and it appears my connected neighbour has stolen a triangle of land (They haven't as the fence lines haven't changed in the last 30 years, I can't vouch for the time before then (60s built)) Not sure if its relevant, but the house to the right was built probably 15 years after mine.
Am I knackered here? I understand I couldn't instigate adverse possession as I need to have been here for 12 years. This may also get more complex as the house to the right is also under offer and due to be sold soon. I'm not clear on the possible outcome scenarios are here, as my solicitor has never come across anything like this in 40+ years of practice apparently!
Any thoughts or similar experiences I'm all ears!
Also on the land registry plans there are feint lines that appear to follow the fence lines (see arrow) however not sure that means anything.
Currently selling my house, the buyers solicitors have flagged an issue regarding a chunk of unregistered land that is my back garden. I've been here for 10 years, and the house has been in the family for 30+. When I bought, nothing was ever flagged (Not sure why, I assume it wasn't as easy to see the neighbouring outlines back in 2012, but I'm speculating). The fence line has always been the same.
|https://thumbsnap.com/tX76aAP[/url]Red outlines are the land registry detail, the blue lines are the fence lines between all the properties. The diamond indicates the unregistered land.
As you can see, most of the houses in the road, the fences extend straight from the rear of the houses, it appears that most peoples boundaries are not inline with the land registry. My issue is the chunk of unregistered land in my garden, and it appears my connected neighbour has stolen a triangle of land (They haven't as the fence lines haven't changed in the last 30 years, I can't vouch for the time before then (60s built)) Not sure if its relevant, but the house to the right was built probably 15 years after mine.
Am I knackered here? I understand I couldn't instigate adverse possession as I need to have been here for 12 years. This may also get more complex as the house to the right is also under offer and due to be sold soon. I'm not clear on the possible outcome scenarios are here, as my solicitor has never come across anything like this in 40+ years of practice apparently!
Any thoughts or similar experiences I'm all ears!
Also on the land registry plans there are feint lines that appear to follow the fence lines (see arrow) however not sure that means anything.
Edited by BJPPJB on Tuesday 13th September 07:04
When we sold our last house we had a similar situation, a random chunk not registered. A difference was that it was entirely enclosed by the property.
Anyway it came with the property and went with the property and we paid a token sum for an indemnity policy in case there was any attempt to reclaim.
That was 17 years ago and needless to say there hasn't been anything.
Take professional advice but if it's as you say and draw then your solicitor should be able to resolve it.
Anyway it came with the property and went with the property and we paid a token sum for an indemnity policy in case there was any attempt to reclaim.
That was 17 years ago and needless to say there hasn't been anything.
Take professional advice but if it's as you say and draw then your solicitor should be able to resolve it.
I'm selling my Mum's house at present as she's gone into care. Exactly the same issue - no doubt that its part of the property and always has been but is not registered on hers or the adjoining property title so another 'mistake' by the LR.
We got an inusrance policy for £130 and the sale is about to complete.
We got an inusrance policy for £130 and the sale is about to complete.
BJPPJB said:
Thanks all, sounds like an indemnity policy is the way forward then. Lets see what my solicitor comes back with then, as he didn't seem to mention it as an option when we spoke today.
I think you can only get an indemnity policy to indemnify against the risk of something happening. You know that the land is not registered to you so can't indemnify against this. number2 said:
BJPPJB said:
Thanks all, sounds like an indemnity policy is the way forward then. Lets see what my solicitor comes back with then, as he didn't seem to mention it as an option when we spoke today.
I think you can only get an indemnity policy to indemnify against the risk of something happening. You know that the land is not registered to you so can't indemnify against this. I’m going through the same thing
You can’t take out insurance against unregistered land, you can get the LR to give it to you if it’s pretty straight forward like mine and yours appears to be, however you need to make sure you use a specialist solicitor to deal with this, I’m learning the hard way that just any bold conveyancer will not do.
If I had have had the new guys first time round my situation would have been dealt with in about 4 weeks, I’m now months into it due to piss poor solicitors who generally haven’t got a clue
You can’t take out insurance against unregistered land, you can get the LR to give it to you if it’s pretty straight forward like mine and yours appears to be, however you need to make sure you use a specialist solicitor to deal with this, I’m learning the hard way that just any bold conveyancer will not do.
If I had have had the new guys first time round my situation would have been dealt with in about 4 weeks, I’m now months into it due to piss poor solicitors who generally haven’t got a clue
number2 said:
BJPPJB said:
Thanks all, sounds like an indemnity policy is the way forward then. Lets see what my solicitor comes back with then, as he didn't seem to mention it as an option when we spoke today.
I think you can only get an indemnity policy to indemnify against the risk of something happening. You know that the land is not registered to you so can't indemnify against this. Foss62 said:
number2 said:
BJPPJB said:
Thanks all, sounds like an indemnity policy is the way forward then. Lets see what my solicitor comes back with then, as he didn't seem to mention it as an option when we spoke today.
I think you can only get an indemnity policy to indemnify against the risk of something happening. You know that the land is not registered to you so can't indemnify against this. But here's the crack, you likely have to keep this quiet from your neighbours. Do NOT mention this to them.
I had a very similar issue - a chunk of land in my garden was unregistered even though the fence hadn't been moved at any time. Only when I was selling, did I realise there was an issue - never came up when I purchased 14 years previously.
My solicitor advised me to apply for adverse possession. I had to swear a Statutory Declaration in front of another solicitor and provide as much documentary/photographic evidence to prove that the boundary had not moved at all.
I found photos of my children playing in the garden from toddler stage to much older showing the fences in situ. I also downloaded images of google over as many years as possible. This was sent with the application to the Land Registry.
LR arranged for a Ordnance Surveyor to do a site visit. They then submitted a report to the LR. LR write to neighbouring properties/businesses to advise that an application for adverse possession had been made and invited any objections to be submitted within 20 days. After the 20 days had passed (with no objections) the Land Registry granted the adverse possession. Considering the land was within my boundary and land-locked, I would have been surprised if any objections were raised. This took around 3 months to complete.
You may have only owned for 10 years, but you said it had been in the family before that. Is it possible that the previous owner would be prepared to also swear a Statutory Declaration for the period that they owned?
My solicitor advised me to apply for adverse possession. I had to swear a Statutory Declaration in front of another solicitor and provide as much documentary/photographic evidence to prove that the boundary had not moved at all.
I found photos of my children playing in the garden from toddler stage to much older showing the fences in situ. I also downloaded images of google over as many years as possible. This was sent with the application to the Land Registry.
LR arranged for a Ordnance Surveyor to do a site visit. They then submitted a report to the LR. LR write to neighbouring properties/businesses to advise that an application for adverse possession had been made and invited any objections to be submitted within 20 days. After the 20 days had passed (with no objections) the Land Registry granted the adverse possession. Considering the land was within my boundary and land-locked, I would have been surprised if any objections were raised. This took around 3 months to complete.
You may have only owned for 10 years, but you said it had been in the family before that. Is it possible that the previous owner would be prepared to also swear a Statutory Declaration for the period that they owned?
Thanks all some food for thought.
Waylanderwife said:
I had a very similar issue - a chunk of land in my garden was unregistered even though the fence hadn't been moved at any time. Only when I was selling, did I realise there was an issue - never came up when I purchased 14 years previously.
My solicitor advised me to apply for adverse possession. I had to swear a Statutory Declaration in front of another solicitor and provide as much documentary/photographic evidence to prove that the boundary had not moved at all.
I found photos of my children playing in the garden from toddler stage to much older showing the fences in situ. I also downloaded images of google over as many years as possible. This was sent with the application to the Land Registry.
LR arranged for a Ordnance Surveyor to do a site visit. They then submitted a report to the LR. LR write to neighbouring properties/businesses to advise that an application for adverse possession had been made and invited any objections to be submitted within 20 days. After the 20 days had passed (with no objections) the Land Registry granted the adverse possession. Considering the land was within my boundary and land-locked, I would have been surprised if any objections were raised. This took around 3 months to complete.
You may have only owned for 10 years, but you said it had been in the family before that. Is it possible that the previous owner would be prepared to also swear a Statutory Declaration for the period that they owned?
Interesting, Google earth shows the same line going back to about 2007, I also have several photos showing the same line. Unfortunately my grandmother who owned the property passed away in 2011 so no chance of getting anything on that front. My solicitor advised me to apply for adverse possession. I had to swear a Statutory Declaration in front of another solicitor and provide as much documentary/photographic evidence to prove that the boundary had not moved at all.
I found photos of my children playing in the garden from toddler stage to much older showing the fences in situ. I also downloaded images of google over as many years as possible. This was sent with the application to the Land Registry.
LR arranged for a Ordnance Surveyor to do a site visit. They then submitted a report to the LR. LR write to neighbouring properties/businesses to advise that an application for adverse possession had been made and invited any objections to be submitted within 20 days. After the 20 days had passed (with no objections) the Land Registry granted the adverse possession. Considering the land was within my boundary and land-locked, I would have been surprised if any objections were raised. This took around 3 months to complete.
You may have only owned for 10 years, but you said it had been in the family before that. Is it possible that the previous owner would be prepared to also swear a Statutory Declaration for the period that they owned?
The front part of my drive is not in the title for my house. When we bought, seller provided sworn statements demonstrating access for x years (can't remember how long, but enough to secure right of access over it) and they paid for an indemnity for the full value of the house, which was definitely less than £100
Just to close this out, in the end as several of you pointed out, all it took was an indemnity policy to cover the loss of value to the house in the case that someone claimed it.
It took my solicitor 6 weeks to come to the same conclusion as some of you did within 24 hours of me making the original post!
It should have been £95 but the buyers solicitor wasn’t happy with some of the wording. Ended up going through the buyers solicitors for a cheaper policy, but had to pay a £60 admin fee, well worth it just to get the move over the finish line!
Thanks All
It took my solicitor 6 weeks to come to the same conclusion as some of you did within 24 hours of me making the original post!
It should have been £95 but the buyers solicitor wasn’t happy with some of the wording. Ended up going through the buyers solicitors for a cheaper policy, but had to pay a £60 admin fee, well worth it just to get the move over the finish line!
Thanks All
I'm having this issue, terraced house with shared access road at rear. After the shared access road everyone has a bit of land with either small garden or parking spot. All in line with width / rear of houses.
Out of 12 houses just 2 it seems do not have land Registered on deeds. Mine and the first one on the row. When I purchased the prop it was like this and I had a letter from previous owner stating he'd used / had the land for the 12 yrs he'd been at the property.
I've been in prop for 18 years but am now selling. My estate agent and solicitor thought an indemnity would be fine for this. However the buyer wants me to register the land.
Out of 12 houses just 2 it seems do not have land Registered on deeds. Mine and the first one on the row. When I purchased the prop it was like this and I had a letter from previous owner stating he'd used / had the land for the 12 yrs he'd been at the property.
I've been in prop for 18 years but am now selling. My estate agent and solicitor thought an indemnity would be fine for this. However the buyer wants me to register the land.
Ilovejapcrap said:
I'm having this issue, terraced house with shared access road at rear. After the shared access road everyone has a bit of land with either small garden or parking spot. All in line with width / rear of houses.
Out of 12 houses just 2 it seems do not have land Registered on deeds. Mine and the first one on the row. When I purchased the prop it was like this and I had a letter from previous owner stating he'd used / had the land for the 12 yrs he'd been at the property.
I've been in prop for 18 years but am now selling. My estate agent and solicitor thought an indemnity would be fine for this. However the buyer wants me to register the land.
Good luck still waiting for LR 16 months on from completing the purchase of land adjacent to our house to be registered.Out of 12 houses just 2 it seems do not have land Registered on deeds. Mine and the first one on the row. When I purchased the prop it was like this and I had a letter from previous owner stating he'd used / had the land for the 12 yrs he'd been at the property.
I've been in prop for 18 years but am now selling. My estate agent and solicitor thought an indemnity would be fine for this. However the buyer wants me to register the land.
Ilovejapcrap said:
I'm having this issue, terraced house with shared access road at rear. After the shared access road everyone has a bit of land with either small garden or parking spot. All in line with width / rear of houses.
Out of 12 houses just 2 it seems do not have land Registered on deeds. Mine and the first one on the row. When I purchased the prop it was like this and I had a letter from previous owner stating he'd used / had the land for the 12 yrs he'd been at the property.
I've been in prop for 18 years but am now selling. My estate agent and solicitor thought an indemnity would be fine for this. However the buyer wants me to register the land.
Unless you must sell, tell the buyer to jog on and take your solicitor's advice (not that of the estate agent who is not qualified to advise).Out of 12 houses just 2 it seems do not have land Registered on deeds. Mine and the first one on the row. When I purchased the prop it was like this and I had a letter from previous owner stating he'd used / had the land for the 12 yrs he'd been at the property.
I've been in prop for 18 years but am now selling. My estate agent and solicitor thought an indemnity would be fine for this. However the buyer wants me to register the land.
Ilovejapcrap said:
I'm having this issue, terraced house with shared access road at rear. After the shared access road everyone has a bit of land with either small garden or parking spot. All in line with width / rear of houses.
Out of 12 houses just 2 it seems do not have land Registered on deeds. Mine and the first one on the row. When I purchased the prop it was like this and I had a letter from previous owner stating he'd used / had the land for the 12 yrs he'd been at the property.
I've been in prop for 18 years but am now selling. My estate agent and solicitor thought an indemnity would be fine for this. However the buyer wants me to register the land.
Give them an indemnity and a Statutory Declaration and let them register it after purchase - asking you to register it is unreasonable and will unduly delay the purchase. If they refuse I'd suggest they are not serious anyway.Out of 12 houses just 2 it seems do not have land Registered on deeds. Mine and the first one on the row. When I purchased the prop it was like this and I had a letter from previous owner stating he'd used / had the land for the 12 yrs he'd been at the property.
I've been in prop for 18 years but am now selling. My estate agent and solicitor thought an indemnity would be fine for this. However the buyer wants me to register the land.
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