No 6 speed option
Discussion
Browsing the configurator I notice that there is now no 6 speed option. While I'm not a big fan myself, I know many are, so I'm surprised it's gone. I can only assume that Caterham can no longer get the bits. I wonder if they will now offer the Mazda 6 speed.
Edited by bcr5784 on Sunday 3rd May 12:27
They stopped offering it some time ago. Nothing to do with parts per se I don’t think, just not deemed necessary any more.
It was originally developed to enable the potential of the smaller K engines to be released and isn’t a major advantage with the engines used now, especially the 2.0 ones.
I have a 6 speed in my R400 and enjoy it. It’s especially good on track and is fine on road except for high revs when cruising.
If you’re into long distance touring, which I’m not, it’s probably not as good as a 5 with longer 5th. The ratios on the 6 are very close and even with 220bhp 6th is still about 3800rpm at 70. Makes for instant acceleration but not very relaxed!
Will they fit the Mazda 6 speed? Maybe if it’s no bigger (the 5 is a tight fit) but it’s arguably not needed with such a light car unless you have very little power/torque.
It was originally developed to enable the potential of the smaller K engines to be released and isn’t a major advantage with the engines used now, especially the 2.0 ones.
I have a 6 speed in my R400 and enjoy it. It’s especially good on track and is fine on road except for high revs when cruising.
If you’re into long distance touring, which I’m not, it’s probably not as good as a 5 with longer 5th. The ratios on the 6 are very close and even with 220bhp 6th is still about 3800rpm at 70. Makes for instant acceleration but not very relaxed!
Will they fit the Mazda 6 speed? Maybe if it’s no bigger (the 5 is a tight fit) but it’s arguably not needed with such a light car unless you have very little power/torque.
I heard from caterham they stopped it because of the high cost and low volumes made it uneconomic for Caterham, they had to order in bulk and they run on a low costs basis.
Also, 6 speed is less suited for the torquey Duratec. The mazda 5 is actually a good box with decent ratios. Unfortunately the mazda 6 speed is significantly bigger (i think) and wouldnt fit.
It would be nice if someone did a close ratio gear set for the mazda 5 speed box, that would be worth pursuing
Also, 6 speed is less suited for the torquey Duratec. The mazda 5 is actually a good box with decent ratios. Unfortunately the mazda 6 speed is significantly bigger (i think) and wouldnt fit.
It would be nice if someone did a close ratio gear set for the mazda 5 speed box, that would be worth pursuing
Trackdayguy said:
We bought the last 6 speed caterham had, buy the time it got here to Canada inc shipping it was $6500. OUCH....
5 years ago they charged £2995 (>$5000) EXTRA for the 6 speed, the 5 being included in the basic cost, so £2995 plus whatever the 5 speed cost. I think you didn’t do too badly!
That beggars belief if a 6 speed box isn't available at all. It might be a lightweight vehicle, but for track use you still want to maximise performance by having 6 well spaced ratios.
Going back to a 5 speed only seems like a throwback to the 80s when 6 speed boxes weren't yet available. I'd love a Caterham at some point, but there's no way I'd consider anything other than 6 speeds.
Going back to a 5 speed only seems like a throwback to the 80s when 6 speed boxes weren't yet available. I'd love a Caterham at some point, but there's no way I'd consider anything other than 6 speeds.
Olivera said:
That beggars belief if a 6 speed box isn't available at all. It might be a lightweight vehicle, but for track use you still want to maximise performance by having 6 well spaced ratios.
Going back to a 5 speed only seems like a throwback to the 80s when 6 speed boxes weren't yet available. I'd love a Caterham at some point, but there's no way I'd consider anything other than 6 speeds.
Do you realise the Caterham's 6 speeds are stacked between a long 1st and typical 4th gear? My car does something silly like 45-50mph in 1st but is doing 4000rpm+ in 6th on the motorway.Going back to a 5 speed only seems like a throwback to the 80s when 6 speed boxes weren't yet available. I'd love a Caterham at some point, but there's no way I'd consider anything other than 6 speeds.
I'd be happy with the current 5 speed, especially in the faster cars. When I hired a R300 for a track day at Oulton the 6 speed was fun but eventually it can get tiresome changing gear so often and you wonder if it's slower overall than a 5 speed. I was changing gear about 22-25 times per lap.
sjl1 said:
The mazda 5 is actually a good box with decent ratios. Unfortunately the mazda 6 speed is significantly bigger (i think) and wouldnt fit.
I had to design a 'seven' type car around the Mazda 6-speed, and I can confirm that it's an absolute monster of a thing - much bulkier than the 5-speed.
braddo said:
Olivera said:
That beggars belief if a 6 speed box isn't available at all. It might be a lightweight vehicle, but for track use you still want to maximise performance by having 6 well spaced ratios.
Going back to a 5 speed only seems like a throwback to the 80s when 6 speed boxes weren't yet available. I'd love a Caterham at some point, but there's no way I'd consider anything other than 6 speeds.
Do you realise the Caterham's 6 speeds are stacked between a long 1st and typical 4th gear? My car does something silly like 45-50mph in 1st but is doing 4000rpm+ in 6th on the motorway.Going back to a 5 speed only seems like a throwback to the 80s when 6 speed boxes weren't yet available. I'd love a Caterham at some point, but there's no way I'd consider anything other than 6 speeds.
I'd be happy with the current 5 speed, especially in the faster cars. When I hired a R300 for a track day at Oulton the 6 speed was fun but eventually it can get tiresome changing gear so often and you wonder if it's slower overall than a 5 speed. I was changing gear about 22-25 times per lap.
2nd to 4th are closely stacked and adding more gear changes would just make it slower.
Vimes said:
braddo said:
Olivera said:
That beggars belief if a 6 speed box isn't available at all. It might be a lightweight vehicle, but for track use you still want to maximise performance by having 6 well spaced ratios.
Going back to a 5 speed only seems like a throwback to the 80s when 6 speed boxes weren't yet available. I'd love a Caterham at some point, but there's no way I'd consider anything other than 6 speeds.
Do you realise the Caterham's 6 speeds are stacked between a long 1st and typical 4th gear? My car does something silly like 45-50mph in 1st but is doing 4000rpm+ in 6th on the motorway.Going back to a 5 speed only seems like a throwback to the 80s when 6 speed boxes weren't yet available. I'd love a Caterham at some point, but there's no way I'd consider anything other than 6 speeds.
I'd be happy with the current 5 speed, especially in the faster cars. When I hired a R300 for a track day at Oulton the 6 speed was fun but eventually it can get tiresome changing gear so often and you wonder if it's slower overall than a 5 speed. I was changing gear about 22-25 times per lap.
2nd to 4th are closely stacked and adding more gear changes would just make it slower.
On the road, once your moving the 6 can easily be just used in 2nd 4th and 6th so doesn’t need to be tiresome. Major problem is high revs when cruising.
REALIST123 said:
A 6 speed is definitely better on track IMO. There are certainly corners at, say, Snetterton, where particularly the older standard 5 is noticeably poor.
On the road, once your moving the 6 can easily be just used in 2nd 4th and 6th so doesn’t need to be tiresome. Major problem is high revs when cruising.
For road use (in a K-series supersport) I'd have been happy with a slightly wider spread of ratios, with a 1:1 5th and an o/d 6thOn the road, once your moving the 6 can easily be just used in 2nd 4th and 6th so doesn’t need to be tiresome. Major problem is high revs when cruising.
braddo said:
but eventually it can get tiresome changing gear
What? Are you sure you are in the right place? 
I loved the 6-speeder in my SLR then R500. Personal preference I guess. I don't get the idea that it's tiresome at speed. It's just a number on a dial and a lot of noise. There's a huge amount of noise anyway in a Caterham at 80mph. I can't imagine doing that and not wearing hearing protection anyway. It was a huge step forward from the ford gearbox that was otherwise in use then.
Bert
Also the time of the 6 speed came and went. It started in the time of engine doldrums for Caterham where the 2.0vx was stopping and they hadn't got a decent new engine range. The k-series obviously had huge potential and I presume Rover were keen to do a deal. But the 1400k even though it was brilliant didn't quite do the trick. That was before the rest of the range was available. But the 1400k plus the new in house designed 6 speeder made the mark, it was the secret sauce. I think the road testers at the time absolutely loved it. The 1600 superlight was absolutely the pinnacle of brilliance. Lightness, agility, 6 speed box, the utter brilliance of using the ACB10, Caterham were really on a development roll.
Then Caterham started to push the power upwards. Where 160bhp had previously been the heights above which it was too scary to contemplate came the 190 of the SLR and then the 230 of the R500. All with the same formula. Revvy k, lightweight, 6 speed box.
But then it changed with the demise of the k and the use of the ford engines again and really the story changed much more in favour of mega-power with the Duranail R500 and even more. The 6 speed box wasn't needed for either the secret-sauce story or the actual drivability. With a supercharged Duratec and a mega muscle story, who cared what the gearbox was? It hardly needed any gear changing at all. In fact I have even read of people who don't seem to like changing gear
So it needed a cheaper alternative that was up to the job and didn't cost the earth to make. That's where we are today.
Where next? Time for something new and not this Lotus-esque rehashing of the past and constant special editions for absurd money.
Bert
PS I'm quite sure the nonsense above has more holes than something with a lot of holes. It's only a bit of fun and not an accurate historical portrayal!
Then Caterham started to push the power upwards. Where 160bhp had previously been the heights above which it was too scary to contemplate came the 190 of the SLR and then the 230 of the R500. All with the same formula. Revvy k, lightweight, 6 speed box.
But then it changed with the demise of the k and the use of the ford engines again and really the story changed much more in favour of mega-power with the Duranail R500 and even more. The 6 speed box wasn't needed for either the secret-sauce story or the actual drivability. With a supercharged Duratec and a mega muscle story, who cared what the gearbox was? It hardly needed any gear changing at all. In fact I have even read of people who don't seem to like changing gear
So it needed a cheaper alternative that was up to the job and didn't cost the earth to make. That's where we are today.
Where next? Time for something new and not this Lotus-esque rehashing of the past and constant special editions for absurd money.
Bert
PS I'm quite sure the nonsense above has more holes than something with a lot of holes. It's only a bit of fun and not an accurate historical portrayal!
BertBert said:
braddo said:
but eventually it can get tiresome changing gear
What? Are you sure you are in the right place? 
My comment was in the context of being at the end of a long track day and frankly being tired, wondering if I am wasting energy changing gear so often and going slower than a 5 speed would be. I did a quick bit of rough maths - 25 gear changes per lap, say 10 laps per session (say 20 mins) and doing 8 sessions in the day = 2000 gear changes! I idly wonder if a 5 speeder would have been 10-20% fewer changes.Gassing Station | Caterham | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff