Just come back from Ynyshir
Discussion
Just got back from Ynyshir in Wales managed to get a late cancellation. It just got its second star the day before we arrived. Grat driving roads to get there and the place is on another level. Thirty course tasting menu we had front row seats in front of the pass its once in a life time experience and highly recommend it.
I'm sure it was an amazing experience and GW is definitely up there with many modern chefs, and I have used a few of his techniques. But he does seem do be driven by them as opposed to driven by flavour followed by the techniques to achive it.
My shio koji and hibachi grill are back in the cupboard for the moment.
Don;t get me wrong, the guys got some damn good ideas but he does seem to be searching for things.
My shio koji and hibachi grill are back in the cupboard for the moment.
Don;t get me wrong, the guys got some damn good ideas but he does seem to be searching for things.
I’ve enjoyed GW’s hospitality a few times. His food is stunning. The tasting menu is c30 courses, but a few mouthfuls and spread over an evening. A meal at Ynyshir is a gastronomic treat and an entertaining evening. It is not light on the wallet, but this quality shouldn’t be.
Gareth is a serious petrol head too.
Gareth is a serious petrol head too.
Couldnt agree more, Ynyshir is an amazing experience.
We had a similar last minute cancellation booking.
The food is next level, easy to see why it now has 2 stars, well deserved.
Its great to see a few restaurants like this get the recognition, rather than just the very traditional places. Times are changing!
We had a similar last minute cancellation booking.
The food is next level, easy to see why it now has 2 stars, well deserved.
Its great to see a few restaurants like this get the recognition, rather than just the very traditional places. Times are changing!
Peak Emperor's New Clothes.
At £500 a go for dinner plus B&B, no PHer who'd shelled out for that is going to say that it was s
t.
I was sent pictures which I can't share because they aren't mine, but if you can imagine an uncooked brain served on a charity shop ashtray; dandruff served on a concrete bollard, you'd be on the money.
With another 28 courses to follow, all of which looked like something I'd drag out of the pig bin, or deposit in a medical sample tube.
The eye must eat first, and that's just lazy cheffing. I don't care how many years you'd salt-aged that chicken, before brazing it with a welder's blowtorch.
All the most unfortunate stereotypes about Michelin-starred dining, sadly deepened.
The one redeeming feature being the 1986 Chateau Cheval Blanc on the menu at £1,000. The last Sotheby's wine auction sold that at £1,936.
At £500 a go for dinner plus B&B, no PHer who'd shelled out for that is going to say that it was s
t.I was sent pictures which I can't share because they aren't mine, but if you can imagine an uncooked brain served on a charity shop ashtray; dandruff served on a concrete bollard, you'd be on the money.
With another 28 courses to follow, all of which looked like something I'd drag out of the pig bin, or deposit in a medical sample tube.
The eye must eat first, and that's just lazy cheffing. I don't care how many years you'd salt-aged that chicken, before brazing it with a welder's blowtorch.
All the most unfortunate stereotypes about Michelin-starred dining, sadly deepened.
The one redeeming feature being the 1986 Chateau Cheval Blanc on the menu at £1,000. The last Sotheby's wine auction sold that at £1,936.
I've eaten here and it's incredible. As a chef myself it was at the top of my list for a while.
The garbage spouted in the post above me, what can I say, you pay your money, go or don't, nobody is forcing you to and if you go into it like it's just food then you're approaching it completely the wrong way.
The garbage spouted in the post above me, what can I say, you pay your money, go or don't, nobody is forcing you to and if you go into it like it's just food then you're approaching it completely the wrong way.
TIGA84 said:
Never done anything serious multi course like the above or El Bulli etc.
Does it really all come together or after course 21 or so does it get a bit tiresome, it just seems like a very long canape party to me or is it more of an event with the DJ etc?
Its an interesting question, some people will do it purely for the food, the courses will compliment each other whilst following a reasonably reliable format, appetisers leading to heavier main headline dishes then onto deserts, each dish can simply be a mouthful. Does it really all come together or after course 21 or so does it get a bit tiresome, it just seems like a very long canape party to me or is it more of an event with the DJ etc?
For others it will be about the wine, some diners expect or demand an exquisite / rare wine choice so each restaurant will have to cater for that market.
Personally, i enjoy the theatre of the experience, the way the staff orchestrate the evening, the ebb and flow as the evening proceeds can be enthralling, courses can be served from the server team, management and the chefs themselves, along with a description and a suggestion towards consumption.
The service at 2 & 3 Michelin star establishments should be nothing short of outstanding.
Check out Alexander The Guest on Youtube, he has a review of Ynyshir and (in my humble) the UK's best restaurant L'enclume.
Essarell said:
TIGA84 said:
Never done anything serious multi course like the above or El Bulli etc.
Does it really all come together or after course 21 or so does it get a bit tiresome, it just seems like a very long canape party to me or is it more of an event with the DJ etc?
Its an interesting question, some people will do it purely for the food, the courses will compliment each other whilst following a reasonably reliable format, appetisers leading to heavier main headline dishes then onto deserts, each dish can simply be a mouthful. Does it really all come together or after course 21 or so does it get a bit tiresome, it just seems like a very long canape party to me or is it more of an event with the DJ etc?
For others it will be about the wine, some diners expect or demand an exquisite / rare wine choice so each restaurant will have to cater for that market.
Personally, i enjoy the theatre of the experience, the way the staff orchestrate the evening, the ebb and flow as the evening proceeds can be enthralling, courses can be served from the server team, management and the chefs themselves, along with a description and a suggestion towards consumption.
The service at 2 & 3 Michelin star establishments should be nothing short of outstanding.
Check out Alexander The Guest on Youtube, he has a review of Ynyshir and (in my humble) the UK's best restaurant L'enclume.
What you typically end up with is:
A choice of wine pairing options
The cheaper ones being much lower grade wines than I’d usually drink at home: the odd one can be interesting but by and large not so much
The most expensive ones being coravined and/or less than stellar vintages
Vintages served too young
And that’s before you consider the enormous margins. Just for a laugh I looked at Le Manoir’s list again to see if I could find their wine pairings. Sadly couldn’t, but without getting into exotica did note that Taittinger Comtes ‘06 is now £860 a botttle… before gratuity/service charge. That’s less than £200 retail, less in volume. 2019 Pontet Canet: £530… circa £100 retail (and, whilst drinkable, arguably nowhere near ready).
Sometimes restaurants effectively force you towards their pairings by keeping the menu a surprise. Not that you have many options (other than perhaps a bottle of champagne) if there are just two of you when the menus jump around a great deal through red/white wine candidates.
As for description of the dishes (and wines). This is where the quality of the team really matters. Some places manage to build rapport and get the right balance, others can detract from the overall experience.
Although MrsLT and I enjoy a few meals out, some of the most memorable dinners have involved private chefs and being able to raid our own cellar.
Edited by LooneyTunes on Friday 14th March 09:14
i'm now in the "eaten here" category", maybe a brash qualification given the category restaurants like Ynyshir reside in. Is it reviewed as an experience? would it be better to look at it from the perpesctive of a chef? a sommelier / front of house point of view? this is where I'm really stuck. I've had the experience back and forth in my head for a few days and i still haven't settled but I'll try and explain my views and how i feel about our trip to Wales.
Firstly, we live walking distance to Newcastle city centre, a city truly blessed with an incredible restaurant scene, we have some of the UK's best restaurants with Terry Laybourne & the 21 Group, Kenny Atkinson, Alex Nietosvuori & Anna Hedworth all providing an example of incredible cooking and hospitality, these chefs and of course the incredible teams that make up the associated establishments are my benchmark. An evening should be engaging, fulfilling, educational and of course as you say your goodbyes at the end of the evening you should be longing to return.
So on to Wales and Gareth, Ynyshir sits in a stunning spot, we were blessed by the weather and surprisingly traffic free roads, you turn off the main road and thru the gates, up a gravel drive with lamps lighting the way. The restaurant / accommodation sit's there dark and moody, a warm welcome and we are shown to our room, its an old building, awkward layout as you'd expect but straight away there's music, pretty cool, TV set to 6 music and a nice hand written note on the table.
they have circa 14 acres perfect for an explore, were asked to be ready for 5;45 in the bar, not a problem, i do like a bar.
I will state that at each step the service was excellent, the talent pool can't be at its deepest in far Welsh Wales but the guys were great, now obviously we're in for a long night so two beers ordered ( they have Brown Ale) and Rory calls at our table to go thru the wine options, no set wine pairing as such but no problem customising any drinks permutation, we went with a Btl white and then red, these were added to during the meal with a couple of really good suggestions form Rory and the other young lady who covered the bar. Glasses were never empty.
Now, here's the part where the experience gets a tad odd or maybe not. We didn't get to our table till just after 7, we were kind of kept in limbo, in the intervening hour and a quarter we did get to visit the aging room in the garden and a description of some of the more specialised ingredients.
Finally into the dining room, it's small, seating 18? with a side "industry" table where two diners who cant see the kitchen can watch everything on a big screen TV.
We were sat facing forward, two tables (for two) just behind me would have two diners sat with their backs to the kitchen and all the action, if i'd been seated here i would not have been happy at all.
Now the tempo has picked up, DJ's on it, music is kinda funky, pretty cool, sound quality is excellent, it's loud but you can still have a conversation and of course hear as all the dishes are introduced at the table. Volume is up and down as is the tempo, it does add to the experience but strangely the DJ pretty much ignores the room, you do feel a bit voyeuristic as no matter what you do you're looking straight at him, he didn't interact with the room or come to our table, or any of the tables around us, he did briefly chat with the couple sat at the table right next to him.
The food comes metronomically fast, Gareth & his left hand man Patrick are hard at it, a team of others assist and the food is (finally) here, 29 courses, its 60 / 40 fish to meat. Now, only a proper chef can truly review such a menu, all i have are my personal views, i loved every course, nothing heavy or laborious, everything burst with flavour, cutlery is spoon / chopsticks apart from a couple of courses where we were given blacksmith hewn knife and fork.
we finally finished around 11:30pm, for the final course we were seated back in the bar.
i never got to meet Gareth, he didn't bother to visit the tables. Now, I appreciate he was (generally) a busy lad and after all those hours at the stove was probably in need of a freshen up. However, it would have taken nothing to say hi, he did have time during the evening but seemed to stand in the kitchen with just a moody look on his face, a bit odd. It did sound as though there was a bit of a meet and greet taking place after most of us had left the restaurant area, maybe my wife and I were just not worthy.
To some up, would i go return? no, figuratively speaking, I've seen the magic trick and the reveal so no need to go back, would i recommend Ynyshir to a friend? no, it just wasn't good enough, i don't even believe its worth it's 2 Michelin Stars. it has all the right ingredients but at our visit the overall execution was poor, as an example at around 9:30 pm there was someone (presumably staff but not part of the service) stood in the kitchen area next to Gareth just nonchalantly playing on his phone for 20 minutes! wtf is that all about?
Well that's that done, an experience indeed but sadly not quite the one we were expecting. Next on our list is a ride up to Strathlachlan to see Pam @ Inver Restaurant, then a run down to Padstow to the Seafood Restaurant as it celebrates its 50th Anniversary.
Firstly, we live walking distance to Newcastle city centre, a city truly blessed with an incredible restaurant scene, we have some of the UK's best restaurants with Terry Laybourne & the 21 Group, Kenny Atkinson, Alex Nietosvuori & Anna Hedworth all providing an example of incredible cooking and hospitality, these chefs and of course the incredible teams that make up the associated establishments are my benchmark. An evening should be engaging, fulfilling, educational and of course as you say your goodbyes at the end of the evening you should be longing to return.
So on to Wales and Gareth, Ynyshir sits in a stunning spot, we were blessed by the weather and surprisingly traffic free roads, you turn off the main road and thru the gates, up a gravel drive with lamps lighting the way. The restaurant / accommodation sit's there dark and moody, a warm welcome and we are shown to our room, its an old building, awkward layout as you'd expect but straight away there's music, pretty cool, TV set to 6 music and a nice hand written note on the table.
they have circa 14 acres perfect for an explore, were asked to be ready for 5;45 in the bar, not a problem, i do like a bar.
I will state that at each step the service was excellent, the talent pool can't be at its deepest in far Welsh Wales but the guys were great, now obviously we're in for a long night so two beers ordered ( they have Brown Ale) and Rory calls at our table to go thru the wine options, no set wine pairing as such but no problem customising any drinks permutation, we went with a Btl white and then red, these were added to during the meal with a couple of really good suggestions form Rory and the other young lady who covered the bar. Glasses were never empty.
Now, here's the part where the experience gets a tad odd or maybe not. We didn't get to our table till just after 7, we were kind of kept in limbo, in the intervening hour and a quarter we did get to visit the aging room in the garden and a description of some of the more specialised ingredients.
Finally into the dining room, it's small, seating 18? with a side "industry" table where two diners who cant see the kitchen can watch everything on a big screen TV.
We were sat facing forward, two tables (for two) just behind me would have two diners sat with their backs to the kitchen and all the action, if i'd been seated here i would not have been happy at all.
Now the tempo has picked up, DJ's on it, music is kinda funky, pretty cool, sound quality is excellent, it's loud but you can still have a conversation and of course hear as all the dishes are introduced at the table. Volume is up and down as is the tempo, it does add to the experience but strangely the DJ pretty much ignores the room, you do feel a bit voyeuristic as no matter what you do you're looking straight at him, he didn't interact with the room or come to our table, or any of the tables around us, he did briefly chat with the couple sat at the table right next to him.
The food comes metronomically fast, Gareth & his left hand man Patrick are hard at it, a team of others assist and the food is (finally) here, 29 courses, its 60 / 40 fish to meat. Now, only a proper chef can truly review such a menu, all i have are my personal views, i loved every course, nothing heavy or laborious, everything burst with flavour, cutlery is spoon / chopsticks apart from a couple of courses where we were given blacksmith hewn knife and fork.
we finally finished around 11:30pm, for the final course we were seated back in the bar.
i never got to meet Gareth, he didn't bother to visit the tables. Now, I appreciate he was (generally) a busy lad and after all those hours at the stove was probably in need of a freshen up. However, it would have taken nothing to say hi, he did have time during the evening but seemed to stand in the kitchen with just a moody look on his face, a bit odd. It did sound as though there was a bit of a meet and greet taking place after most of us had left the restaurant area, maybe my wife and I were just not worthy.
To some up, would i go return? no, figuratively speaking, I've seen the magic trick and the reveal so no need to go back, would i recommend Ynyshir to a friend? no, it just wasn't good enough, i don't even believe its worth it's 2 Michelin Stars. it has all the right ingredients but at our visit the overall execution was poor, as an example at around 9:30 pm there was someone (presumably staff but not part of the service) stood in the kitchen area next to Gareth just nonchalantly playing on his phone for 20 minutes! wtf is that all about?
Well that's that done, an experience indeed but sadly not quite the one we were expecting. Next on our list is a ride up to Strathlachlan to see Pam @ Inver Restaurant, then a run down to Padstow to the Seafood Restaurant as it celebrates its 50th Anniversary.
Edited by Essarell on Tuesday 18th March 21:45
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