The Great Post Office Trial
Discussion
For anyone interested in hearing how the law can (eventually) be used to help people who have been disgracefully treated this R4 series is brilliant listening - https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000jf7j
For those who haven't heard about it the programme tells the story of how the Post Office persecuted and prosecuted hundreds of sub-postmasters for theft / false accounting, when all along they knew that the errors were caused by the dodgy `Horizon' software that they’d imposed on them.
Some of the stories are almost unbelievable. People were sent to jail and had their lives destroyed because of it. The Post Office, who have their own private prosecution service, lied to and bullied these poor people for years on end, and it was only because a few remarkably brave individuals finally decided to take them on that it was exposed.
The outcome was a massive David and Goliath civil trial, which ended with the Post Office caving in and admitting defeat. They have now agreed to pay £58m in settlement of the claims, and it was a truly great day for that vague concept known as justice.
There's a lot of listening, but it's well worth it.
If you don't have the time or the inclination to listen to the whole series there's a potted version on Panorama - https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m000gpbv/pan...
For those who haven't heard about it the programme tells the story of how the Post Office persecuted and prosecuted hundreds of sub-postmasters for theft / false accounting, when all along they knew that the errors were caused by the dodgy `Horizon' software that they’d imposed on them.
Some of the stories are almost unbelievable. People were sent to jail and had their lives destroyed because of it. The Post Office, who have their own private prosecution service, lied to and bullied these poor people for years on end, and it was only because a few remarkably brave individuals finally decided to take them on that it was exposed.
The outcome was a massive David and Goliath civil trial, which ended with the Post Office caving in and admitting defeat. They have now agreed to pay £58m in settlement of the claims, and it was a truly great day for that vague concept known as justice.
There's a lot of listening, but it's well worth it.
If you don't have the time or the inclination to listen to the whole series there's a potted version on Panorama - https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m000gpbv/pan...
Or if you prefer reading, and a real sense of the thing unfolding:
https://www.postofficetrial.com/2019/01/articles.h...
https://www.postofficetrial.com/2019/01/articles.h...
ClaphamBoxS said:
Private Eye have also been covering this for quite a while....it does beggar belief that the bosses have walked away so far with no seeming concern or accountability...
Welcome to the perverse world of IT projects, where success is measured in dates hit and whether it was implemented rather than the benefit or capability of the product implemented. C-level executives in this space are little boys clubs of them and their immediate subordinates who traipse from failure to failure, with the top man having the gift of the gab but otherwise the personality of a weak tea and the capabilities of an armless, legless turd.Pegscratch said:
ClaphamBoxS said:
Private Eye have also been covering this for quite a while....it does beggar belief that the bosses have walked away so far with no seeming concern or accountability...
Welcome to the perverse world of IT projects, where success is measured in dates hit and whether it was implemented rather than the benefit or capability of the product implemented. C-level executives in this space are little boys clubs of them and their immediate subordinates who traipse from failure to failure, with the top man having the gift of the gab but otherwise the personality of a weak tea and the capabilities of an armless, legless turd.The way the Postmasters Union behaved was shameful.
carinaman said:
Pegscratch said:
ClaphamBoxS said:
Private Eye have also been covering this for quite a while....it does beggar belief that the bosses have walked away so far with no seeming concern or accountability...
Welcome to the perverse world of IT projects, where success is measured in dates hit and whether it was implemented rather than the benefit or capability of the product implemented. C-level executives in this space are little boys clubs of them and their immediate subordinates who traipse from failure to failure, with the top man having the gift of the gab but otherwise the personality of a weak tea and the capabilities of an armless, legless turd.The way the Postmasters Union behaved was shameful.
John Locke said:
Appalling; why aren't those who perjured themselves not in gaol?
Gaol?..laughs hysterically...behave...not only are they not in gaol they in most cases just move on to the next big company without a care in the world.As a former Halifax employee i was heartened to see Andy Hornsby managed to get another job running Corals..and now he runs The Resturant Group.... and that after bleating in front of a Commons committee that he too had suffered from the collapse of the Halifax as he had lost share options worth millions...!
Any Postmasters can be reassured that any inquiry wil be as swift as the one that looked into the collapse of the bank...in 2008....it’s still not ben released ....
The main job of these self professed Masters of the Universe is to cut jobs...i remember the chairman of Lloyd’s laughing at a journalist who suggested the merger of Lloyd’s and Halifax would cost 50000 jobs...he was right...think it’s currently around 80000....
Pop into a bank with a shot gun and a balaclava and if caught expect to be spending a good few years sharing a cell with Knuckles o Toole...bankrupt it,lose tens of thousands of people’s jobs and result?...move along there nothing to see here...
And the latest joy?...Dido Harding former boss of Talk Talk who were guilty of one of the worst breaches of data protection is now in charge of the Govts Test and trace !,,,
The Spruce Goose said:
my local town one, the owners just disappeared accused on stealing money. What a position to be put in if there were innocent.
Our ex village Postmaster maintains his innocence but pleaded guilty to avoid going to jail. Apparently he’s now appealing on the grounds of coercion. I’ve known the guy for years and very much doubt that he stole any money. If he did God only knows what he did with it, there were no new cars, expensive holidays or other signs of wealth.It does make me incredibly grateful that the retarded decisions of a succession of s
t IT leaders leaves me with nothing more paid than blood, sweat, tears and hours of my life. Years in jail for their activity would probably see me finding myself back there after I was released for making permanent alterations to their life status.
These people should be in jail. Not the people they screwed over.
t IT leaders leaves me with nothing more paid than blood, sweat, tears and hours of my life. Years in jail for their activity would probably see me finding myself back there after I was released for making permanent alterations to their life status.These people should be in jail. Not the people they screwed over.
Hopefully there will be an independent enquiry as people have lost their lives over this.
Journalistic credit should go to Computer Weekly whose investigations began in 2004 after being contacted by an affected postmaster and the cases were regularly updated and brought up over the years even though it seemed a bit leftfield considering the publications usual subject matter.
https://www.computerweekly.com/news/2240089230/Ban...
Journalistic credit should go to Computer Weekly whose investigations began in 2004 after being contacted by an affected postmaster and the cases were regularly updated and brought up over the years even though it seemed a bit leftfield considering the publications usual subject matter.
https://www.computerweekly.com/news/2240089230/Ban...
bad company said:
Why on earth does Paula Vennells (boss of the Post Office at the time) still have her CBE?
Because st leaders repeatedly get away with blaming the people they inherited when they arrived for their failures. It is always a "resistance to change", or a "systemic reluctance to adopt new technologies", or a "failure to adapt to changing requirements". It is never their utter unsuitability for a role that they have bullstted their way into from their last failure.Success at the highest levels of operational technology looks like years - even decades - within the same employer, delivering consistently excellent results with a product or portfolio. Success at C-level technology looks like three year "transformational" stints at different employers, whereby those employers are inevitably struggling after each departure (attributed to their departure, obviously - not their s
t leadership) and with a new opportunity to ruin people's lives ahead of them.It seems more and more these days that the primary requirement to make it to C-Level is the ability to cast an effective reality distortion field around why things are now stter than they were before, why people have been shafted over and gloss over the fact that things no longer work logically/properly.
Below C level it’s a case of being able to do a job very well.
PS: Apologies to any C levels on here who are actually competent and therefore an exception to the above.
tter than they were before, why people have been shafted over and gloss over the fact that things no longer work logically/properly.Below C level it’s a case of being able to do a job very well.
PS: Apologies to any C levels on here who are actually competent and therefore an exception to the above.
untakenname said:
Hopefully there will be an independent enquiry as people have lost their lives over this.
Journalistic credit should go to Computer Weekly whose investigations began in 2004 after being contacted by an affected postmaster and the cases were regularly updated and brought up over the years even though it seemed a bit leftfield considering the publications usual subject matter.
https://www.computerweekly.com/news/2240089230/Ban...
Computer Weekly have a good track record on bringing things like this to the attention of the public, even if it is only those who have an interest in IT - They also were campaigning for the Chinook pilots posthumously accused of negligence when one of the aircraft crashed in Scotland.Journalistic credit should go to Computer Weekly whose investigations began in 2004 after being contacted by an affected postmaster and the cases were regularly updated and brought up over the years even though it seemed a bit leftfield considering the publications usual subject matter.
https://www.computerweekly.com/news/2240089230/Ban...
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff