Is my father getting scammed?
Is my father getting scammed?
Author
Discussion

Dedshott

Original Poster:

203 posts

142 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Hi all,

I will preface this by saying I am not very financially savvy - but my father has invested for decades.

He currently has a stock of valuable wine invested in a storage unit in Birmingham. We are based in the South East.

He has been offered a deal - brokered by Williams and Gray (they check out as far as I can see) - which will be very profitable. It involves a sale of the wine to China.

To complete the sale he has to pay for 3 x service of payment gateways - which will cost around £17000 - which he has to pay up front. He has asked me to stump up some of this cash - that's where I come in.

In a letter from Williams and Gray that this money will be refunded 3 days after the completion of the sale.

I have a letter in which they are underwriting and guaranteeing this cost.

They will also honour and guarantee the total sum of the sale.

Anyway - as I say - I am not very savvy in these matters - but the upfront cost for secure payment - and quite a large sum - has sent alarm bells ringing for me. Has anyone has any experience of this?

Thanks in advance!



Edited by Dedshott on Sunday 6th December 09:40

Wombat3

15,094 posts

236 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
If it walks like a duck.....

Dedshott

Original Poster:

203 posts

142 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
I should add that he initially reported it to Action Fraud - who have reported they can find no evidence of wrongdoing - but he doesn't have much faith in them...

RATATTAK

19,409 posts

219 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
How much is the second upfront payment ? There's sure to be one. And then a third (for VAT). etc. etc.etc.

SS2.

14,712 posts

268 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Dedshott said:
I should add that he initially reported it to Action Fraud - who have reported they can find no evidence of wrongdoing - but he doesn't have much faith in them...
If in doubt, just walk away.

dingg

4,561 posts

249 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
If you have something worth buying you shouldn't need to stump up 17k to achieve the sale.

I'd be very wary.

If it's this company? who are brokering the deal

https://www.wineinvestmentfund.com/latest-figures/...


Looks like they had 3 or 4 good years at the beginning of the business then crappola since.

DanL

6,589 posts

295 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Feels like this: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance-fee_scam

But I know nothing about the sector, and maybe this is just how they work. Assuming his wine is stored with them, maybe he needs to call them direct to confirm it’s legit and this is how they work, and take it from there?

However - why won’t the business take this fee out of the transaction at the end as a fee on completion, rather than needing it paying in advance?

As an aside, if he’s asking you to pay it, why doesn’t he have the cash to hand? Has he already been taken for other fees? frown

Pothole

34,367 posts

312 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Give this well-established firm a ring:

https://www.justerinis.com/wine-services/selling-y...


softtop

3,172 posts

277 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
If they have a viable business and we are only talking three days, I would expect my broker to be doing their part and paying the £17,000. I would avoid the sale.

Eric Mc

125,779 posts

295 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Sounds 100% scam to me.

Non-regulated investment - so no comeback of it all goes wrong (which sounds like a very likely outcome to me).

Simpo Two

92,963 posts

295 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Dedshott said:
Hi all,

I will preface this by saying I am not very financially savvy - but my father has invested for decades.

He currently has a stock of valuable wine invested in a storage unit in Birmingham. We are based in the South East.

He has been offered a deal - brokered by Williams and Gray (they check out as far as I can see) - which will be very profitable. It involves a sale of the wine to China.

To complete the sale he has to pay for 3 x service of payment gateways - which will cost around £17000 - which he has to pay up front.
Just stop there. No point reading any further.

Burwood

18,718 posts

276 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
100% scam-. for starters you are not dealing with the company purported. 'Hi, i'm Bill Gates and i'd like to send you some money'.

It is a fee advance scam! Run away

Ham_and_Jam

3,724 posts

127 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Classic scam.

1. We promise to make you more money than anyone else.

2. To achieve this we need you to send us a lot of money.

Stop, and engage your brain. You already know it sounds fishy, but you (or your fathers) want to make a quick buck is clouding your rational thinking. I guarantee if you procede, the moment you click the payment button, you will get a sick feeling in the bottom of stomach.

johnnyBv8

2,482 posts

221 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Don't do this! If the wine has a decent value, you will be able to achieve this without paying extortionate fees upfront.

Dedshott

Original Poster:

203 posts

142 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Agreed. I suppose it helps to see it written down to see the obvious sometimes.

Since posting I have delved deeper in the companies involved - and both are established companies who have recently been cloned by scammers in a different 'Carbon Credit' scam.

I think he has sent them some money though.

Ham_and_Jam

3,724 posts

127 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Dedshott said:
Agreed. I suppose it helps to see it written down to see the obvious sometimes.

Since posting I have delved deeper in the companies involved - and both are established companies who have recently been cloned by scammers in a different 'Carbon Credit' scam.

I think he has sent them some money though.
Unfortunately he now may well be on a ‘suckers list’.

As he has succumbed to the scam, he could well be a target of a prolonged and targeted campaign of different scams. Quite oftem his details will be shared / sold to other scammers.

Tell your father to be very careful. They might look and feel very different, but their aim will be to part him with his cash.

98elise

32,748 posts

191 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Burwood said:
100% scam-. for starters you are not dealing with the company purported. 'Hi, i'm Bill Gates and i'd like to send you some money'.

It is a fee advance scam! Run away
Agree. If you have something valuable to sell, why are you the one paying money up front?

BawlBag

208 posts

70 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Anything up front should be a walkaway

thebraketester

15,822 posts

168 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
I’ll do it for £10k

Louis Balfour

28,176 posts

252 months

Sunday 6th December 2020
quotequote all
Dedshott said:
Hi all,

I will preface this by saying I am not very financially savvy - but my father has invested for decades.

He currently has a stock of valuable wine invested in a storage unit in Birmingham. We are based in the South East.

He has been offered a deal - brokered by Williams and Gray (they check out as far as I can see) - which will be very profitable. It involves a sale of the wine to China.

To complete the sale he has to pay for 3 x service of payment gateways - which will cost around £17000 - which he has to pay up front. He has asked me to stump up some of this cash - that's where I come in.

In a letter from Williams and Gray that this money will be refunded 3 days after the completion of the sale.

I have a letter in which they are underwriting and guaranteeing this cost.

They will also honour and guarantee the total sum of the sale.

Anyway - as I say - I am not very savvy in these matters - but the upfront cost for secure payment - and quite a large sum - has sent alarm bells ringing for me. Has anyone has any experience of this?

Thanks in advance!



Edited by Dedshott on Sunday 6th December 09:40
https://redd-monitor.org/2020/10/23/the-carbon-credit-registry-carbon-credit-reformatting-scam-continues-a-company-calling-itself-williams-gray-is-running-a-recovery-room-scam/