Tuscan as a Supercar performance tool?
Discussion
I happen to be working for a car experience company as an instructor
It’s a combination of old classic and Movie cars and more modern supercar weapons.
We drive them pretty hard but keep revs below say 5500 revs in something like a speed six.
Brakes take a pounding mostly.
My question is would a Tuscan make a decent track car for such events.
They work upto 9 hrs a day with often only a few minutes too cool down between short but often intense runs.
Will they suffer from hot start problems and probably electrical gremlins with the far more complex systems from say my Chimaera with simple dials.
I should talk to Dom Trickett about engines I suppose but do you think a speed six will like being run constantly going from slow speeds to high via a bloke booting it! Like racing cars do,,, it’s a race engine after all.
It’s a car experience so we allow the customers to drive some of the cars at least as hard as there ability allows!
I’ve showed concern at the idea when my boss mentioned it to me so just looking for owners thoughts. Do they hold temperature when standing running for ages in hot weather.
I accept wear will be huge compared to standard use but then it is on all the cars there. Lambo snapped it’s gearbox, ferrari lose gears, McLaren can go into limp mode, electrics play up on all but Audi cars
Half of them struggle to start hot!
The modern American big V8’s go on and on mind! Lol
Anyway more a playful thought than anything but what do you guys think.
Thanks in advance for any answers to this very interesting question. I clearly want a Tvr to drive at work so let’s be positive but realistic.
It’s a combination of old classic and Movie cars and more modern supercar weapons.
We drive them pretty hard but keep revs below say 5500 revs in something like a speed six.
Brakes take a pounding mostly.
My question is would a Tuscan make a decent track car for such events.
They work upto 9 hrs a day with often only a few minutes too cool down between short but often intense runs.
Will they suffer from hot start problems and probably electrical gremlins with the far more complex systems from say my Chimaera with simple dials.
I should talk to Dom Trickett about engines I suppose but do you think a speed six will like being run constantly going from slow speeds to high via a bloke booting it! Like racing cars do,,, it’s a race engine after all.
It’s a car experience so we allow the customers to drive some of the cars at least as hard as there ability allows!
I’ve showed concern at the idea when my boss mentioned it to me so just looking for owners thoughts. Do they hold temperature when standing running for ages in hot weather.
I accept wear will be huge compared to standard use but then it is on all the cars there. Lambo snapped it’s gearbox, ferrari lose gears, McLaren can go into limp mode, electrics play up on all but Audi cars
Half of them struggle to start hot!
The modern American big V8’s go on and on mind! Lol
Anyway more a playful thought than anything but what do you guys think.
Thanks in advance for any answers to this very interesting question. I clearly want a Tvr to drive at work so let’s be positive but realistic.
Edited by Classic Chim on Tuesday 29th March 09:39
Edited by Classic Chim on Thursday 31st March 17:51
Dom would be the first port of call for me.
What he doesn’t know about these engines isn’t worth knowing.
For what it’s worth, I think that it’s a basically robust design, given a terrible rep by TVR skimping on the original spec for certain components.
And compared to exotica like Ferrari’s it will cost relative peanuts to fix if something does let’s go.
What he doesn’t know about these engines isn’t worth knowing.
For what it’s worth, I think that it’s a basically robust design, given a terrible rep by TVR skimping on the original spec for certain components.
And compared to exotica like Ferrari’s it will cost relative peanuts to fix if something does let’s go.
swisstoni said:
Dom would be the first port of call for me.
What he doesn’t know about these engines isn’t worth knowing.
For what it’s worth, I think that it’s a basically robust design, given a terrible rep by TVR skimping on the original spec for certain components.
And compared to exotica like Ferrari’s it will cost relative peanuts to fix if something does let’s go.
Yes I think that’s very true. Hmmm, to my mind the suspension etc are made for the job. What he doesn’t know about these engines isn’t worth knowing.
For what it’s worth, I think that it’s a basically robust design, given a terrible rep by TVR skimping on the original spec for certain components.
And compared to exotica like Ferrari’s it will cost relative peanuts to fix if something does let’s go.
It’s more the electrics I’m slightly less confident about.
QBee said:
You said Tuscan, but my mind immediately went to the late 80s and onwards Tuscan race cars.
Rv8, AJP or even LS engined, just adapt to take a second seat. Raw, robust, and not overly expensive.
And most people over 40 saw loads of them racing every weekend on the TV in the 90s.
Kind of perfect for the job.Rv8, AJP or even LS engined, just adapt to take a second seat. Raw, robust, and not overly expensive.
And most people over 40 saw loads of them racing every weekend on the TV in the 90s.
No roof! We still run in the rain and you’d need to wear helmets. Tough job!
Better in a nice road car for us instructors although I drove a Caterham this weekend using mostly hand signals and it was a blast. I did lots of passenger laps so round the bends with the rear skipping out and just so small and quick. I loved the bloody thing. Almost like a single seater in size. Tiny. I just loved it and circulated in seconds rather than minutes
All the instructors seemed to be impressed. Hah. Lots of high fives and smiles and customers thanking me beyond there wildest dreams,,,
I think a Tvr of almost any description would do just about the same thing.
It’s the noise and vibrations, everyone enjoys the cars that are analogue so much more as there adrenaline is through the roof and they coo at the direct feel and sounds.
It’s time to talk to the engine man I think.
I seem to think or remember someone has done this? A white one that ran abroad in hot weather at a private track possibly. Same type of business. It was for sale on pistonheads and linked through Facebook explaining its history and life with a low price tag. I am pretty confident I’ve not made that up.
DAKOTAstorm said:
I seem to think or remember someone has done this? A white one that ran abroad in hot weather at a private track possibly. Same type of business. It was for sale on pistonheads and linked through Facebook explaining its history and life with a low price tag. I am pretty confident I’ve not made that up.
That is correct, there was a white one which was out in Gran Canaria and was part of a super car track day experience. I have a feeling it was brought back to Blighty, though could be wrong on that bit…I think you need to speak to Ian at Sportmotive, he has a project on the bubble which sounds right up your racetrack!
Tuscan Challenge bodies on Evolution chassis with either Rover V8 or LS power would be perfect for your venture. You could even buy one and go it alone as a business idea.
Initial cost might be higher than buying a tatty Tuscan SP6 road car, but the ongoing maintenance would be peanuts, and crash damage wouldn't command std TVR bodyshell prices either.
That's definitely the way i would go for a fun track / entertainment car. There's even a hardtop option!
Tuscan Challenge bodies on Evolution chassis with either Rover V8 or LS power would be perfect for your venture. You could even buy one and go it alone as a business idea.
Initial cost might be higher than buying a tatty Tuscan SP6 road car, but the ongoing maintenance would be peanuts, and crash damage wouldn't command std TVR bodyshell prices either.
That's definitely the way i would go for a fun track / entertainment car. There's even a hardtop option!
spitfire4v8 said:
I think you need to speak to Ian at Sportmotive, he has a project on the bubble which sounds right up your racetrack!
Tuscan Challenge bodies on Evolution chassis with either Rover V8 or LS power would be perfect for your venture. You could even buy one and go it alone as a business idea.
Initial cost might be higher than buying a tatty Tuscan SP6 road car, but the ongoing maintenance would be peanuts, and crash damage wouldn't command std TVR bodyshell prices either.
That's definitely the way i would go for a fun track / entertainment car. There's even a hardtop option!
Or just a tatty old Chim because if it’s not tatty when we buy it it sure will be when we have finished with it. Tuscan Challenge bodies on Evolution chassis with either Rover V8 or LS power would be perfect for your venture. You could even buy one and go it alone as a business idea.
Initial cost might be higher than buying a tatty Tuscan SP6 road car, but the ongoing maintenance would be peanuts, and crash damage wouldn't command std TVR bodyshell prices either.
That's definitely the way i would go for a fun track / entertainment car. There's even a hardtop option!
It’s not my venture and I’m sure the people who it may concern are interested in as many people taking up the car as possible. Other than blokes probably at least 40 years old now I doubt many people ( young uns) would even recognise a Tvr race car but I might be wrong.
It’s worth suggesting so thanks for the heads up.
Im pretty sure the boss would enjoy the race car as I would but how many rides you’d sell with that via a website and a few photos is another question entirely.
A tatty Tuscan road car might not sell much either but either way it could be sold fairly easily if it proved to be a failure on the sales or reliability front.
Less risk maybe.
Of course as soon as you mention it has been used as a track car, Tvr know it all’s ( including me ) will probably slate it straight into a scrap yard
So yes a race car might actually hold its value better…..
Thing is I sometimes wear my TVR Racing cap at work and to a man the Instructors all respect what that represents. I think secretly they all want one
Ok now how easy will it be to route a passenger brake and clutch system in a Tvr footwell….
That might be the deciding factor.
If we can have a clutch kids as young as 11 can drive them on small junior tracks which is very popular.
Hmmm not looking very realistic, I’m loosing confidence in the idea.
I’ll talk to the mechanics and see how they would attempt to route such systems and come back to you on that one!
Thanks for the suggestions so far.
Edited by Classic Chim on Thursday 31st March 10:24
Fair points
I think I would be reluctant to use a Tuscan SP6 as a track day tool .. it's going to be harder on the car than your typical occasional track day. it's not the engine I'd be worried about - the little 3.6 in the t350 racer is powerful and reliable - but I'd be more worried about the digidash and the electronic boxes taking a pounding from hard springs/dampers and sawtooth kerbs and other body / electrics related issues which would bring the day to a close.
But yes I take your point that the car has to be desirable enough for people to want to go in it. A tuscan racer with a hard top is a very attractive car though in its own right .. pics from t'interweb of 450nick's old car which i think looks fab
.
I think I would be reluctant to use a Tuscan SP6 as a track day tool .. it's going to be harder on the car than your typical occasional track day. it's not the engine I'd be worried about - the little 3.6 in the t350 racer is powerful and reliable - but I'd be more worried about the digidash and the electronic boxes taking a pounding from hard springs/dampers and sawtooth kerbs and other body / electrics related issues which would bring the day to a close.
But yes I take your point that the car has to be desirable enough for people to want to go in it. A tuscan racer with a hard top is a very attractive car though in its own right .. pics from t'interweb of 450nick's old car which i think looks fab
.
Hell yeah. If you advertise it as the biggest risk you will take in years that cars likely to be a big hit.
Imagine how hot it’s going to get in there…
Marvellous car.
Clutches,, oh yes. Are they progressive and light or typically hard and a short biting point on speed six cars?
How readily available are they?
I only know RV8 cars really.
Ok that’s pretty much what I told the gaffer Joolz. Damn
Ok sorry to mention this on here but what about a Cerbera… that's got to be the obvious one to use thinking about it. It’s the one that caused the world to sit up and take notice. Speed six version.
What’s not to like?
Brummies car
Now your talking lol
Imagine how hot it’s going to get in there…
Marvellous car.
Clutches,, oh yes. Are they progressive and light or typically hard and a short biting point on speed six cars?
How readily available are they?
I only know RV8 cars really.
Ok that’s pretty much what I told the gaffer Joolz. Damn
Ok sorry to mention this on here but what about a Cerbera… that's got to be the obvious one to use thinking about it. It’s the one that caused the world to sit up and take notice. Speed six version.
What’s not to like?
Brummies car
Now your talking lol
Edited by Classic Chim on Thursday 31st March 10:38
Edited by Classic Chim on Thursday 31st March 10:39
Classic Chim said:
Hell yeah. If you advertise it as the biggest risk you will take in years that cars likely to be a big hit.
Imagine how hot it’s going to get in there…
Marvellous car.
Clutches,, oh yes. Are they progressive and light or typically hard and a short biting point on speed six cars?
How readily available are they?
I only know RV8 cars really.
Ok that’s pretty much what I told the gaffer Joolz. Damn
Ok sorry to mention this on here but what about a Cerbera… that's got to be the obvious one to use thinking about it. It’s the one that caused the world to sit up and take notice. Speed six version.
What’s not to like?
Brummies car
Now your talking lol
Alun, Sp6 clutches are very progressive. I've done a couple of track days and current clutch has been in for about 50K miles. I guess like any clutch, they will burn out with repeated 'racing starts'.
My engine has now done ~ 50K miles too, after rebuild to 4.3 at Str8Six.
I'd agree, .The most fragile elements are the electrics.
Nick
Imagine how hot it’s going to get in there…
Marvellous car.
Clutches,, oh yes. Are they progressive and light or typically hard and a short biting point on speed six cars?
How readily available are they?
I only know RV8 cars really.
Ok that’s pretty much what I told the gaffer Joolz. Damn
Ok sorry to mention this on here but what about a Cerbera… that's got to be the obvious one to use thinking about it. It’s the one that caused the world to sit up and take notice. Speed six version.
What’s not to like?
Brummies car
Now your talking lol
Alun, Sp6 clutches are very progressive. I've done a couple of track days and current clutch has been in for about 50K miles. I guess like any clutch, they will burn out with repeated 'racing starts'.
My engine has now done ~ 50K miles too, after rebuild to 4.3 at Str8Six.
I'd agree, .The most fragile elements are the electrics.
Nick
Edited by Classic Chim on Thursday 31st March 10:38
Edited by Classic Chim on Thursday 31st March 10:39
I know that you are only working for the company as an instructor, and that it is not your company, but I think the company has bigger issues than whether to have a TVR on the fleet.
There are quite a lot of negative reviews. I think that is probably putting off customers, rather than the car choices. Looking at some of the reviews, I think more money needs to be spent on the existing fleet. The booking and refund process needs attention, as does the admin on the day, and people don't like the (hard) upselling.
I don't understand why you would want a modern TVR on the fleet. Some people want to drive/be photographed with a classic car, and some people want to do the same with a supercar. A modern TVR to most of the customers is neither.
TVRs were never a byword for reliability, and you are just risking adding to the bad reviews.
When Jonathan Palmer first opened Bedford Autodrome, on the Audis that they were running, they were going through a set of brake pads twice a day, and a set of discs once a day. That punishment is inflicted on the whole car.
There are quite a lot of negative reviews. I think that is probably putting off customers, rather than the car choices. Looking at some of the reviews, I think more money needs to be spent on the existing fleet. The booking and refund process needs attention, as does the admin on the day, and people don't like the (hard) upselling.
I don't understand why you would want a modern TVR on the fleet. Some people want to drive/be photographed with a classic car, and some people want to do the same with a supercar. A modern TVR to most of the customers is neither.
TVRs were never a byword for reliability, and you are just risking adding to the bad reviews.
When Jonathan Palmer first opened Bedford Autodrome, on the Audis that they were running, they were going through a set of brake pads twice a day, and a set of discs once a day. That punishment is inflicted on the whole car.
LucyP said:
I know that you are only working for the company as an instructor, and that it is not your company, but I think the company has bigger issues than whether to have a TVR on the fleet.
There are quite a lot of negative reviews. I think that is probably putting off customers, rather than the car choices. Looking at some of the reviews, I think more money needs to be spent on the existing fleet. The booking and refund process needs attention, as does the admin on the day, and people don't like the (hard) upselling.
I don't understand why you would want a modern TVR on the fleet. Some people want to drive/be photographed with a classic car, and some people want to do the same with a supercar. A modern TVR to most of the customers is neither.
TVRs were never a byword for reliability, and you are just risking adding to the bad reviews.
When Jonathan Palmer first opened Bedford Autodrome, on the Audis that they were running, they were going through a set of brake pads twice a day, and a set of discs once a day. That punishment is inflicted on the whole car.
Have you seen what they are already running?There are quite a lot of negative reviews. I think that is probably putting off customers, rather than the car choices. Looking at some of the reviews, I think more money needs to be spent on the existing fleet. The booking and refund process needs attention, as does the admin on the day, and people don't like the (hard) upselling.
I don't understand why you would want a modern TVR on the fleet. Some people want to drive/be photographed with a classic car, and some people want to do the same with a supercar. A modern TVR to most of the customers is neither.
TVRs were never a byword for reliability, and you are just risking adding to the bad reviews.
When Jonathan Palmer first opened Bedford Autodrome, on the Audis that they were running, they were going through a set of brake pads twice a day, and a set of discs once a day. That punishment is inflicted on the whole car.
Not exactly Landcruisers.
Yes I have and I don't see how a Tuscan fits into the list at all. It's an obscure car to most people. You get 3 miles for your money, and most of the locations are hardly Spa or Silverstone. What can you do in 3 miles? And if you don't pay an extra £25, and you damage it, then the day has cost you another £5k of insurance excess.
It's for people who just want to say they have been in "Bond's" DB5, or have driven a Lamborghini. 3 miles, take some photos, all over Instagram. Job done. The last thing they want is for people to not know what car they drove.
The pricing structure reflects that. £39 for a 1970s Corvette. I bet that doesn't get many bookings. £79 for a current McLaren 720S. I bet that does.
Where would you pitch a TVR? Same are the obscure-to-most-people Supra? £49. That's a lot of potential problems and running costs, for £49 a go.
It's for people who just want to say they have been in "Bond's" DB5, or have driven a Lamborghini. 3 miles, take some photos, all over Instagram. Job done. The last thing they want is for people to not know what car they drove.
The pricing structure reflects that. £39 for a 1970s Corvette. I bet that doesn't get many bookings. £79 for a current McLaren 720S. I bet that does.
Where would you pitch a TVR? Same are the obscure-to-most-people Supra? £49. That's a lot of potential problems and running costs, for £49 a go.
Some chap linked these guys the other day for a T350. I'm not affiliated in any way, just gives you a steer on price bracket.
https://www.trackdays.co.uk/driving-experience/tvr...
I went for a red letter day in a T350 for my 21st I think many years ago; which led to me buying a Cerb a few years later. I'd definitely have a crack at it again for that kind of price but yes, definitely more appealing if bundled as part of a multiple car track experience.
Actually seems significantly cheaper than what I paid for similar event 10+ years ago. I'm sure they were all in excess of 100 quid at the time.
https://www.trackdays.co.uk/driving-experience/tvr...
I went for a red letter day in a T350 for my 21st I think many years ago; which led to me buying a Cerb a few years later. I'd definitely have a crack at it again for that kind of price but yes, definitely more appealing if bundled as part of a multiple car track experience.
Actually seems significantly cheaper than what I paid for similar event 10+ years ago. I'm sure they were all in excess of 100 quid at the time.
LucyP said:
Yes I have and I don't see how a Tuscan fits into the list at all. It's an obscure car to most people. You get 3 miles for your money, and most of the locations are hardly Spa or Silverstone. What can you do in 3 miles? And if you don't pay an extra £25, and you damage it, then the day has cost you another £5k of insurance excess.
It's for people who just want to say they have been in "Bond's" DB5, or have driven a Lamborghini. 3 miles, take some photos, all over Instagram. Job done. The last thing they want is for people to not know what car they drove.
The pricing structure reflects that. £39 for a 1970s Corvette. I bet that doesn't get many bookings. £79 for a current McLaren 720S. I bet that does.
Where would you pitch a TVR? Same are the obscure-to-most-people Supra? £49. That's a lot of potential problems and running costs, for £49 a go.
And that’s why you are on here talking out your ! when someone else is selling 1500 rides a day. The Mclarens often get customers taking 18 laps at a time. As if I came on here to talk about the company I work for. In Britain people will complain at anything as you clearly demonstrate almost every post you serve up. On some events 25 quid gets you 3 extra laps in any car on the day,,,,, a bargain in anyone’s books. I often sell 6 at a go! It's for people who just want to say they have been in "Bond's" DB5, or have driven a Lamborghini. 3 miles, take some photos, all over Instagram. Job done. The last thing they want is for people to not know what car they drove.
The pricing structure reflects that. £39 for a 1970s Corvette. I bet that doesn't get many bookings. £79 for a current McLaren 720S. I bet that does.
Where would you pitch a TVR? Same are the obscure-to-most-people Supra? £49. That's a lot of potential problems and running costs, for £49 a go.
It’s very reasonably priced when you think about it and yes the company have their issues at a live event but actually process hundreds of people a day and most enjoy it. Some are very clever at complaining. Sadly the older cars are going to be subject to change If anyone of them fails, this causes upset but what can we do. We offer drives in other cars if this sad situation happens but it’s a reality of such an event. Car people understand and often end up driving something they end up preferring. Maybe they were booked for the Cortina but it overheats so end up driving a full on racecar Jag E type with roll gage or indeed a famous race winning 1965 Mustang GT350 race car that’s won tonnes of prestigious races an the states, came here in 2014 and came 3rd at the classic at Silverstone,,, That sorts out the men from the boys in one corner, aggresive camber settings and no power steering,,
Or just drive the 1975 Aston V8 Vantage and waft around.
It’s easy to be negative.
Edited by Classic Chim on Thursday 31st March 17:05
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